Chinertown
Chinese Carbon Road Bikes => Road Bike Frames, Wheels & Components => Topic started by: samky on November 15, 2024, 01:02:17 PM
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Well about four weeks ago, I lost my long loved (and abused) Trek Emonda sl6 to a gnarly chain drop due to my negligence. Lost about 7-8 layers of cf near the BB and could probably poke a hole through it if I tried lol. Anyway, toyed with the idea of fixing it myself with a shotty DIY kit (only thing cost effective alternative of buying legit materials), having it professionally repaired or simply getting a new bike. Decided to go with the later, but keep the Emonda on the wahoo and maybe DIY patch it.
I've since started pulling the trigger on a few parts and am now looking for a road bike disc frame. Trying to keep the total build around $2500 total. Have everything but the frame, handlebars, BB, tires, rotors/pads. Currently in it for a total of $1140.
My riding these days typically consist of solo 20-40 miles with approximately 1000-2500 feet of elevation gain.
Been lurking these forums/reddit/youtube for the past week and have narrowed it down to a few choices.
Elves Falath EVO+ - seems like a decent brand with above average china customer service, slightly overpriced for what it is though - some people love it and say the product is great, some say its a fad driven by youtubers - My dilemma with this one is only the Evo is reviewed and it seems that Elves addressed some of the negative feedback with the evo+? at $1210 for the frame+bars I'm not sure it would be worth the small price difference of a nicer frame like the winspace 1550 or 2nd hand frame from a big brand.
Light carbon R017D - this one I was quoted at $730 total. Seems like decent geometry for how I ride and the price is right, but my dilemma with this one is all the negatives I've seen about the quality recently. I know most of these frames coming from china (and even some big brands) are hit or miss but not sure if the potential headache of dealing with a qc mishap is worth the lower price.
Winspace 1550 1st or 2nd gen - I think this one would be a great choice from everything I've seen/read about them, but the price puts me well over the $2500 budget. Unless they offer some killer Black Friday deals, which then I would hold out on buying one if its similarly priced to the Evo+
2nd hand big name frame - my last resort choice which might be the best choice, but could also come with some major headaches if I cant find one local and inspect it myself prior to purchase.
Anyhoo, just wondering if I've overlooked any notable frames/distributors producing quality road frames below $1200 shipped. Or if anyone has recent first hand experience with these brands or has insight to any black friday sales that would be worth waiting for. Thanks!
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I'd never buy an elves or a winspace (chinese "brands" so you pay for the brand but your resale value is still trash, so i think it makes much more sense to buy chinese OEM for ~ half the price). They also spend way to much money on influencers for me to trust them, or be interested.
The 17D has a down tube shaped like a school bus, that's a hard pass for me, i do way too much riding on the flat to deliberately ride a brick.
I'd go with the speeder 55 something. Great reputation, looks lovely, modern, light. You'd be within budget easily.
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Serge is correct that the smartest choice is to buy an unbranded carbon frame straight from the manufacturer. Personally I took advantage of Winspace’s massive black Friday deals last year on a T1550 gen 1, and I am in love with it. I dont care about the resell argument at all since I plan to ride this bike for a very long time. Plus with Winspace you can just use your card and not have to deal with paypal/(feels mega sketchy to me) bank transfers. So I vote you get a Winspace! But I am biased
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I'm with Serge on this one. If you go China, go full China!
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Serge is correct that the smartest choice is to buy an unbranded carbon frame straight from the manufacturer. Personally I took advantage of Winspace’s massive black Friday deals last year on a T1550 gen 1, and I am in love with it. I dont care about the resell argument at all since I plan to ride this bike for a very long time. Plus with Winspace you can just use your card and not have to deal with paypal/(feels mega sketchy to me) bank transfers. So I vote you get a Winspace! But I am biased
Thanks everyone for the feedback, I agree that the extra $ for the branding probably isn't worth it, other than slightly better customer service and more reviews. Although I really dont plan on reselling either unless the bike doesnt fit (still a newbie when it comes to fit, but using bikeinsights to compare dimensions). Ill take a look into speeder, serge. And Macedingle, if you dont mind me asking, how much did you pay for the t1550 frame during black friday?
