Author Topic: ICAN Frames  (Read 8961 times)

DECIM8

ICAN Frames
« on: January 28, 2015, 03:35:41 PM »
Hi, I have been reading quite a bit on here for several months now. This is my first post.... so, hello.

I have been mostly interested in the information on a squishy 29er. It seems like the IP-036 gets the most attention here in that segment. Probably not in small part because they have some employees that communicate well. The Enduro clones get some talk but I don't think anyone has built one yet? There is some information on the Titan as well but it seems like its quality is suspect? One manufacturer and one bike specifically that didn't seem to have much, if any, info on it was the ICAN AC036. I ran a forum search and came up with nothing at least. ICAN has a MUCH better website than most other manufacturers which seems like a plus, at least on the surface. A couple people have mentioned their wheels and thier HT X6 frame but it is unclear if anyone has actually ordered a frame from them.

Anyway, this is the bike I am talking about. Any information or comments would be appreciated.
http://www.icanbikes.com/html/MTB/29ER_frame/144.html#bk_desc_tab
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00O9VSSU0/ref=cm_cr_ryp_prd_ttl_sol_0

Some random questions.....
All of the geo charts I have seen have a 71° head tube angle and seem to be based off of 100mm of front travel (506mm axle to crown). frankly, I'm looking for something more slack with more travel. I am planning to run a RS Revelation XX fork with G2 geometry set to 120mm. I believe axle to crown it is 528mm on this fork. There are 2 things I am curious about, how will the geometry and frame deal with a G2 fork and how might it deal with upping it to 130mm of travel (538mm A2C).

And on a complete side note.... the verification still thinks its 2014...which is wrong.



Carbon_Dude

Re: ICAN Frames
« Reply #1 on: January 28, 2015, 07:44:22 PM »
I've heard of this seller before.  They have been mentioned on MTBR.com.  The ICAN Website is terrible for me, very slow and if I click on any of the pictures that are on the page you linked, nothing happens.

Doesn't really matter though, their AC036 is exactly the same as an IP-036.  Price is about the same or higher than XMIplay as well.  With all the available options, I'd suggest you talk to a real person like Peter or Bert at XMIplay and make sure you are getting what you want.  Peter provides very good communication and you can even custom order how you would like the frame painted instead of the ICAN graphics that ICAN'T see myself wanting.  Part of the popularity of the Chiners is that they have no graphics which works fine for me and most people.

The IP-036 has about 110mm of travel as it's meant to be a cross country oriented FS frame.  If you are looking to go 130mm of travel, you must be hitting some rough trails with lots of downhill action.  I'd suggest something like a Carbonal Titan from www.carbonality.com, that seems to be more Trail/Enduro oriented.  A little more heavy duty and a little more rear travel.

If you are serious about a IP-036 FS 29er, email Peter or Bert at XMIplay.com.  Good luck and let us know if you have any other questions.
« Last Edit: January 28, 2015, 07:46:23 PM by Carbon_Dude »
2019 Stumpjumper Expert 29/27.5+
2017 Santa Cruz Stigmata
2017 Trek Stache 9.8 (29+)
2016 Specialized Stumpjumper FSR Carbon Comp 6Fattie (27.5+) (Sold)
2016 Trek Stache 9 (29+) w/upgrades (Sold)
2014 -036 Full Suspension Chiner (Sold)
2013 -057 Hardtail Carbon Chiner (Sold)
Atlanta, GA

MTNRCKT

Re: ICAN Frames
« Reply #2 on: January 28, 2015, 09:12:19 PM »
Yep IP036 and AC036 = same frame. So basically, anything you've read for the 036 applies to that ICAN. As for who the original manufacturer is, I think it's Iplay although I could be wrong about that.

Would love to see you build up one of those enduro knock-offs, though! Great looking frames, imo. Guess you would be kinda the guinea pig though seeing as how i haven't seen a single build with one, yet.


« Last Edit: January 28, 2015, 09:13:54 PM by MTNRCKT »

Sitar_Ned

Re: ICAN Frames
« Reply #3 on: January 28, 2015, 09:15:12 PM »
And on a complete side note.... the verification still thinks its 2014...which is wrong.


We only want the smartest members at Chinertown... Congrats on passing the test!  ;D  But seriously, I don't think it tells you specifically which question you got wrong, so that took a bit of problem solving to figure that out.

Anyways.. Fixed. Thanks for letting us know!

