Chinertown
Chinese Carbon MTB => 29er => Topic started by: monocongo on May 30, 2021, 08:09:03 PM
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I'm considering a frame that looks to be reasonably close to a Specialized Epic Evo, which is the bike I thought I'd get before I decided to build something similar instead.
TanTan FM038: http://www.tantancycling.com/index.php?_m=mod_product&_a=view&p_id=916
Can anyone comment on this frame and/or any experiences with TanTan? Are there other comparable frames I should consider?
Thanks in advance for any comments or suggestions.
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Haven't bought it to test but icanbikes s24 looks the fit.
http://chinertown.com/index.php/topic,3098.0.html
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Consider Ican S3 - https://icancycling.com/products/xc-full-suspension-mtb-bike-frame-s3#
66° HA at 120mm fork, and can take a 165x45 shock to gear 112mm travel. Very up to date geo, identical to FM936 from Carbonda. Longer reach than Epic Evo. Little bit heavier. FM936 comes in a superlight frame option but the longest travel shock you'll fit is 165x42.5.
*disclaimer* I chose the Ican S3 as it ticked all the geo boxes for me. I've done nearly 200km on it now and I love it. It's definitely on the chubbier side and I am working on that, have changed the front to a carbon wheel and lightweight hub, will do the rear when I get a bit more cash together.
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Ican S3, FM936 and the FM909 are the only frames I'm aware of that are short travel with a slacker front end. All 3 have steeper seat tube angles than the Spec, but for me that's a plus.
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If you looking at size M, the Topcarbon TCSF046/Lexon Riot in M or L (reach brackets the Epic Evo M) is essentially identical in geometry (BB drop, head angle, seat angle, chainstays) using a -1.5 degree angle headset (68 to 66.5) like the Works Components Angle Headset and going 110/120 travel. You could even go with a -2.0 headset if you want to go a tad slacker.
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Reviving this old post since it now looks like the Chinese bootleggers have finally made an Epic Evo clone: https://www.aliexpress.us/item/3256804496327363.html?spm=a2g0o.ppclist.product.96.6a72bUR2bUR2Nn&pdp_npi=2%40dis%21USD%21US%20%24665.00%21%24625.10%21%21%21%21%21%402101d1b916672659113901621eb41f%2112000030085464825%21btf&_t=pvid%3A07fd90aa-37ac-400b-b241-e23cb59e0795&afTraceInfo=1005004682642115__pc__c_ppc_item_bridge__xxxxxx__1667265911&gatewayAdapt=glo2usa&_randl_shipto=US
If anyone has bought this or another similar frame I am definitely interested in reading your comments. I can't find an Epic Evo in the shops here and I'd prefer to build my own using this or another similar frame, but I'll feel better about taking the plunge if I'm not the first in the water.
BTW I ended up building an XC FS bike with a frame from Tantan FM078 (similar to the FM038 I mentioned at the start of this thread), nothing but good times so far.
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I'm curious about this frame as well. I was set to purchase the Carbonda FM909 until I saw this post. However, I'm still on the fence because I have a question/concern with the rear triangle. It appears that the seller provides two options for the link: 1) threaded link for a 200x50 Brain shock and 2) normal link for a 190x40 standard shock. However, there is only one option for the rear triangle itself. By comparison, Specialized offers two different links and two different rear triangles depending on which version of the Epic you buy. The Specialized Epic rear triangle has the threaded link, bolt holes on the non-drive side swingarm for the Brain hose, and a larger hole near the rear axle for the Brain itself to install on the rear triangle. The Specialized Epic EVO rear triangle has the regular link, and it eliminates both the bolt holes on the swingarm and the extra hole for the Brain near the rear axle.
I reached out to the seller about this, and they confirmed they only provide a single version of the rear triangle whether you want to use a Brain shock or not. It has the holes on the swingarm, which is not too big of a deal to me, I can just install some bolts to plug them up. I am concerned, however, with the hole for the Brain. Since I plan on using a regular rear shock, the seller said they will provide a rubber stopper to plug the hole in the back.
I have asked for photos of this and will post them if/when I get them.
Anyone have experience with a Brain shock that could comment on whether I should be concerned with this rubber stopper design?
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Oh, and here are a couple of pictures of the mounting bolts on the swingarm for the Brain shock hose, as well as the Brain mounting location near the rear axle.
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What exactly is the brain shock/system? Why are there holes in the seatstay
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A starting place to learn about the Brain system is on Specialized's website:
https://www.specialized.com/gb/en/stories/brain-technology (https://www.specialized.com/gb/en/stories/brain-technology)
Depends on which holes you're asking about. First, there are threaded holes on the seatstay used to to mount the hose that runs between the shock and the "Brain" mounted on the rear triangle near the axle. Second, there is a larger hole to mount the Brain itself, since it has kind of an "L" shape. When installed, part of the Brain is external on the frame, part of it is internal in the frame. The larger hole for the internal part of the Brain is what I am questioning how well a rubber stopper will work to protect.
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Interesting, and I wonder if you buy the brain version of this frame with the shock does it come with the brain system? And then will it be reliable. Probably safer to just get the standard version.
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Does anybody have concerns that advertised frame is not EVO?
Just Epic and Epic EVO have different construction... Thus there are also doubts and about declared frame geometry...
Epic
(https://i.ibb.co/1G2J2KG/image.png) (https://ibb.co/1G2J2KG)
Epic Evo
(https://i.ibb.co/W3LT5S5/image-1.png) (https://ibb.co/W3LT5S5)
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Does anybody have concerns that advertised frame is not EVO?
I think there will be doubts no matter what until you have the frame in your hands.
