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Messages - Sebastian

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1
I think SergeK pretty much sums it up. At this point, there’s a few proven and reliable options when it comes to sellers.
Most of them offer one or multiple aero frame options. The rest is personal preference with respect to geometry, weight, aesthetics and paint options and so on.

IMO Velobuild is a no brainier these days if you don’t want to dive down the rabbit hole and are just looking for a decent frame and lots of Color options for the money.

2
A chance to sell yourself...

Why would people want to buy from you instead of direct from Farsports with those identical specs?
I’ll explain my decision:

Farsports is on a different level price-wise. About 30% more expensive at least from what I can tell. I think Serenade should better be compared to the cheaper options, e.g from Elite Wheels. Like the Edge wheelset. I did consider that one but a) I liked the specs for these wheels better and b) I’m really not a fan of the matte black painted rims. These rims are transparent, so you can see the UD carbon.

3
At the back of my mind I still worry that I am subjecting the rear rim to bad stresses via the radially laced spokes on the disc-side.

That should not be the case, provided that your rim is drilled for a 2:1 pattern? If your rim has the usual drilling with alternating holes angled left and right then it won't be compatible with 2:1 lacing, because that obviously requires 2 holes angled to the DS followed by 1 to the NDS. But I'm assuming you know that.

Quote
Something I noticed is that on the rear wheel, I have pretty much dead-even spoke tension across both sides. In my mind this seems desirable, no?

Yes. That's exactly what you want. And 2:1 lacing was invented exactly for this purpose. On a traditional 2crossed rim brake rear wheel with let's say 12spokes on each side, you'd get as little as 50% or less of the spoke tension on the NDS compared to the DS. Particularly with aluminium rims where usually the max spoke tension must not exceed about 1200N, you'll get less than 600N on the NDS. That's low enough that the spokles might detension themselves over time when the wheel hits potholes etc. With (high quality) carbon rims the spoke tension can be higher. I've built wheels with spoke tension in the 1500N range. That makes detensioning less of an issue. With carbon spokes the tension is even higher because those are not as elastic as steel spokes so they need to be tightened to crazy high tensions.

4
If this really is your first ever wheelbuild then you chose something with quite the steep learning curve ;)
I've been building wheels for many years. I started out with rim brake alloy wheel stuff mostly for commuters and urban bikes, like lacing wheels with hub dynamos and stuff for myself and friends. From there I went to building more complex spoke patterns and carbon wheels and so on.

I agree with most of your choices except for two:

A 2:1 spoke ratio made a lot of sense on rim brake rear wheels IMO, where one side took all the torsional load and therefore is laced in a 3 cross pattern while the other side can be laced radially (which is how the Ford factory did it way back on laced car wheels when they invented the idea). It made sense because of the drastic difference in spoke angles with the DS spokes being much further inboard due to the cassette. Ever since disc brakes, both side's spokes had to move inboard and the difference in spoke angle and tension isn't as bad as it used to be. So the advantage of 2:1 isn't really as big as it used to be. Personally, I stopped doing it. I do think that asymmetric rear rims with a slight offset to the NDS make sense to further correct the difference in spoke angles. But that's about it.

The other thing is internal nipples. I think it's not worth the hassle. Sure, you chose superlight rims so it might be better to err on the side of caution. But I think Enve's argument that this makes a sturdier rim is marketing bogus. What is much more important is that the rim bed is reinforced as a whole, which is the case with most carbon rims. And it's important that the spoke holes are drilled cleanly and accurately in exactly the correct angles, so as to not cause stress at the nipples and threads due to bending moments. This is the case with most well made rims, but I had bad examples from some Chinese sellers. Like you, I've sourced rims from various Aliexpress sellers over the years.

The aero benefit of internal nipples might be there. Honestly, I don't care. If you ever choose to run your wheels tubeless it'll be a huge PITA to access the nipples should you ever have to. Also, since weight seems important to you, it'll increase spoke length and therfore makes the wheel marginally heavier. A well built wheel will usually not go out of true. But there can be incidents like hitting pot holes in a race or whatever.

But like many things in wheelbuilding, this is just my philosophy. I think you did a stellar job and built a super impressive wheelset. Congrats! And it's a really nice feeling to be riding around on one of a kind wheels that you yourself built.

5
I'll chime in here.
I've done 3000k on this set of Serenade Wheels.
They market this as their Allroad/Gravel wheels but I think it really is basically a modern road wheelset.
55deep/31wide/25internal, DT Ratchet style straight pull hubs compatible with DT Swiss freehubs, Pillar Wing 20 spokes (24 front and back) and aluminium nipples, 1450g total weight. I bought them with hooked sidewalls, but they're also available in hookless if that's what you want.

The pictures show these with 28mm Vittoria Corsas. They come up just shy of 31mm on these wheels and form a nice transition between rim and tire, as you can see. Performance wise, they're fast. I paid roughly 480 EUR including shipping and taxes and I think this is all the wheelset you could ever ask for for that kind of money.
The only thing I can criticize is the hubs. I rode these through a very wet winter. The bearings in the front hub started sounding rough in very little time. They turned out to be basically dry with no grease, so they corroded quickly. I replaced them with a set of high quality SKF bearings. The wheels roll fine ever since. The rear hub bearings are still smooth.
But I think if you wanted a tad more performance, you should opt for better hubs. Serenade offers all kinds of hub choices including genuine DT Swiss hubs.
Also, I think Centerlock is a useless standard. The rotors are more expensive. The fitment is not a good as 6 bolt. Just my personal opinion. If I was given the choice again, I'd probably go with 6 bolt interface hubs.

