Chinertown
Chinese Carbon Road Bikes => Road Bike Frames, Wheels & Components => Topic started by: diP on January 13, 2023, 07:31:56 AM
-
First informations about the 2023 Falath "Evo" are showing up.
"Current price unknown ... are expected in February.
The first batch will be in April."
Couldn't find any informations about geometry.
Was looking for a new Aero Roadbike and had this one on my watchlist, but not so sure about its looks...
-
Looks pretty good imo but prb heavy af
-
I like the look. One thing I'm always worried about with the flush stem/top tube is that the bike only looks okay in the most aggressive fit
-
One thing I'm always worried about with the flush stem/top tube is that the bike only looks okay in the most aggressive fit
Yeah, at least Cervelo compensates this with a positive stem angle, but that's not the case here. Unless you're a gymnast, you probably can't ride this frame.
-
https://www.carousell.com.hk/p/2023-elves-falath-evo-%E7%B2%BE%E9%9D%88%E6%B3%95%E6%8B%89%E6%96%AFevo-%E5%85%A8%E5%85%A7%E8%B5%B0%E7%A2%9F%E5%89%8E%E5%85%AC%E8%B7%AF%E8%BB%8A-%E9%9D%9Elook-cervelo%E8%A8%AD%E8%A8%88-disc-roadbike-1209408332/ (https://www.carousell.com.hk/p/2023-elves-falath-evo-%E7%B2%BE%E9%9D%88%E6%B3%95%E6%8B%89%E6%96%AFevo-%E5%85%A8%E5%85%A7%E8%B5%B0%E7%A2%9F%E5%89%8E%E5%85%AC%E8%B7%AF%E8%BB%8A-%E9%9D%9Elook-cervelo%E8%A8%AD%E8%A8%88-disc-roadbike-1209408332/)
While the overall reach is still probably too short (typical Elves), surprisingly this frame would actually fit me quite well. The non-aggressive stack measurement compensates for the slammed handlebar decision. Just strange how I need a 3XL in Elves when I usually ride a M/L/56 in everything else.
-
There's supposed to be a 61 this time.
-
I'm actually pretty excited for this frame. I want this with the potential ltwoo electronic hydro set with a set of elite wheels to pair with my legit SW SL7 as a super beater. haha
-
Wow! The top tube length on these is ridiculously short. The 3XL has a 59 seat tube and not even a 56 top tube? That's crazy short.
Does Elves allow customers to choose any cockpit size with their frame?
-
I like this geo. The 52 would probably fit me pretty nicely, and is definitely slammable. Too bad I don't like the frame design :P
-
Looks quite like the Simplon Pride https://www.simplon.com/de/Bikes/Roadbikes/Pride-II_b_292366 but with skinnier fork
-
Def need positive stem options.... would look better and be more comfortable
-
Cam Nicholls' first look on the new Falath EVO. The updated price is gonna sting for a lot of folks...
https://youtu.be/qgu_-73QVuA (https://youtu.be/qgu_-73QVuA)
-
Nice frame, looks fast!
For the size 59 I'll still need about 20mm of spacers measuring from above the top tube. Looks like it's going to be proprietary spacers.
The offset seat post works here with the shorter reach.
-
I'm really intrigued. The assumption with the UCI approval besides safety and testing, is that Elves really wants to make this their flagship frameset to compete with the likes of Winspace and Yoeleo. I'm hesitant to also mention SEKA because this new Elves Falath weighs about 400g heavier. Not a deal breaker for me since overall system weight is drastically more important. And it is an aero frame.
Still scratching my head though over the geometry (3XL), particularly the reach since it's a racing frame. My 2022 Allez Sprint (size 56) has a reach of 398mm and I'm running a 130mm stem. This setup is practically identical to my Winspace 1500 (size L) with 125mm (effectively 140mm) integrated bars.
Hoping Elves offers an integrated bar with a 130mm stem.
-
After watching the Cam Nicholls video, am I the only one who doesn't think this bike looks fast? It looks like it was designed to have the appearance of being aero from the side profile, but clearly fails in several areas. The frontal profile on the head tube and fork is super chunky compared to the Falath Pro. Everyone knows frontal area=drag. There's also a lot of weird tube profiles, the seat tube and gusset have a really square frontal profile, and the top-down cross-section of the head-tube right behind the steerer doesn't really taper, instead terminating in a chunky square flat back like on a Trek Madone. This area of the head-tube is probably the most important part to make as narrow as possible since it gets the cleanest air. But then the downtube narrows and never widens again to shield the water bottle. It's backwards of what you want, which is narrow up top and a wider, flatter back down low to shield the bottle. I just don't get it. I'm not an aerodynamics expert but this bike seems to just violate a bunch of aero principles I know of. I wouldn't be surprised if the outgoing model is faster with bottles on.
That and it's heavy. I initially saw online rumors that the frame would be ~900gr. Now 400 grams over that? Even heavier than the outgoing model? I can't see this being popular.
-
With such weight, I do not believe it uses a lot of T1000 carbon for the construction.
UCI certified just make it looks good on paper.
-
I'm really intrigued. The assumption with the UCI approval besides safety and testing, is that Elves really wants to make this their flagship frameset to compete with the likes of Winspace and Yoeleo. I'm hesitant to also mention SEKA because this new Elves Falath weighs about 400g heavier. Not a deal breaker for me since overall system weight is drastically more important. And it is an aero frame.
Still scratching my head though over the geometry (3XL), particularly the reach since it's a racing frame. My 2022 Allez Sprint (size 56) has a reach of 398mm and I'm running a 130mm stem. This setup is practically identical to my Winspace 1500 (size L) with 125mm (effectively 140mm) integrated bars.
Hoping Elves offers an integrated bar with a 130mm stem.
It says it's been tested under the ISO 4210 protocol. As far as I know, that's just the basic requirement that anyone who wants to sell cycling parts in the Western World needs to conform to anyway. Even the super cheap options like Velobuild and the likes. To me, that's just marketing.
Also, who cares about UCI certification? Isn't that only really relevant for elite racers? In all the races I have ever done no one ever weighed my bike or asked for the UCI label.
They do offer a 130mm cockpit. You can see the details on the Elves Australia website, where this frame is available on pre-order.
-
After watching the Cam Nicholls video, am I the only one who doesn't think this bike looks fast? It looks like it was designed to have the appearance of being aero from the side profile, but clearly fails in several areas. The frontal profile on the head tube and fork is super chunky compared to the Falath Pro. Everyone knows frontal area=drag. There's also a lot of weird tube profiles, the seat tube and gusset have a really square frontal profile, and the top-down cross-section of the head-tube right behind the steerer doesn't really taper, instead terminating in a chunky square flat back like on a Trek Madone. This area of the head-tube is probably the most important part to make as narrow as possible since it gets the cleanest air. But then the downtube narrows and never widens again to shield the water bottle. It's backwards of what you want, which is narrow up top and a wider, flatter back down low to shield the bottle. I just don't get it. I'm not an aerodynamics expert but this bike seems to just violate a bunch of aero principles I know of. I wouldn't be surprised if the outgoing model is faster with bottles on.
That and it's heavy. I initially saw online rumors that the frame would be ~900gr. Now 400 grams over that? Even heavier than the outgoing model? I can't see this being popular.
I think both are ID52 headtubes so I'd be surprised if there was much difference. Also the frontal area of bike is a red herring. It's the frontal area of the rider and whether air will attach to the bike or rider. Any increase in head tube area will be minute, if there is any. Air should in theory attach much better to this frame than the prior one. Infill / compensation triangles are massive compared to the previous one. Hence why it was also never going to either be super light or as light as the previous one.
What matters most and we still don't know is what the spacer situation is, and what the third party / stem cockpit situation is.
Also from my perspective, they had mentioned a 61 size, but still no geo forthcoming.
-
Also from my perspective, they had mentioned a 61 size, but still no geo forthcoming.
Geometry geeks seem to have it listed for all sizes.
-> https://geometrygeeks.bike/bike/elves-falath-evo-2023/
It is a strange geo and sizing compared to other comparable bikes...
-
Also from my perspective, they had mentioned a 61 size, but still no geo forthcoming.