And as far as the Epic FS frame without Brain, that would be my preference personally. People have been removing the brain for a while now. Getting it serviced is a pain from what I’ve read.
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Hello, so nobody never try this Epic Clone on the forum?
Thanks
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I think interest in this frame will be pretty low, because it's usually more risky to buy clones. When you buy an "open mold" frame, it's often a design that several manufacturers and sellers will use, it's been engineered and tested, and there are a lot of frames sold to help refine the design (see FM936 being made by Flybike and sold by Carbonda and ICAN, then also retailed by Vitus, NS, Boltcutter, etc). Often times clones aren't engineered, because they just copy the geometry of a known frame, but may not know the layup or material type. This is just a generality, it's possible an open mold frame is poor and a clone is high quality, but that's not as common.
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... (see FM936 being made by Flybike and sold by Carbonda and ICAN, then also retailed by Vitus, NS, Boltcutter, etc) ...
I think the mold is made by Flybike, and some of the carbon frames, but not all. NS bikes designed the bike frame and saved money on the frame mold, by forgoing exclusivity (On the front triangle mold). So Flybike gave NS bikes a deal on the mold, and then sells the mold to other companies like ICAN. Carbonda, ICAN, Vitus and Boltcutter could, in theory, all use different carbon layups for the same Flybike frame mold. That's why we see different quality and weights on the same frames from ICAN and Carbonda.
Carbonda is a good company to buy from because they are the B2C subsidiary of the B2B Flybike-asia. Also, open-design would be more correct, since open mold means something else.
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I'm pretty certain NS didn't design anything ... AFAIK they're purely a catalogue brand. They've tried to claim with both the 936 and others that they either designed it or had significant input, were called out and then fell silent.
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...were called out ...
Really?!?
I have the feeling too, fly bike asia have competent designers.
However in the case of the CFR-505, Thesis who took an exclusivity for a while, suggested improvements. That are now part of the frame they sell.
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I'm pretty certain NS didn't design anything ... AFAIK they're purely a catalogue brand. They've tried to claim with both the 936 and others that they either designed it or had significant input, were called out and then fell silent.
Are you sure? They also had 120mm rear travel available from the start. It seems like the only reason we have it because they lost exclusivity?
I'm not saying that Flybike doesn't have designers, but I think they are more mold and manufacturing focused.
https://nsbikes.com/introducing-the-ns-bikes-synonym,480,pl.html
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They were called out by community members, and then either FBA or Carbonda directly commented when asked, confirming that NS had nothing to do with the design process. Not my story, others posted about it here and elsewhere.
Catalogue brands rarely employ anybody capable of doing any design or engineering work. NS may have requested a 120mm option when FBA didn't have one planned (we don't know). But that's a long way from design. FBA and similar operations are a one-stop-shop. Their focus is not on OEM work (not even sure they do it?), they're primarily an ODM.
It's not like NS are the only ones pretending they design, though. Lots claim it. Very few do it. Vitus (CRC / Wiggle brand) are a classic one.
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They were called out by community members, and then either FBA or Carbonda directly commented when asked, confirming that NS had nothing to do with the design process. Not my story, others posted about it here and elsewhere.
Catalogue brands rarely employ anybody capable of doing any design or engineering work. NS may have requested a 120mm option when FBA didn't have one planned (we don't know). But that's a long way from design. FBA and similar operations are a one-stop-shop. Their focus is not on OEM work (not even sure they do it?), they're primarily an ODM.
It's not like NS are the only ones pretending they design, though. Lots claim it. Very few do it. Vitus (CRC / Wiggle brand) are a classic one.
Sorry RDY, Can you show me what you mean when you say they were called out?
Over two years ago when I built my FM936, I got Enigma rims from an NS retailer. They were surprised to learn about the FM936 and they talked to NS about it. NS said that was the factory they use and I assumed they gave up exclusivity for a discount on the frame mold. I think NS was involved with the bike design. Vitus and other rebrands of the frame came later.
Really?!?
I have the feeling too, fly bike asia have competent designers.
However in the case of the CFR-505, Thesis who took an exclusivity for a while, suggested improvements. That are now part of the frame they sell.
I agree. Flybike clearly has expertise with frame mold design. I'm sure building carbon frame molds for mass manufacturing has its own difficulties. I feel like they invested a lot in bike frame molding and now have competent bike designers to help them grow.
I asked Adam and he says that NS and Flybike worked together to bring us Frame Mold #936
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NS Bikes has its own designers. I'm sure - I'm also from Poland :)
Anyhow FM936 geometry is great. Especialy it ascend awesome.
I tested it this season racing MTB marathons.
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Interestingly, the FM1001, FM1002, and FM1003 were all developed in house (by Carbonda and Flybike). So I have no doubt that they have good designers too.
I'm excited to see what they do next!
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Sorry RDY, Can you show me what you mean when you say they were called out?
Over two years ago when I built my FM936, I got Enigma rims from an NS retailer. They were surprised to learn about the FM936 and they talked to NS about it. NS said that was the factory they use and I assumed they gave up exclusivity for a discount on the frame mold. I think NS was involved with the bike design. Vitus and other rebrands of the frame came later.
I agree. Flybike clearly has expertise with frame mold design. I'm sure building carbon frame molds for mass manufacturing has its own difficulties. I feel like they invested a lot in bike frame molding and now have competent bike designers to help them grow.
I asked Adam and he says that NS and Flybike worked together to bring us Frame Mold #936
Like I say. It wasn't my story ... if this forum had a better search function I'd find it. On that note, at minimum, can we not have an in-thread search function? It'd prevent a lot of the same questions and threads being constantly posted because nobody can find what they're looking for.