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Thanks everyone for the feedback, I agree that the extra $ for the branding probably isn't worth it, other than slightly better customer service and more reviews. Although I really dont plan on reselling either unless the bike doesnt fit (still a newbie when it comes to fit, but using bikeinsights to compare dimensions). Ill take a look into speeder, serge. And Macedingle, if you dont mind me asking, how much did you pay for the t1550 frame during black friday?
It was $1230. https://chinertown.com/index.php/topic,4739.msg55639.html#msg55639
That is a link to my build thread with pricing on the whole build.
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I'm considering similar frames as you. I've narrowed it down to the Velobuild 268 and the SC-Speeder R55D. The Velobuild is more affordable and offers the option for custom paint, but it's slightly heavier.
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Well the black Friday deals from Winspace are not great, with stacking discount codes Frame + Bar would be around $1500. With your budget I would look at Speeder or Velobuild 268 then. Pandapodium also has the Yoeleo R12 on sale for under $1200
These lower quality black friday deals that have come out so far are wild considering the strength of USD vs Yuan. US consumers will see small discounts compared to 2023, on products that have seen price increases since then.
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https://www.brossbikes.com/en/bikes/bikeList?bikeName=VAGABOND%20AERO&cateId=19
Excellent price for complete bike if you take the Shimano 105/Ultegra di2 version, the frame is separately ~1000$. Modern geometry and aerodynamics, but you will need to figure out how to bring it. Seka Exceed can also be found in China for ~$1000 or a little more.
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Ciclisti.cc will have them eventually, though with a ~700€ markup
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Full Ultegra di2, 50mm carbon wheels, weight ~8kg — 18000rmb/2500$. Even in China, I have not yet found a bike that can compete with this offer, taking into account all spes..
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As the resident in-floooo-ennn-sirrr in this forum I have reviewed brands from $500 frames upwards of $4000. We are all free to spend our money however we deem important. Just keep in mind our personal purchases neither make us more righteous or shrewd than the next person.
Some the most of popular brands in this forum I have worked with: VeloBuild, TanTan, Yishun/LightCarbon, Yoeleo, Winspace. The list goes on. Who would have thought affordable OEM brands also spend money on influencers to market their products too. Let's hope I don't start working with Speeder...
If you have a hard cap at $1200 for the frame I would either just buy a VeloBuild 268 and spend the rest of the money towards upgrading to the best set of wheels/components you can. Frame is important, but an overall optimized bike experience is more important. TanTan is also a great alternative as they have a wider selection of frames versus VeloBuild. TanTan is constantly releasing new frames which is great to see.
Yishun/LightCarbon make incredible frames for the price. Stiff, more good reviews than bad, and easy to work on. You'll just have to see which frames are available to general public for sale and select a frame that fits your general geometry.
Now if you can magically stretch the budget to $1500 I personally would look at the latest Tavelo Arow (currently on BF sale). It's surprisingly incredible to ride. I might argue this bike could easily consolidate my Giant Propel, Winspace T1500, Tavelo Attack, and all my other bikes (except my SL8) into a single bike. It's that good. Still testing though. Perhaps Speeder can sell you one of their frames similar to Tavelo. But easily the most well-rounded bike I've ridden under $2000. Another option if you can stretch is a used Giant TCR. Especially for the type of terrain you ride.
This is a controversial take, but I've noticed that the rise in ultra affordable frames has inadvertently made cheap frames the "fast fashion" of bike trends. Disposal if you will. You may love your affordable frame but you may also find yourself just wanting "a little more." This is perfectly normal. I felt this way with my original VeloBuild 168. Might be a good idea to just save a little more to ultimately get the frame you really want. A frame you'll be happy to keep for years.
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Full Ultegra di2, 50mm carbon wheels, weight ~8kg — 18000rmb/2500$. Even in China, I have not yet found a bike that can compete with this offer, taking into account all spes..