Guess you meant the geo for just 61.
No that's not listed / mentioned anywhere
Even at the end of this page - where there's quite a lot of info
https://www.elvesbikes.co.uk/falath-evo-2023
-
What matters most and we still don't know is what the spacer situation is, and what the third party / stem cockpit situation is.
Also from my perspective, they had mentioned a 61 size, but still no geo forthcoming.
This makes or break the success of this frame.
For the pros and flexible riders, this geometry looks like the perfect stack to reach ratio. But there should always be room for the average rider to easily play around with stack, stem length, bar width etc.
The "aero profile" issues or weight is subjective especially for the average rider and can be compensated through other means (aero posture, aero bottles, lighter components etc).
It is always about the rider and if the rider can be made to fit nicely to this frame then it really looks like an affordable, stylish dedicated aero bike.
-
The "aero profile" issues or weight is subjective especially for the average rider and can be compensated through other means (aero posture, aero bottles, lighter components etc).
It is always about the rider and if the rider can be made to fit nicely to this frame then it really looks like an affordable, stylish dedicated aero bike.
I beg to disagree. The geometry is a dime a dozen in the highish-end Chinese DTC market, Yoeleo R12, Seka Exceed, and the outgoing Falath Pro are all extremely similar in that regard. So we're really down to discussing quality, price, and adherence to design goals (i.e. aero and weight).
-
I think that they've made the seat tube considerably longer on this than it would be on a frame with a conventional cockpit setup. I think they did this to be able to integrate the front end the way they did without having to give the frame a rather drastic sloping top tube (like on the Look 795 Aerolight). That's why the sizes are a bit misleading, IMO. As is so often the case. The XL59 size to me looks rather like a conventional 56 if you look at the stack and reach figures.
I think taller people will have a hard time to make this frame fit. You'd need a pretty long stem and - if the stack is too low - some kind of spacer solution. Elves does offer a bar with 130mm stem length. But to be honest, at 190cm/6ft2 I'd probably have a hard time fitting on this even on the biggest size with the longest cockpit. The only frame I ever had that was this short on the TT was a cyclocross frame. And I sold it because it felt too cramped.
-
Guess you meant the geo for just 61.
No that's not listed / mentioned anywhere
Even at the end of this page - where there's quite a lot of info
https://www.elvesbikes.co.uk/falath-evo-2023
They made several social media posts including a size 61, but geo hasn't been released.
-
They made several social media posts including a size 61, but geo hasn't been released.
Had it confirmed that there will be a 61, but no geo yet. They're going to need to boost the stack a shitload. Their suggested sizing chart currently suggests that people up to 198cm can ride the 59. Maybe if their arms are longer than their legs?
-
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z-P09uyDe0A (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z-P09uyDe0A)
No one has posted this yet: Cam Nicholls' build video for the Elves Falath.
Seems like the quality and finishing of frame and fork are very good. No issues during the build process.
Frame weight is a little underwhelming at 1300g for a size 54.
Final build weight with fairly lightweight parts (without pedals) is 7.9kg which puts it more or less where to be expected for a modern chunky aero bike.
They're also saying that the frameset will be delivered with 30mm worth of spacers. Too bad they themselves didn't have any so we still don't know what that solution is gonna look like.
-
We have to come to terms with the fact not every bike on the market is designed fit everyone. While this should be obvious, there's always going to be a subset of potential customers who feel alienated when a newly released frame/bike doesn't fit their geometry. This is especially true with aero frames for some reason...
I have been really interested in the SEKA Exceed for the past year. Going back and forth on whether I could make the frame geometry "work" for my needs. Unfortunately even their 130mm integrated cockpit/stem is not enough reach for the frame size I need. And that's okay. No use spending my hard-earned money on a frame that wasn't designed for me in the first place. This new Falath EVO is dangerously close to also being too short for my geometry. We shall see how it plays out.
Plenty of reasons why someone would prefer an aero frame versus an endurance or lightweight frame. Even if not for actual racing or the perceived aerodynamic benefits, they simply look cool. And look fast. We are free to spend our money however we please and the market ultimately will dictate how successful these niche frames will be.
-
We have to come to terms with the fact not every bike on the market is designed fit everyone.
True. Integrated one piece cockpits - as good as they may look - don’t really help with that either.
Still, I think that particulary with B2C sellers from China and new brands like Elves which AFAIK have have their biggest turnover in Asia, there’s very few frame offerings for normal sized Europeans and Americans. Sizes usually fit people with maximum average height, sometimes barely.
But maybe that’ll change as sales in the Western world increase.
You could of course always go down the route of using stem and bars and adjust the fit. Slap on a massively long stem and feel like a world tour pro. :P
I think Jonas Rutsch of team EF rides a ridiculous 150mm stem on his Super Six EVO. He’s pretty tall. His bike probably steers about as quickly as a bus.
-
https://www.velonews.com/wp-content/uploads/2022/04/Rutsch-Cannondale-SuperSix-EVO-with-170mm-stem-02.jpg?crop=600:337&width=600 (https://www.velonews.com/wp-content/uploads/2022/04/Rutsch-Cannondale-SuperSix-EVO-with-170mm-stem-02.jpg?crop=600:337&width=600)
I correct myself. Rutsch rode a 170mm stem at Paris-Roubaix 2021. :o
Didn’t seem to bother him. He came in 11th. He probably had very compliant handlebars with that kind of stem length.
-
You could of course always go down the route of using stem and bars and adjust the fit. Slap on a massively long stem and feel like a world tour pro. :P
I think Jonas Rutsch of team EF rides a ridiculous 150mm stem on his Super Six EVO. He’s pretty tall. His bike probably steers about as quickly as a bus.
Haha I run 130mm -17 stems on all my aero bikes. Can't imagine what a 140/150 would feel like, but then again pro riders probably prioritize stability over maneuverability like crit racers.
Great point about Chinese brands catering their frame dimensions to their Asian markets. One thing I wish ALL Chinese brands could do is at least offer a headset/spacer combo that allows for routing the cables through the headset top cap rather than only fully internal.
-
Had it confirmed that there will be a 61, but no geo yet. They're going to need to boost the stack a shitload. Their suggested sizing chart currently suggests that people up to 198cm can ride the 59. Maybe if their arms are longer than their legs?
:o Well they did the absolute opposite. They increased the reach massively and the stack a bit for the 61 ... in contrast to practically every other big bike. 160mm HT on a 61 ST :o
https://elvesbikesaustralia.com.au/collections/falath-evo-2023/products/falath-evo-frame-disc-brake
Relatively low reach for every size except the biggest, which has BIG reach.
Wild guess, but I don't think that geo is going to be a winner for them 8)
-
The way the frame is designed, the headtube is very short.
-
The way the frame is designed, the headtube is very short.
The distribution of people high on the ape index and with very long legs is minuscule. Hence why virtually all bigger frames boost the stack a lot and the reach either a little or not at all.
It doesn't really matter whether the rest of the sizes have a short headtube as the mold will need to be different anyway.
But they went from low reach on the 59 to huge reach on the 61. I don't know of another bike doing that.
-
Also, I think it looks rather weird with a tower of spacers in front of the top tube.
If you take into account that the bars have very short reach at only 70mm it’s actually not that crazy long for a frame of this size. But the stack is low for sure.
Also, having a long frame and compensating for that with a short reach cockpit changes handling and steering, obviously. Might not be desirable for a road bike. I intentionally designed my gravel bike that way and quite like it (it’s a custom steel frame) but it has a slacker head angle.
-
Also, I think it looks rather weird with a tower of spacers in front of the top tube.
If you take into account that the bars have very short reach at only 70mm it’s actually not that crazy long for a frame of this size. But the stack is low for sure.
Also, having a long frame and compensating for that with a short reach cockpit changes handling and steering, obviously. Might not be desirable for a road bike. I intentionally designed my gravel bike that way and quite like it (it’s a custom steel frame) but it has a slacker head angle.
Bruh that's how it looks with spacers LoL?
The idea of getting this frame keeps going down...
-
The distribution of people high on the ape index and with very long legs is minuscule. Hence why virtually all bigger frames boost the stack a lot and the reach either a little or not at all.