Wonder how many members we've lost this year so far?!?  :o
« Last Edit: January 28, 2015, 09:39:23 PM by Sitar_Ned »

Carbon_Dude

Re: ICAN Frames
« Reply #4 on: January 28, 2015, 09:15:34 PM »
Iplay is not a frame mfr, they are a trading company like most of the others you see.  DengFu, Flyxii, HongFu, Yoleo, etc, are all trading companies.  Who the actual manufacturers are is unknown at this point.
2019 Stumpjumper Expert 29/27.5+
2017 Santa Cruz Stigmata
2017 Trek Stache 9.8 (29+)
2016 Specialized Stumpjumper FSR Carbon Comp 6Fattie (27.5+) (Sold)
2016 Trek Stache 9 (29+) w/upgrades (Sold)
2014 -036 Full Suspension Chiner (Sold)
2013 -057 Hardtail Carbon Chiner (Sold)
Atlanta, GA

Izzy

Re: ICAN Frames
« Reply #5 on: January 28, 2015, 09:32:35 PM »
It can be confusing. A lot of companies are trying to apply a few stickers to make the frame look more "branded" or "legit" and charge a few more bucks for them. Same frame. Might as well go with Iplay. Like you said, one of the reasons they've become the go to is because of their involvement in the forums. They realize their reputation is important for future sells and therefore are unlikely to totally leave you hanging if you get a bad product or shipping issues or whatever. Don't get me wrong, you'll still have to try to get their attention sometimes, not saying it's always 5 star service, but because they understand the importance of protecting that rep on the forums, you have a level of assurance/accountability that you can't get with someone like Ican. If Ican ships you a broken (and over priced, it seems) 036 frame you can only go to them to resolve your issue. If they ignore you, don't believe you or whatever - too bad. With Iplay, if you have an issue and contact them and then still feel like you weren't treated fairly, you can come to the forums and have a voice. That's why I order from them, at least.

I can't believe none of the other sellers are smart enough to be involved in the forums. Lucky for Iplay, I guess.
« Last Edit: January 28, 2015, 09:34:48 PM by Izzy »

DECIM8

Re: ICAN Frames
« Reply #6 on: January 29, 2015, 12:26:40 AM »
Thank you everyone for the replies.

Would love to see you build up one of those enduro knock-offs, though! Great looking frames, imo. Guess you would be kinda the guinea pig though seeing as how i haven't seen a single build with one, yet.
I would love to do that but I hate being the guinea pig. It just doesn't always end up well for the rodent. Honestly if I could get one from a company that is known to put out quality frames and communicate with its customers like it sounds like Iplay does I would probably do it.

The IP-036 has about 110mm of travel as it's meant to be a cross country oriented FS frame.  If you are looking to go 130mm of travel, you must be hitting some rough trails with lots of downhill action.  I'd suggest something like a Carbonal Titan from www.carbonality.com, that seems to be more Trail/Enduro oriented.  A little more heavy duty and a little more rear travel.
My riding is mostly trail with some small (~3'  :) ) drops and some downhill sections though has a lot of single track and XC riding as well. A couple places have several thousand feet of climb over many miles of uphill before getting to enjoy a rooty fast downhill. I have done some chair lift mountain riding as well. Basically standard Western Washington foothills trail riding. I am really looking for a "do it all" bike which for me has at least 120mm of travel. That said, right now I am "doing it all" with a 100mm HT 29er that I am beating to hell so take that with a grain of salt. I was just curious if anyone had tried to go with a longer fork, if anyone was running a 120mm travel fork on the IP-036?

I read a comment that someone had a bad experience with the quality of the Carbonality Titan on here (I'll try and find the post) which put me off of it. Is there a thread on someone building one up and giving ride impressions?

We only want the smartest members at Chinertown... Congrats on passing the test!  ;D  But seriously, I don't think it tells you specifically which question you got wrong, so that took a bit of problem solving to figure that out.

Anyways.. Fixed. Thanks for letting us know!

Wonder how many members we've lost this year so far?!?  :o
I just had to want it a little more.

It can be confusing. A lot of companies are trying to apply a few stickers to make the frame look more "branded" or "legit" and charge a few more bucks for them. Same frame. Might as well go with Iplay. Like you said, one of the reasons they've become the go to is because of their involvement in the forums. They realize their reputation is important for future sells and therefore are unlikely to totally leave you hanging if you get a bad product or shipping issues or whatever. Don't get me wrong, you'll still have to try to get their attention sometimes, not saying it's always 5 star service, but because they understand the importance of protecting that rep on the forums, you have a level of assurance/accountability that you can't get with someone like Ican. If Ican ships you a broken (and over priced, it seems) 036 frame you can only go to them to resolve your issue. If they ignore you, don't believe you or whatever - too bad. With Iplay, if you have an issue and contact them and then still feel like you weren't treated fairly, you can come to the forums and have a voice. That's why I order from them, at least.