Buying experience with Serenade was OK but not stellar. While pricing is good, the communication was a bit lacking at times. That's one thing I'd recommend you guys improve on. I only really received updates when asking. They were quick to answer any questions upon ordering and VERY SLOW to answer questions on delivery, once the payment was made. That's a bit of a pattern with a lot of chinese sellers IME.

All in all, I can recommend SERENADE. Please note: I was told that they are a reseller rather than a manufacturer, sourcing their parts from all kinds of factories. Maybe you can tell us more about that here.

6
I think 32mm measured width is definitely doable with direct mount brakes. My VB-R218 easily clears 30mm. The limiting factor is actually more the chainstays rather than the brakes. With single bolt mounted brakes it depends on the caliper and the height of the caliper placement l, I imagine. The latest gen calipers from Campag and Shimano have A LOT of tire clearance. I had a modern rim brake steel frame with a Columbus carbon fork with single bolt Campag calipers. That one would definitely have cleared 32s. I rode it with 28s, though. But there was a lot of space left. But you will run out of clearance directly under the caliper at some point. Add grit and grime to that and the tire will leave ugly marks on the caliper.

7
Road Bike Frames, Wheels & Components / Re: Velobuild VB-R-218
« on: May 13, 2024, 11:45:10 PM »
A total noob question: What kind of software are you using to design stuff like this? Some sort of CAD-software? Is it free/open source? I’d be interested to design a storage box to mount inbetween the water bottles in the frame triangle on my TT-X38.


8
Road Bike Frames, Wheels & Components / Re: Velobuild VB-R-218
« on: May 11, 2024, 12:30:49 AM »
Since this thread is back from the dead, I thought I might as well give an update. More than 8000k done. No issues. Still the first headset with no signs of wear which is a pleasant surprise.  I wasn’t too confident in those bearings. This is the bike with the race wheels on: 60mm deep/1300g with 28mm tubulars. These feel soo nice when accelerating and the cornering feel is insane. I’m still in love with the handling of this frame and the super quick steering response.

9
Road Bike Frames, Wheels & Components / Re: Velobuild VB-R-218
« on: May 10, 2024, 05:46:29 AM »
But I will definitely try to tighten the top cap before clamping the stem although I guess it doesn't really matter.

Just to clarify: Of course it makes a difference. Tightening down the top cap does nothing if you’ve already clamped your stem to the steerer. The top cap/expander assembly is there to press the stem down whilst pulling the fork up and therefore put preload on the upper and lower headset bearing. If the stem can’t move cuz it’s clamped to the steerer, you won’t get any preload on the headset. And sure, if you then go on and tighten down the top cap more and more, it might even break. Though in almost twenty years of biking I have never managed to kill a top cap like that. You might have had particularly bad quality ones.

10
Road Bike Frames, Wheels & Components / Re: Velobuild VB-R-218
« on: May 10, 2024, 12:43:33 AM »
You probably have spare split spacers lying around, right? Use one the to stack your stem a tad higher and tighten everything down and see if the play is gone. If yes, then your fork steerer still is a tad too long. If not, then something else is going on.

11
I'm on the opposite spectrum of ER9/X users on here, because my ER9 has been working great.

Well, you haven't had it for that long so too early to tell, I'd say.
Mine's also working fine still all the way through a very wet winter here. I'm past 3000k/1800miles now. I too am cautiously optimistic that I might have a well working unit. But so thought SergeK, until they all broke down on him.

12
I'm based in Germany. I used cells from German company (reseller?) PATONA. They do all kinds of batteries including big ones for e-scooters and e-bikes. They were slightly more expensive - something like double the price of the cheap stuff on Amazon. But they're working reliably. I guess you really shouldn't save money on the battery.

13
My RD's serial number starts with 250123 as well. Bought in Sept 23.
No issues yet apart from one ride with intermittent shifting due to humidity in the plug. Without issues since I weatherproofed the connection.
I've done roughly 3000km and 16.000 shifts with it. Fingers crossed.

I did shy away from using the bike in a race recently due to the number of reports here. I didn't want to be stranded on the side of the road with non working derailleurs, so I used my mechanical bike. But I've done 6+ hour long gran fondos with this and used the battery with as little as around 25% of its capacity. It kept working. I also regularly ride cobbled and dirt roads on my rides and the vibrations have not been a problem so far.

14
They are all same. I bought different brands and noticed that the lockring on which brand name is printed comes in its own little pouch sticky-taped to main cassette body. One manufacturer is producing those cassettes and ZTTO, Wuzei, Goldix, Sunshine just add brand lockrings on top and make it theirs. Those mid range lightweight cassettes are really good. I am yet to try scary light cassettes like Riro branded.

Naah, Thanks. 250g for a 11-34 12sp cassette is light enough for me. I’ll steer clear of steel/aluminium cassettes from Ali for the time being.

15
the lower pulley has a narrow / wide teeth config, so you have to feed the chain correctly. i guess it helps with shifting quality?

+1 on that
Mine has the pulley with the narrow/wide teeth in the lower position.
I swapped my cheap aluminium/steel hybrid cassette for a ZTTO lightweight one piece steel cassette. It has absolutely transformed the shifting and it‘s now WAAAY better, quicker, quieter and smoother. Only confirms my assumption that these cheap cassettes are not worth it. (Mine was the Goldix one but they’re all the same I think). But even more so, I’m only realising now how much this has hampered my er9 groupset. It’s soo much better now. Amazing.

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