It doesn't really matter whether the rest of the sizes have a short headtube as the mold will need to be different anyway.
But they want from low reach on the 59 to huge reach on the 61. I don't know of another bike doing that.
You are right I just checked on Geometry Geek and holy crap that's weird. I also looked at effective top tube and they have 32.3 mm of difference. :o
-
I almost suspect it's a mixup. Someone gave the spec to factory and reversed the increase in TT vs HT for the 61 vs 59. So now they have a clown car mold for the 61.
It's practically inexplicable otherwise, because people wanting that long a seat tube with that little stack almost don't exist, and the geo is completely different to every other size in the range. Aside from the high reach, low stack, and obviously long ST, the Front Center is really long - similar to a lot of gravel bikes.
-
I might get one, waiting for what Cam Nicholls has to say about it (even if it's kinda sponsored).
I'm 1m98 (6"6) and that HT is really small lmao but I'm looking for a really aero agressive and stiff race bike and man it looks sick af
-
I might get one, waiting for what Cam Nicholls has to say about it (even if it's kinda sponsored).
I'm 1m98 (6"6) and that HT is really small lmao but I'm looking for a really aero agressive and stiff race bike and man it looks sick af
You sure you're going to be able to ride that at race power (or at all)?
-
You sure you're going to be able to ride that at race power (or at all)?
Currently trying to match the position of the Falath with my Trek Madone, slammed my stem as much as possible and going to put a -17°C 130mm stem on it, also compared it to my Giant Trinity (I do spend some time on the bars when doing fast group rides), I am rlly flexible so hoping it could work, I need a couple weeks to see if I can hold the position on my Madone
-
WELP...
https://youtu.be/Q1t4PoMIQIE (https://youtu.be/Q1t4PoMIQIE)
-
I might get one, waiting for what Cam Nicholls has to say about it (even if it's kinda sponsored).
I'm 1m98 (6"6) and that HT is really small lmao but I'm looking for a really aero agressive and stiff race bike and man it looks sick af
Unfortunately, you will have to wait a little longer. He will send this pre production frameset back and wait for new in smaller size. Too bad because I was also looking forward for this review and considering to buy this frameset.
-
Unfortunately, you will have to wait a little longer. He will send this pre production frameset back and wait for new in smaller size. Too bad because I was also looking forward for this review and considering to buy this frameset.
Yeah saw the vid :'( The older Falath Pro also looks good but 59 is the max size that's too small for me, might end up buying a used western brand or a new Giant Propel
-
Reviewing and comparing the geometry (yet again) on Geometry Geeks I think the a size 59 paired to a 400/130 integrated handlebar combo would work very well for me.
With my Rinasclta bike now dialed in, I find myself very comfortable in the "TT" position on the hoods. This is likely do to the overall reach on the Rinasclta being slightly shorter, and the stack being slightly higher than my typical road bike setups.
If my maths are correct...basically somewhere between a slammed cockpit and 10mm of a spacers would net me an identical geometry on the Elves to my Rinasclta.
-
This frame is still something to try if it would be safe to stack up more 20mm - 30mm spacers above the top tube level for me.
-
What size is that frame?
I dunno but something looks way off about it. Perhaps it's the angle/slope of the top tube :(
-
What size is that frame?
I dunno but something looks way off about it. Perhaps it's the angle/slope of the top tube :(
Not sure of this size.
I think it looks off because the frame was built with the intention of having the stem flushed with the top tube. Stacking the stem/handlebars over the top tube level throws off the intended design effect.
-
What size is that frame?
I dunno but something looks way off about it. Perhaps it's the angle/slope of the top tube :(
It's the very short top tube, present in all sizes except 61 which is instead very long ...
-
Cam Nicholls just made a reels he received the frameset (production one this time apparently) : https://www.instagram.com/p/CqZ2JaYtbon/
-
Jourdain Coleman just did an Unbox, Review & In-Depth Analysis on his youtube channel.
-
I decided to order the frameset + wheelset + handlebar, size 61cm for me + custom paint, I'll be building the bike with ultegra di2 12s I can't wait for it, I've DMed some guys on instagram that have already ridden the bike (Elves' insta repost their stories) and for now only positive things about the bike being really stiff, one guy said it felt way better than his Scott Addict. Found some videos of the Evo builds :
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2Rz6-QhnUI8
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FQyLHVbE3aM
The paintjob and finishes look really nice so I can't wait to receive mine !
-
I decided to order the frameset + wheelset + handlebar, size 61cm for me + custom paint, I'll be building the bike with ultegra di2 12s I can't wait for it, I've DMed some guys on instagram that have already ridden the bike (Elves' insta repost their stories) and for now only positive things about the bike being really stiff, one guy said it felt way better than his Scott Addict. Found some videos of the Evo builds :
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2Rz6-QhnUI8
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FQyLHVbE3aM
The paintjob and finishes look really nice so I can't wait to receive mine !
Those builds look super nice! What I find funny is that you'll find these bike build videos from SE Asia that use properly calibrated tools (one video was using a digital torque wrench for the BB) and select high end components to build up their Chinese bike frames. Then you'll see some half ass build videos from the UK, buying the crappiest parts from AliExpress and then proclaim the components, frames, etc. are cheap rubbish!
-
Quite interested in this frameset. Waiting on Cam Nichols videos on it as he seems to be the most impartial reviewer of all this sort of stuff, even if he gets it for free. A lot of reviews seem to only say good things presumably half hoping to get more free product to review.
-
Quite interested in this frameset. Waiting on Cam Nichols videos on it as he seems to be the most impartial reviewer of all this sort of stuff, even if he gets it for free. A lot of reviews seem to only say good things presumably half hoping to get more free product to review.
Most of them get a financial kickback from purchases made using their "discount" codes.
-
Most of them get a financial kickback from purchases made using their "discount" codes.
Yeah, whenever I see a "buy" link with a so called "review" I just close the page...
-
GC Performance posted a YT-vid of his Falath EVO. Apparently there is a review coming. The frame proportions do look a lot less weird on the bigger frame sizes. The sloping top tube really doesn’t work well with the chunky tube shapes on the small frames aesthetically IMO. Still, he’s got the full spacer tower beneath his bars which not only looks kinda strange, but it adds a whopping 100g to the build.
Design and geometry wise this bike still strikes me as a weird one. Can’t wait to see more builds, though.
-
What size is that frame?
I dunno but something looks way off about it. Perhaps it's the angle/slope of the top tube :(
Agree, it's like its a straight mash up of a relaxed endurance frame and tubing of an agressive aero one
-
With every first-look and build video I see of this frame the less I'm intrigued. The majority of folks don't seem to be slamming the cockpit, which I assumed was the original purposed based on the super sloping top tube and tall stack height.
GC performance and I are the same height (6 feet) yet he opted for a size smaller than the geometry suggested due to the tall standover height. Same with Cam Nichols.
Either Elves is on the forefront of innovation with this new Falath EVO.....or perhaps there is a reason you don't really see major brands offering a design/geometry like this for an aero frame. And Elves has been promoting the heck out of this frame on social media which I understand, but is becoming overkill.
This is coming from a Winspace fanboy...
-
I've been searching and still can't find any video of someone actually riding this frame from different camera angles so we can see the actual form of a cyclist riding this frame. The promotions from Elves so far sadly only focus on the frame's appearance. Would be nice if they made some sick shots of someone going full gas + sprinting on this thing.
Looking at GC Performance's latest build, I'm kinda still drawn to this frame.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TOX9sWUpd7c
-
I've been searching and still can't find any video of someone actually riding this frame from different camera angles so we can see the actual form of a cyclist riding this frame. The promotions from Elves so far sadly only focus on the frame's appearance. Would be nice if they made some sick shots of someone going full gas + sprinting on this thing.
Looking at GC Performance's latest build, I'm kinda still drawn to this frame.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TOX9sWUpd7c
On Elves's insta page, you have some guys who already got the frame that rode it. Just received a message from them saying the frame will be finished next week so I might receive it before June
-
I've been searching and still can't find any video of someone actually riding this frame from different camera angles so we can see the actual form of a cyclist riding this frame. The promotions from Elves so far sadly only focus on the frame's appearance. Would be nice if they made some sick shots of someone going full gas + sprinting on this thing.