I can't believe none of the other sellers are smart enough to be involved in the forums. Lucky for Iplay, I guess.
The branding, their website (worked well for me) and the fact that it was available on Amazon really made me take a second and third look. Seriously, if I didn't find this forum I wouldn't have given Iplay another look and been more likely to go with ICAN or Carbonal. They gave me the best "surface" impressions.

For work I talk with counterparts in China on a daily basis. I'm a mechanical engineer for a company that manufactures in China. I actually travel to Shanghai and Wuxi City a couple times a year. I understand that having someone understand what you are saying (in english) from a technical perspective is very important and very hard to find. Iplay needs to capitalize on their ability to do so.

MTNRCKT

Re: ICAN Frames
« Reply #7 on: January 29, 2015, 06:42:27 AM »
I agree... the fact that they sell on Amazon is very reassuring. Pretty smart of them. Nobody is saying they are a bad company, and if you like their branding, maybe check them out, but it does seem to be slightly more expensive for the exact same product.

JohnnyNT

Re: ICAN Frames
« Reply #8 on: January 29, 2015, 07:24:54 AM »
First thing is that this frame looks very similar to IP-036, maybe even the same.

And about your question:

When 19" frame is taken into account, 120mm fork will change angles by 1.05 degree and the 130mm one by 1.51 degree. For smaller frame these changes will be slightly larger due to smaller wheelbase. HT=70 and ST=72.5 with the 120mm fork seems perfect, pushing it 0.5 degree more won't hurt as well IMHO.

brmeyer135

Re: ICAN Frames
« Reply #9 on: January 30, 2015, 05:33:34 AM »
A another negative of the Titan looks to be price.  Maybe they are better but they are starting 100 to 200 more than the competitors.
Link to catalog here:  http://chinertown.com/index.php/topic,455.15.html with prices before shipping.

DECIM8

Re: ICAN Frames
« Reply #10 on: January 30, 2015, 04:36:37 PM »
A another negative of the Titan looks to be price.  Maybe they are better but they are starting 100 to 200 more than the competitors.
Link to catalog here:  http://chinertown.com/index.php/topic,455.15.html with prices before shipping.

Thank you for the link to that catalog. The DH frame looks beastly.

 The post by Andy, 2 down from your post with the catalog, is the one I had read that turned me off of Cabonal and the Titan frame initially. I can't find a build log or even build pictures of one either which makes it more of a mystery. It does seem like more of a Trail orientated frame but with the only feedback I have seen from someone that claims to own one is very negative. If it was a more aggressive, trail orientated frame I wouldn't mind paying a bit more for it.... as long as the quality was there.

brmeyer135

Re: ICAN Frames
« Reply #11 on: January 30, 2015, 04:47:12 PM »
The DH Titan is $1500.00...nearly 3 times most carbon frames....most likely because it is beefier and such.
Once you get up there, you start thinking name brand again.
« Last Edit: January 30, 2015, 04:51:16 PM by brmeyer135 »

MTNRCKT

Re: ICAN Frames
« Reply #12 on: January 30, 2015, 09:00:50 PM »
The DH Titan is $1500.00...nearly 3 times most carbon frames....most likely because it is beefier and such.
Once you get up there, you start thinking name brand again.

Wow, $1500 seems way too high for a chiner frame. That said, I've never looked at the prices of name brand carbon DH frame, but surely they aren't double/triple the price of name brand non-dh carbon frames.

Either way, nice catalog. Who is that from, Carbonal?

Carbon_Dude

Re: ICAN Frames
« Reply #13 on: January 30, 2015, 10:45:10 PM »
Hmmm, most FS brand name carbon frames I see are $2,800-$3,200 so I would say they are about double, but not triple.
2019 Stumpjumper Expert 29/27.5+
2017 Santa Cruz Stigmata
2017 Trek Stache 9.8 (29+)
2016 Specialized Stumpjumper FSR Carbon Comp 6Fattie (27.5+) (Sold)
2016 Trek Stache 9 (29+) w/upgrades (Sold)
2014 -036 Full Suspension Chiner (Sold)
2013 -057 Hardtail Carbon Chiner (Sold)
Atlanta, GA

Patrick C.

Re: ICAN Frames
« Reply #14 on: February 02, 2015, 03:14:09 PM »
Would there be any benefit for a DH carbon frame?  Trying to make it weigh 50 pounds instead of 55?  :) 

Never ridden DH, I was just thinking that with heavy duty components and super long travel a carbon frame would only give a marginal benefit.