Looking at GC Performance's latest build, I'm kinda still drawn to this frame.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TOX9sWUpd7c
Here : https://www.instagram.com/p/Cr0_RJNIMsB/
-
Spacers
-
Spacers
Interesting custom paint, I'm waiting for my frame it's been shipped, should arrive in the next 10 days
-
Interesting custom paint, I'm waiting for my frame it's been shipped, should arrive in the next 10 days
Received my frameset, bars & wheels yesterday, currently building it. The paintjob looks amazing, finish quality is pretty good, some imperfections here and there but overall really nice. Only downs for now are that I asked for 2 spare mech hangers and only got 1, and didn't get the included grease&carbon paste like in some youtube videos.
-
Received my frameset, bars & wheels yesterday, currently building it. The paintjob looks amazing, finish quality is pretty good, some imperfections here and there but overall really nice. Only downs for now are that I asked for 2 spare mech hangers and only got 1, and didn't get the included grease&carbon paste like in some youtube videos.
-
https://imgur.com/a/FdtxVcU
-
Finished building it, everything went well, just the brake hoses were hard to fit into the handlebar, and the rear hose was pulling the handlebar towards the right side, it went away the next day... Maybe the hoses needed to "take their form". Paintjob is amazing, same for the wheels, the noise is insane, didn't do a real ride yet but just cruised around, the bike feels really stiff yet comfortable with the 28mm tyres and 29mm wide wheels, should do a real test ride tomorrow. Bike comes at 8.2kg with pedals, gps mount and bottle cage, really good for a size 61cm frame sub 4k euros.
https://imgur.com/a/PMzOMGm
-
Very nice build. Congratulations!
Thanks for the awesome photos :)
I like how the handlebars kinda tilts upwards. Looks like it adds about 10mm more stack.
They quoted 25mm setback on the seatpost. However, on GC perfomance's video, the black Falat Evo build (see attached image), it looks like the seatpost clamp can be adjusted to minimize the setback. Can you help to verify this? Meaning the setpost setback could be reduced to maybe 15mm?
-
Like is
-
Yes, the seatpost can be adjusted fowards, about less than 1cm, so it's not much but you still have some room to play with, I can move my saddle about 7cm fowards between fully backwards saddle rails + backwards clamp and fully foward saddle and seat clamp.
-
https://imgur.com/dClekcc about 7mm
-
Wow, thank you so much for painfully taking the saddle apart to check and for sharing the pics and video. Really appreciate it! :D
The little movement forward was just want I needed to confirm that the back side will fit nicely for me.
Thanks again!
-
https://imgur.com/a/rJj9r9s
Bike feels really good, it's easier to stay tucked in than my rim brake Madone, the flat aero bars also help since you can put some weight with your wrists. It accelerates way better than my TT bike but almost holds a 50kmh pull as well, the perfect bike for flat roads.
I'll test it in uphills this weekend
-
https://imgur.com/a/rJj9r9s
Bike feels really good, it's easier to stay tucked in than my rim brake Madone, the flat aero bars also help since you can put some weight with your wrists. It accelerates way better than my TT bike but almost holds a 50kmh pull as well, the perfect bike for flat roads.
I'll test it in uphills this weekend
DAAAAAAAANG! My man looking AERO!
-
https://imgur.com/a/rJj9r9s
Bike feels really good, it's easier to stay tucked in than my rim brake Madone, the flat aero bars also help since you can put some weight with your wrists. It accelerates way better than my TT bike but almost holds a 50kmh pull as well, the perfect bike for flat roads.
I'll test it in uphills this weekend
All smiles here :D
Niceeee!!!!!!
-
https://imgur.com/a/rJj9r9s
Bike feels really good, it's easier to stay tucked in than my rim brake Madone, the flat aero bars also help since you can put some weight with your wrists. It accelerates way better than my TT bike but almost holds a 50kmh pull as well, the perfect bike for flat roads.
I'll test it in uphills this weekend
Thanks for sharing your build including riding footage! It's very much appreciated and helps a lot! I'm 196 cm (6"5) and exploring the (chinese) market for a new roadbike frame. Unfortunately there are not many options out there for us tall riders. I like the Elves frame but I'm still not sure if the low stack number is too aggressive for me. I'm lookin for an all out racebike since I own a gravelbike with relaxed geometry already but I know for sure that I couldn't hold your extreme riding position comfortably for more than a few minutes.
May I ask whats your inseam? And what stem length are you running?
-
After watching the Cam Nicholls video, am I the only one who doesn't think this bike looks fast? It looks like it was designed to have the appearance of being aero from the side profile, but clearly fails in several areas. The frontal profile on the head tube and fork is super chunky compared to the Falath Pro. Everyone knows frontal area=drag. There's also a lot of weird tube profiles, the seat tube and gusset have a really square frontal profile, and the top-down cross-section of the head-tube right behind the steerer doesn't really taper, instead terminating in a chunky square flat back like on a Trek Madone. This area of the head-tube is probably the most important part to make as narrow as possible since it gets the cleanest air. But then the downtube narrows and never widens again to shield the water bottle. It's backwards of what you want, which is narrow up top and a wider, flatter back down low to shield the bottle. I just don't get it. I'm not an aerodynamics expert but this bike seems to just violate a bunch of aero principles I know of. I wouldn't be surprised if the outgoing model is faster with bottles on.
That and it's heavy. I initially saw online rumors that the frame would be ~900gr. Now 400 grams over that? Even heavier than the outgoing model? I can't see this being popular.
I 100% agree with you. It's the very flattened backside of tubes that seem slow. Really awkward gap at the rear-wheel as well.
-
Thanks for sharing your build including riding footage! It's very much appreciated and helps a lot! I'm 196 cm (6"5) and exploring the (chinese) market for a new roadbike frame. Unfortunately there are not many options out there for us tall riders. I like the Elves frame but I'm still not sure if the low stack number is too aggressive for me. I'm lookin for an all out racebike since I own a gravelbike with relaxed geometry already but I know for sure that I couldn't hold your extreme riding position comfortably for more than a few minutes.
May I ask whats your inseam? And what stem length are you running?
Im running 420x130mm bars, the biggest size they have. I'm 1m98 with a ~96cm inseam. The bike fits me perfectly, it is an aero race bike tho, I have very flexible hips and work on mobility and I'm not in that position for a whole 4h ride haha
-
Already +500k on the bike, it definitely isn't the best bike for a chill/recovery ride haha, really stiff everywhere.
I have a slight issue with the chainstays, they flare out and my shoes are so damn long they're slightly rubbing the left chainstay when I'm out of the saddle, my Q factor is already quite big since I have Assioma pedals, might add a washer or two.
I put some clear tape so it won't damage the paint any further. The frame also didn't have any chainstay protection cover or metal cover for the BB, ordered some and might epoxy a metal cover on the chainstay
Apart from that no issues whatsoever
https://imgur.com/a/2m6DyY2
-
Also, if you guys saw the Cam Nicholls' video about the steerer being 50/50 carbon/fiberglass, Elves made an insta post about why they put fiberglass in their steerer. They're more transparent than the whole bike industry haha
GC Performance also made a video about it
I personally didn't even see there was 2 different materials in the steerer... the bonding between the 2 is well made, I cut the steerer myself and had 0 issues
-
Yeah, seems like "fibreglass gate" is in fact a non-issue and common practice especially on higher-quality frames even of top tier brands to ensure a perfectly round non-corroding fit for the expander plug. It's actually a good thing! Verdict: Don't listen to self-proclaimed "experts" on YouTube...
Thanks again for the first-hand tall-rider-experience! 8)
-
Hambini got this frame a review
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ksA4GA05w7k
-
Hambini got this frame a review
Honest 'reaming' and I like his sense of humor. It's always a good reminder to be careful with reviews from youtubers/influencers that 'got' their frame from the brand spontaneously for reviewing.
-
And to think that Elves head office and the UK distributor have both been in talks with Hambini for 6 months prior to the release of the review (the distributor told me this via email) ... I imagine the review could have been a whole lot worse.
Elves is on my hard avoid list.
-
It's one of the bikes that was featured so much on youtube that I definitely felt something was wrong. The raised top tube is one of the dumbest gimmicks I've seen recently, I really don't see the point, makes the bike look like it has no shoulders for a ridiculous aero gain
-
I mentioned this in the Hygge Aero thread:
Be cautious of any brand being heavily promoted online where the primary focus is on the asthetics of the frame (custom paint, UCI whatever) rather than the actual quality and performance. Makes you appreciate brands like Yishun.
The problem with the Falath EVO as I see it is it's the perfect bike to attract clicks and views for YouTube. The frame design is unique (albeit polarizing) and budget-minded customers have been looking for the next good thing since Winspace. However, in real world practicality it does not seem like YouTubers are actually using their Falath EVO as their primary bikes. Just like LTWO ERX: Sounds great on paper and for views, but not as a permanent solution yet.
Speaking of Winspace, it's interesting how 4 years later we have still yet to see a true one to one competitor to the T1500/Hyper Wheels in terms of branding, innovation, performance, and reach to the Western world. We've seen some wheel brands gain success by basically using Winspace's marketing approach, but not to the same level of success. Ironically, Winspace's success is also the reason they have been on the decline.
-
Elves Falath PRO was much better choice and has better quality than the newer version. I think the EVO and PRO have different manufacturers. Eddy from Tideace/Haidelibikes said that they manufacture for Elves since FM-CR08 is basically the PRO. I don't know what EVO is but someone in comment section said that it was originally an open mold for time trial frame
-
However, in real world practicality it does not seem like YouTubers are actually using their Falath EVO as their primary bikes. Just like LTWO ERX: Sounds great on paper and for views, but not as a permanent solution yet.
to me, this is key. If you have a spare bike, or multiple, I believe the approach to issues is totally different than only having 1 bike, which needs to be trustworthy, and that you wouldn't want to deal with issues and mechanicals on a regular basis...
that something that really draws me to someone like TraceVelo... who, although he has multiple bikes, he's always really transparent about the issues (like ERX for example which he's been a critic since the 1st video, albeit optimistic), also about having received or bought (anonymously), and he rides a lot all of his bikes
Speaking of Winspace, it's interesting how 4 years later we have still yet to see a true one to one competitor to the T1500/Hyper Wheels in terms of branding, innovation, performance, and reach to the Western world. We've seen some wheel brands gain success by basically using Winspace's marketing approach, but not to the same level of success. Ironically, Winspace's success is also the reason they have been on the decline.
I think it was a combination that'll be hard to see again... the marketing approach (which was Joe/ChinaCycling's doing, I believe) with youtubers, pushing products but also not trying to flee or hide the issues and critics, and for sure the way they arrived at western markets, offering easier ways to get the wheels, good communication, a good price (for the offering)
now although there are other brands using similar techniques, there are also lots of options out there, while Winspace was more by themselves...
I'm an outsider on this so I can be saying shit, but it's what it seems from my pov
-
I like that Hambini exposed this larp Jordain.
Dude is an absolute cancer. He does not even ride bikes, have no experience and measures the BB with some cheap aliexpress caliper claiming he an expert. But he is just some wannabe cyclist who knows shit.
His whole idea is to review as much crap as possible, act like an expert just to get paid promotions from Chinese brands. F this dude.
-
I like that Hambini exposed this larp Jordain.
Dude is an absolute cancer. He does not even ride bikes, have no experience and measures the BB with some cheap aliexpress caliper claiming he an expert. But he is just some wannabe cyclist who knows shit.
His whole idea is to review as much crap as possible, act like an expert just to get paid promotions from Chinese brands. F this dude.
Honestly he is a super Fred, i don't blame him though, if i could make vids and get free items in return for some shilling i probably would as well, albeit i wouldn't show my face or name.
-
I think of all the cycling channels I actually prefer Trace Velo. He isn't a crit bro racer or some cycling snob, he's just a dude who likes tinkering with cheap bike parts and enjoys the fitness benefits of cycling. His bike mechanic skills are probably representative of the average DIY bike mechanic as well. All these wannabe YT influencers rub me the wrong way.
-
Only cycling bro I am a fan of is Sheldon Brown. Passed away well before YT/influencer cancer spread across the world but his articles will remain golden forever.
-
I actually commend Elves for the brave and bold step with the Falath EVO. The frames in the cycling industry are becoming too similar.
This is what happens when you dare to make something different. You create a hit or a flop product. Then hopefully learn and grow in the process.
Funny thing is lots of people who are not too particular, actually love the frame. The frame package at that price is a good deal for a new/low budget cyclist.
Elves problem is that they overly focus on the looks of their frames. From day one they seek to make their bikes fancy and colorful etc.
Now they really have to focus on other aspect than just the looks.
It took so long before I saw pictures of someone actually riding the frame as part of the advertisement. They were just blasting lots of photos, slamming the looks on our faces.
Hopefully they make good with all these feedback. The brand has a huge potential in my opinion.
-
Too bad this frame looks a bit iffy.
I'm interested in the Vanyar Pro they released recently, hope Hambini does a review of that one too.
-
Hambini got this frame a review
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ksA4GA05w7k
Despite Hambini’s gripes about “other” YouTubers, Cam Nichols’s review had similar conclusions. His “carbon expert” guy had similar remarks about the Evo’s carbon quality—its shit.
What I’m really surprised is that nobody (including Hambini) is reaming the Evo for its horrendous aerodynamic properties. Rectangular tube profiles and the fattest headtube in the game. It’s so clearly a LARP of an aero bike.
-
Rectangular tube profiles and the fattest headtube in the game. It’s so clearly a LARP of an aero bike.
I agree. Beauty is in the eye of the beholder. But to me this looks like Homer Simpson’s idea of an aero bike.
-
I agree. Beauty is in the eye of the beholder. But to me this looks like Homer Simpson’s idea of an aero bike.
This bike is so ugly and such a wannabe aero race bike, that it reminds me of a guy who did put a Ferrari sticker on his Fiat coupe. This is what this bike is, a fake aero Superbike with not even fake Ferrari sticker on it.
-
GC Performance 1000 miles ride review video posted today.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=th7ndahfnMg (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=th7ndahfnMg)
-
Despite Hambini’s gripes about “other” YouTubers, Cam Nichols’s review had similar conclusions. His “carbon expert” guy had similar remarks about the Evo’s carbon quality—its shit.
What I’m really surprised is that nobody (including Hambini) is reaming the Evo for its horrendous aerodynamic properties. Rectangular tube profiles and the fattest headtube in the game. It’s so clearly a LARP of an aero bike.
I love how when the elves distributor was approached regarding cam nicholls' experience, he went and blamed it on the mechanic. Saying he didn't know how to assemble bikes correctly. Pretty bad look in my opinion.
-
At 1300 bucks, out of spec BB and janky headtube layup seems ridiculous to pass off as something you should accept as par for the course for a 'non name brand' in that GC performance vid. Par for the course of a 500 dollar frame? Yea. Par for the course for a non name brand that is well into getting close to name brand price? No.
The paint IS crap because they use vinyl stickers. A lot of these companies are doing that and it is SUPER lame. They need to stop with that if they want to establish a 'Brand lite' where it is in the middle of 'no name' frames but not a 'name brand.'
-
What I’m really surprised is that nobody (including Hambini) is reaming the Evo for its horrendous aerodynamic properties. Rectangular tube profiles and the fattest headtube in the game.
I reckon it's just because there are so many shit aspects of the frame, it'd take an eternity to list it all. Maybe his ssd can't store it all haha.
It’s so clearly a LARP of an aero bike.
This is by far the best comment ever on this forum. I'm gonna need to add it as my signature hahahaha. I'll remove it if you want, though.
-
I mentioned this in the Hygge Aero thread:
Be cautious of any brand being heavily promoted online where the primary focus is on the asthetics of the frame (custom paint, UCI whatever) rather than the actual quality and performance. Makes you appreciate brands like Yishun.
The problem with the Falath EVO as I see it is it's the perfect bike to attract clicks and views for YouTube. The frame design is unique (albeit polarizing) and budget-minded customers have been looking for the next good thing since Winspace. However, in real world practicality it does not seem like YouTubers are actually using their Falath EVO as their primary bikes. Just like LTWO ERX: Sounds great on paper and for views, but not as a permanent solution yet.
Speaking of Winspace, it's interesting how 4 years later we have still yet to see a true one to one competitor to the T1500/Hyper Wheels in terms of branding, innovation, performance, and reach to the Western world. We've seen some wheel brands gain success by basically using Winspace's marketing approach, but not to the same level of success. Ironically, Winspace's success is also the reason they have been on the decline.
Care to elaborate why you think Winspace is on the decline??
-
Under the new Chris Miller movie Hambini left this comment (attached file). Jordain larp rimmed
-
On the topic of aero bike LARPs. The winspace T1500 has a gigantic triangular downtube with the flat facing the wind and agressive corner radiuses and trailing edge tapers. Aerodynamically that's in the same ballpark as a rectangular profile. Their in-development Agile frame has the same design "feature", but with its general aesthetic of softer lines and narrower downtube the consequences are less egregious.
-
I'm curious at the current $1100 USD price point, what are better aero frames for the price? Also for a flexible rider is the bike ridable in its slammed position with the stem flush to the top tube?
-
I don't see what makes the Evo non aero or a aero larp because it's cheap.
I think people have complaints about various things but no one has said it's slow aerodynamically. Cam Nichols had it as his fastest bike in a descent he tests aero on, and he wasn't too keen on it overall.
-
Without commenting on the YouTubers, I think the best-value frame that has evidence of aero testing in development is probably the Elilee Blize (~$1700 shipped USD including bar).
Wheels, probably Hunt’s aerodynamicist line or the Zipp 303S? I cant think of a Chinese offering that has been developed in that manner.
Bars, EXS?
-
Without commenting on the YouTubers, I think the best-value frame that has evidence of aero testing in development is probably the Elilee Blize (~$1700 shipped USD including bar).
Wheels, probably Hunt’s aerodynamicist line or the Zipp 303S? I cant think of a Chinese offering that has been developed in that manner.
Bars, EXS?
Elilee looks as aerodynamic as cow on ice. It looks like V4RS, Trek Emonda and other lightweight race bikes, but aero it's not. You're billion times better off with Winspace T1500, even if it costs bit more
-
I don't see what makes the Evo non aero or a aero larp because it's cheap.
I think people have complaints about various things but no one has said it's slow aerodynamically. Cam Nichols had it as his fastest bike in a descent he tests aero on, and he wasn't too keen on it overall.
Rectangular cross-sections. Cam nichols test is hardly a scientific test. All it will show is that it's not a parachute. Easily a 20 watt margin of error with his test.
-
Without commenting on the YouTubers, I think the best-value frame that has evidence of aero testing in development is probably the Elilee Blize (~$1700 shipped USD including bar).
Wheels, probably Hunt’s aerodynamicist line or the Zipp 303S? I cant think of a Chinese offering that has been developed in that manner.
Bars, EXS?
Seen some pretty poor quality finished elilee products. I'd steer clear. Elilee's marketing copy doesn't even talk about wind tunnel, velodrome or field testing. Their cfd testing was probably done by some dude off fiver, and it looks it, too. Looks about as slippery as sandpaper.
-
Ok, but as far as being not being an “aero LARP” or answering what is the Chinese bike closest to $1100 designed with aero in mind the Blize is still a relevant answer in the context of development and process.
AFAIK the Elilee is still the only Chinese brand frame where you can find photos of the frame and prototypes in a wind tunnel along with the typical sketchy data published by bike makers as well as their CFD graphics. Maybe they faked it all but in this case it seemed designed to convince the Chinese domestic market that its in the “same class” as the Sl7 and Dogma F. While limited, it’s still more than the CFD that Winspace and Bross have shown. I suspect that Bross will show more or has shown more, I just havent found it yet.
Developed with actual aero testing doesnt mean that the bike will be faster, and the Blize is clearly not an aero bike; but its hard to get an optimized result without going through the processes needed for optimization. Frames are generally pretty marginal anyway in terms of the overall gain vs. your position on the bike, clothing etc. and the eye test isn’t great.
I personally would rather have a well built frame than an aero one, so that is where i would focus.
-
Sometimes when I spend too much time on cycling forums/videos I have to remind myself to go outside to remember how the real world operates...
Yishun/Light Carbon - Best value under $1000. I would take a $700-$800 Yishun over an $1100 Elves everyday of the week. The downside is Yishun doesn't exactly offer paint options, and their frames lean more towards all-around than aero. The performance however cannot be overstated.
Elves Falath Evo - Honestly if the aesthetics of a full aero frame at this price is that important (rather than QC and unproven performance) then a TanTan x38 is the way to go. You get custom paint, a unique looking frame for the pricepoint, and the money saved can go toward a legit set of wheels from something Leon Hu/Yuanan Wheels.
Winspace T1500 - But if you still really wanna spend $1100+ for a fully finished product and customer support, it's worth it to save/spend extra for the T1500. Or wait for the Agile release next year. It's a proven frameset. True, you could argue that buying a used aero frame from a big brand is a better buy. Something like a 2020 BMC Time/Road Machine but it's still gonna cost like around 2000. And in practice who is truly doing this with regularity?
Middlemen/Agents/Curators offer great value (maybe not here) and buffer to potential customers who are afraid to make their first Far-East purchase. As much as we in this forum love to pride ourselves on skipping the middle to buy frames/wheels to save money by going directly to OEM suppliers, the real world is a little different. I've received hundreds of messages over the years (forum/IG/FB/email) from from people basically wanting me to hold their hand during their customer experience. We just aren't as savvy at times as we believe.
I've been making videos for 3 years now. American cycling scene is huge now especially in Chicago. And yet Winspace is really the only brand that's been able to break through and become a common name around here.
-
Yishun/Light Carbon - Best value under $1000. I would take a $700-$800 Yishun over an $1100 Elves everyday of the week. The downside is Yishun doesn't exactly offer paint options, and their frames lean more towards all-around than aero. The performance however cannot be overstated.
Lightcarbon will gladly do a custom paintjob for ya, though! I think they might even commission an artist for you to do something entirely custom, if you really want.
Yishun .. well .. I got my forks in gloss black lol.
-
Ok, but as far as being not being an “aero LARP” or answering what is the Chinese bike closest to $1100 designed with aero in mind the Blize is still a relevant answer in the context of development and process.
I wouldn't get too caught up in it, I can't answer for the guy who wrote it, but the LARP comment, I'm sure, was just trying to make a point while being funny. Well, I found it hilarious, at least.
-
I don't see what makes the Evo non aero or a aero larp because it's cheap.
I think people have complaints about various things but no one has said it's slow aerodynamically. Cam Nichols had it as his fastest bike in a descent he tests aero on, and he wasn't too keen on it overall.
My thesis statement on the Elves Evo's aerodynamics is that it's a bike designed and marketed as a full-on aero road bike but if you closely examine the design itself, it seems to ignore many important principles of aerodynamics and other important considerations, and does so in such a way that prioritizes the aesthetics of aerodynamics over things that actually make it aerodynamic. This is why I call it a LARP: it's trying very hard to play the part, without substantively doing so. This "aero aesthetic" compromises other important qualities, specifically comfort, stiffness-to-weight ratio, and ease of manufacture. If an aero bike is designed carelessly like the Evo appears to have been, then all this added weight and complexity is squandered as you'll find other substantially lighter and more comfortable bikes that are just as, if not more aero.
You see western brands making this point. We have bikes like the Cannondale Supersix Evo 4 and the Tarmac SL8, which are "all-round" frames that compromise the aero aesthetic, but nonetheless are just as (if not more) aero than the full-aero frames produced by the same brand (see Tour Magazin tests thread on WW). To me this is a clear signal that the most substantial aero gains are to be made not in deep section tubes, but instead through careful implementation of aero design focused on surfaces that meet clean air. I'll get into what these features are in the next paragraph, but I'll make the point now that I doubt the Elves Falath Evo is substantially more aero than it's predecessor, or competing frames like the ICAN A22, Seka exceed, Blize, etc.
Really I have 4 big criticisms of the Elves Evo design: rectangular tube profiles, headtube and fork junction with huge cross-sectional area and bad design, enormous gaps between tires and the frame cutout, and no bottle fairing.
Rectangular tube profiles: I don't really need to explain myself here. It's objectively not as optimal as tubes with round leading edges.
Headtube: arguably it's the most important part for aerodynamics. Everyone else is working to make the headtube as narrow and aerofoil-shaped as possible. The Cannondale Supersix Evo 4 is a great example. Much ink was spilled over the specialized speed sniffer. We've known the headtube is important since forever ago, just look at the Specialized shiv from 09, which had a big nosecone strapped to it. In contrast the Evo has the widest headtube I've ever seen. Oversize bearings and no effort to taper the headtube between them. The headtube cross section is short and distinctly not-aerofoil-shaped. AND the fork crown is crazy thick.
Cutouts: cutouts work great, but they only work if the gap is minimized. Bikes that aren't trying to optimize the cutout simply don't have a substantial one (see the latest Specialized Shiv). On the other hand, the Evo pretends to have fully-faired wheel cutouts, but then in a bid to get 32mm of clearance, spoils the party with enormous spaces between the wheels and frame. This obviates the cutout entirely. It would probably be just as aero to have little to no cutout at all in this case. But the Evo has them, because the Evo is committed to the bit and needs to look like an aero bike.
Bottles: We all ride with bottles. Bike manufacturers have finally caught on to this and started fairing the bottle with the downtube instead of mounting the bottle on the trailing edge of an aerofoil like they used to, which totally spoils any aerodynamic benefit you'd get from the tube section. Elves seems to have not gotten this memo.
Now, this is just me and my eyes looking at the frame. I'm sure it's more aero than other frames. I am definitely sure many frames are more aero than the Evo. And most of all, I do not think the Evo is a good bang-for-buck in terms of aero performance for the weight and money it costs.
-
Maybe I was wrong, I actually found a photo of Elves aerodynamics research and development department.
-
Elilee looks as aerodynamic as cow on ice. It looks like V4RS, Trek Emonda and other lightweight race bikes, but aero it's not. You're billion times better off with Winspace T1500, even if it costs bit more
Other takeaway from this thread: y’all are udderestimating cows. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YPg91rCMwak
-
Dear oh dear! Poor thing, so much hate on you Falath EVO.
Such a beauty and also a big crap at the same time, depending on which community's opinion you subscribe to... lol
-
Dear oh dear! Poor thing, so much hate on you Falath EVO.
Such a beauty and also a big crap at the same time, depending on which community's opinion you subscribe to... lol
Is that Kulhavy's bike? That saddle angle lol.
-
Such a beauty and also a big crap at the same time, depending on which community's opinion you subscribe to... lol
yeah the people who regret buying one and the people satisfied they bought something else ;D
-
I joined this forum relatively recently to get an insight into users' experiences of different frames.
I had an itch to buy a new alternative justified by 3 disc brake bikes, and 4 of my family riding Flanders next spring - yes it's tenuous!
Originally looked at the Yishun 1088 but just couldn't get excited despite the good feedback, by the design, and if I wanted custom colours and a one piece cockpit, costs with delivery into the UK were similar to the Elves Falath. So that's what I've gone for.
I like different. My main bike is a 3T Strada, which in its 1 X form seems to polarise opinion. In the long and distant past when I raced I had an Ian White low profile frame in lugless oval/teardrop 753 which attracted attention and an Omega lugless track frame with small front wheel (for bunch/sprint races). So the unique (ish) of the Elves appealed. Slammed and 1 x with mechanical I reckon I can get it to around 6.5kg (my Strada is 6.1). Only downside for me was the gap at the rear end.... For someone used to fag paper time trial bikes it just doesn't look right. However wheelbase in my 46 size will be shortish and I'm prepared to accept that the tyre /seat tube gap may not make it a brick.
I'll report back. My Strada is I think pretty aero and is very comfortable (actually moreso than either my Genesis Datum or Vitus gravel, so looks can be deceptive). I won't be testing in a wind tunnel but having a very good idea on my capabilities on a 6 mile lap over many years and with a long straight downhill, I'll get a clear idea on whether this is a brick as suggested or super uncomfortable. If it doesn't beat the Strada on one, I'll sell it on but I am prepared to accept users' feedback might give it a chance compared to some on here ...the Simplon Pride 2 still has the best aero score with some of its tubes looking more rectangular than teardrop....
-
I'm glad you went ahead with this frame. This thread was getting very tiring.
Wishes for the build, looking forward to final result.
-
the Simplon Pride 2 still has the best aero score with some of its tubes looking more rectangular than teardrop....
Kamm-tail, not rectangular, very important difference.
-
I'm glad you went ahead with this frame. This thread was getting very tiring.
Wishes for the build, looking forward to final result.
No one is forcing you to read it. If you find it tiring, just move along.
-
No one is forcing you to read it. If you find it tiring, just move along.
Just applauding change in the subject. Was it too loud for your little echo chamber you got going? Took a shot in the dark but still hit the nerve.
-
If Elves was giving me a free frame, I'd LARP the $hit out of it on this forum and make all you suckers buy one! Lol
I find the blow back on that frame amusing. I mean, this is a forum for cheap carbon frames and components. If one was truly serious about their cycling, why not buy a name brand frameset and/or bike build? If you can't afford one, well go back to school and get a better paying career! Haha
-
If Elves was giving me a free frame, I'd LARP the $hit out of it on this forum and make all you suckers buy one! Lol
I find the blow back on that frame amusing. I mean, this is a forum for cheap carbon frames and components. If one was truly serious about their cycling, why not buy a name brand frameset and/or bike build? If you can't afford one, well go back to school and get a better paying career! Haha
As a counter argument, I just build bike and rides them as a hobby, and I will definitely buy the new BMC Teammachine R when the frameset becomes affordable (lower grade carbon and sale season). However, I can't fight against my DNA, and if I find a cheap and good stuff, I will buy it xD. This is why I have been buying Lightcarbon and Yishun frames
-
Just applauding change in the subject. Was it too loud for your little echo chamber you got going? Took a shot in the dark but still hit the nerve.
I sincerely hope for your sake that you aren't so pathetic and passive aggressive in your actual life. Chances are you are just as pathetic and defeated, though. Pretty common among kids these days.
-
If Elves was giving me a free frame, I'd LARP the $hit out of it on this forum and make all you suckers buy one! Lol
I find the blow back on that frame amusing. I mean, this is a forum for cheap carbon frames and components. If one was truly serious about their cycling, why not buy a name brand frameset and/or bike build? If you can't afford one, well go back to school and get a better paying career! Haha
Counter argument number 2; if I knew that the cost of building my first Chiner was just the same price as buying a newly build Merida Scultura 5000 Bahrain Edition or a Giant Propel (I just add a couple of hundred dollars) then I could've just bought those bikes lol. But I'll target Merida Scultura Race edition first if I am planning to buy some branded bikes. OR just buy more frames from Yishun or Lightcarbon :D
-
Already +500k on the bike, it definitely isn't the best bike for a chill/recovery ride haha, really stiff everywhere.
I have a slight issue with the chainstays, they flare out and my shoes are so damn long they're slightly rubbing the left chainstay when I'm out of the saddle, my Q factor is already quite big since I have Assioma pedals, might add a washer or two.
I put some clear tape so it won't damage the paint any further. The frame also didn't have any chainstay protection cover or metal cover for the BB, ordered some and might epoxy a metal cover on the chainstay
Apart from that no issues whatsoever
https://imgur.com/a/2m6DyY2
@ExclusiviteChinoise so far how is the frame holding up? Owner's experience / insight is invaluable especially to people who come here to do research on the frame.
-
As a counter argument, I just build bike and rides them as a hobby, and I will definitely buy the new BMC Teammachine R when the frameset becomes affordable (lower grade carbon and sale season). However, I can't fight against my DNA, and if I find a cheap and good stuff, I will buy it xD. This is why I have been buying Lightcarbon and Yishun frames
I just ride bikes for fitness and to supplement my strength training. The only name brand bike frame that remotely peaks my interest is the Aethos, but some interesting copycat molds are starting to trickle. I might as well build one of those down the road!
-
Counter argument number 2; if I knew that the cost of building my first Chiner was just the same price as buying a newly build Merida Scultura 5000 Bahrain Edition or a Giant Propel (I just add a couple of hundred dollars) then I could've just bought those bikes lol. But I'll target Merida Scultura Race edition first if I am planning to buy some branded bikes. OR just buy more frames from Yishun or Lightcarbon :D
If you fit onto a standard build from the likes of merida then they are definitely equal value, the difference is once you realise you most likely have to change handlebars/stem/crankset/cassette/tyres because they aren't in your desired specification the chiner build from scratch is far superior.
-
I sincerely hope for your sake that you aren't so pathetic and passive aggressive in your actual life. Chances are you are just as pathetic and defeated, though. Pretty common among kids these days.
I hope you see the irony in this. One guy says he bought the frame, I said that's good and you short your fuse. Bro you need some serious help.
Anyway I am taking your advice and moving on (from your comments at least).
-
I'm not going to delete or moderate anything, I just want to ask you all to please try and keep it respectful. Feel free to disagree with each other but leave the name-calling out of it, we don't want that type of discourse here.
-
If Elves was giving me a free frame, I'd LARP the $hit out of it on this forum and make all you suckers buy one! Lol
I find the blow back on that frame amusing. I mean, this is a forum for cheap carbon frames and components. If one was truly serious about their cycling, why not buy a name brand frameset and/or bike build? If you can't afford one, well go back to school and get a better paying career! Haha
I’m a semi-serious amateur racer on a budget. Ironically in grad school—I’m just trying to race while I’m still fairly young—I’ll be making the big bucks soon! I built up my Seka at the height of price inflation last year. I did an extensive price analysis speccing different builds in a spreadsheet, and the Seka came out on top as the best value. A big factor was the handlebar spec, racing wheels, and power meter. Once you priced those in, similar spec western builds were 2x the price. I did a similar price analysis for my lightcarbon CX bike and came to similar conclusions. I really push back on the idea that Chiner bikes are unserious. There’s a lot of geeks on a budget in this sport. If you are knowledgeable about bikes and mechanics, there’s serious savings on seriously good bike parts to be had in this space.
Now that the market has rapidly cooled, the value proposition of Chiner builds are definitely going down. I think a lower spec Supersix Evo 4 approaches the weight and price of my Seka build. If anything, the market adjustment underscores the importance of comparing premium-price Chiner frames (like the Elves Falath Evo) against western counterparts, because the savings are potentially slimmer than ever.
-
4 years since its release and the Winspace T1500 is still my choice for the price over Elves, Yoeleo, SEKA, and even the new Elilee BLIZE. However, it doesn't mean I'm not curious about eventually testing those frames. The T1500 has aged very well and Winspace spent enough budget to give themselves street credibility here in American Cycling.
T1500 is the only frame I can't see myself selling. Even over my new Giant Propel Advanced Pro.
-
Hi, just built up a ELVES FALATH EVO with their OROME TH50 wheels. Everything is fine except one thing where I need your opinion. On the front wheel I notice a slight play in the hub when I push the wheel left and right, when I knock on the wheel I can heare a rattle. Nothing of that on the back wheel which is rock solid. Through axle fixed with 6Nm and threads greased. I know the hub is a copy of a dt swiss 350 road. They have preloaded bearings installed and require a certain amount of axial force to release the pretention in order to have minimum friction. Apparently that's not perfectly working in my hub. But increasing the torque to 8Nm helps a bit. Should I increase the torque to 10-15Nm? Anyone having a similar issue? Thanks
-
Hi, just built up a ELVES FALATH EVO with their OROME TH50 wheels. Everything is fine except one thing where I need your opinion. On the front wheel I notice a slight play in the hub when I push the wheel left and right, when I knock on the wheel I can heare a rattle. Nothing of that on the back wheel which is rock solid. Through axle fixed with 6Nm and threads greased. I know the hub is a copy of a dt swiss 350 road. They have preloaded bearings installed and require a certain amount of axial force to release the pretention in order to have minimum friction. Apparently that's not perfectly working in my hub. But increasing the torque to 8Nm helps a bit. Should I increase the torque to 10-15Nm? Anyone having a similar issue? Thanks
Most thru axles are speced to somewhere into range 10-15nm. Some weight weenie axles down to 8nm. Never heard of 6nm for a thru axle.
What’s the rated torque spec from elves?
-
6Nm written on the axle which came with the frame
-
I cranked up the axle torque to 12Nm and it seams to be better now. Not perfect because there is still a tiny bit of play but I can live with that I guess.
-
I cranked up the axle torque to 12Nm and it seams to be better now. Not perfect because there is still a tiny bit of play but I can live with that I guess.
That doesn't sound right. I'd contact the manufacturer to get a warranty replacement.
-
I consider myself now as an expert in DT Swiss hub design ;D :P
The ELVES front hub is basically a copy of the DT Swiss 350 road straightpull and the back hub a DT Swiss 240.
On my front hub copy the bearings were not properly pressed in, therefore they had too much clearance or in other words the preload on the bearings was too low. So I pressed them in and since then they are rock solid and smooth.
And I cranked up the axle torque to 12Nm.
-
That's a sharp looking frame! I saw one Japanese YT'er using his Falath EVO for cyclocross making full use of the wider tire clearance!
Regarding the front fork TA mount being a bit loose, one of my carbon frames also had a similar issue, but on the rear TA. I thought my frame was out of spec, but the vendor recommended I just torque it down until there was no more play. Eventually it settled into place after awhile and didn't require being tightened down as much. Did the frame ship with plastic thru axle holders in place? If so, it might have stretched the fork out of spec slightly.
-
Badass looking ride!
-
That's a sharp looking frame! I saw one Japanese YT'er using his Falath EVO for cyclocross making full use of the wider tire clearance!
Regarding the front fork TA mount being a bit loose, one of my carbon frames also had a similar issue, but on the rear TA. I thought my frame was out of spec, but the vendor recommended I just torque it down until there was no more play. Eventually it settled into place after awhile and didn't require being tightened down as much. Did the frame ship with plastic thru axle holders in place? If so, it might have stretched the fork out of spec slightly.
Tire clearance on this frame is huge, even a 32 looks small ;D
No the fork is fine and the play in the bearings is gone as I mentioned. I think it was just poorly assembled or lack of quality control.
-
I really love that shade of blue. Great job! Do you recall what color code it was?
-
I really love that shade of blue. Great job! Do you recall what color code it was?
Thanks, I am very happy the color turns out to look in real because on screen it's always a gamble.
According to ELVES the color code is dark blue B-003. Initially I wanted blue B-005 but that one is obsolete. Attached is a frame with B-005.
-
Bike build completed - just some tweaks needed on brakes.
Weight comes out at 6.8kg as pictured - set up for next few months with gears to get up Flanders hills. Will probably put bigger ring and my Farsports 69mm tubs for summer (calm) days which will lose about 300g.
Will give a view on how it rides in next few weeks.
-
Is that a smaller size? Getting it down 6.8kg is impressive.
-
Yes. Size 46.
Sram Red mechanical (with Ratio Tech convertor to get to 12 speed) helps too. Elite Edge wheelset pretty good weight with Michelin Power Cup Clinchers/ TPU tubes. Otherwise Galfer rotors, Hope brakes, Kocevlo (Ali Express) saddle, Pass Quest Chainring, and titanium bolts.
Only real weightweenie item is Aerolite Pedals.
-
Strange drivetrain. Your front ring looks tiny, do you have 10T at the back? Your cassette doesn't look especially big. It's an aero bike. I don't get it :)
-
It's set up for my Tour of Flanders sportive ride with sons.
40t front, 10-33 rear as top end speed on day isn't priority but giving myself a chance up the cobbled 20% climbs is!
In summer mode, in UK, I'll be riding 48t front and either 10-28 or 10-33 rear.
As a (long time ago) trackie that combo will get me as fast as I'll ever need.