OP stated he only needs a frame
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This is a controversial take, but I've noticed that the rise in ultra affordable frames has inadvertently made cheap frames the "fast fashion" of bike trends. Disposal if you will. You may love your affordable frame but you may also find yourself just wanting "a little more." This is perfectly normal. I felt this way with my original VeloBuild 168. Might be a good idea to just save a little more to ultimately get the frame you really want. A frame you'll be happy to keep for years.
This is one of the reasons that I want with my Winspace T1550 Gen 1 instead of something like a Velo build 268. I understand a lot of people are on this form to get a cheap performance bike but something about having that brand behind it makes it feel a little more luxurious for the long haul.
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The Bigrock Aero should be added to your list, lower on the price list as well.
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This is one of the reasons that I want with my Winspace T1550 Gen 1 instead of something like a Velo build 268. I understand a lot of people are on this form to get a cheap performance bike but something about having that brand behind it makes it feel a little more luxurious for the long haul.
I've spoken to hundreds of individuals here in Chicago. From 30-year recreational enthusiasts to Cat 1 crit racers to. We actually had a local U23 athlete who raced exclusively on a Winspace T1500/Hyper 50 setup until he was eventually picked up by a continental (or conti-pro?) team in Europe.
Over 4 years of doing this whole YouTube thing. And still the only brands I can convince folks here to buy from are Winspace, Yoeleo, and to some extent FarSports. That's literally it. The western brand culture has a powerful stronghold here. Rightfully so with local dealer support. But there seems to be a proven trust with those aforementioned brands versus me trying to explain how they could save money with TanTan, Light Bicycle, or VeloBuild.
Branding and customer experience is still important to those who don't waste hours on the internet like myself.
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I am sort of the opposite of @patliean1 in the sense that I have zero inclination to be an influencer and will probably never make a YouTube video about bikes. However, I do sustain my bike hobby through a bike accessory business which is largely done via 3d prints. It has also allowed me to afford a few adjacent projects/prototypes, including (e.g., a Ti frame, modified track bars for road, and picking parts for a new wheelset to test some thoughts around the Conti 111 tire).
The 1st was a bad business idea, the 2nd was a missed opportunity, and the 3rd I expected the tariff situation to kill, but it's led me to a more long-term purchase mentality for frames. In that vein, three frames are interesting choices, IMO for going the low-cost China route.
- Speeder SC-R55D: I have never bought a frame from them, but I do have experience with their forks and bars / stem combos, and I believe in their quality. The use of UDH is a plus for future compatibility, but also because bent hangers are the thing that i hated most about my open mold frames and why all my bikes currently run the same hanger (the syntace x12)
- Bigrock Sohtea Team (or regular): I think with the Panda Podium sale, this fits in your budget, and with some good FB marketplace / eBay skills, you might be able to also work in a wheel upgrade. The thing I like about this frame is that it uses a round seatpost with an external seat clamp, so getting your position dialed will be easier/cheaper, and this, more than anything else aero will make you fast vs. slow. Also worth noting that slipping or stuck seat posts are a common frustration with cheap frames, so this one avoids that trap too.
- Ican FL1: if you are OK with a little more weight but don't want that horrible brand name, this is an alternative to the Bigrock. I
I haven't ridden any of these bikes, so I defer to others for their expertise, but I would consider these 3 bikes in your price range for those two reasons.
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However, I do sustain my bike hobby through a bike accessory business which is largely done via 3d prints.
If it's not a secret, may I know what kind of accessories you print? Or direct me to your website/product page?
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OP stated he only needs a frame
The frame is available separately, I mentioned this in my first message, but completed bike for this price and a set of characteristics cannot leave me indifferent.
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Over 4 years of doing this whole YouTube thing. And still the only brands I can convince folks here to buy from are Winspace, Yoeleo, and to some extent FarSports. That's literally it. The western brand culture has a powerful stronghold here. Rightfully so with local dealer support. But there seems to be a proven trust with those aforementioned brands versus me trying to explain how they could save money with TanTan, Light Bicycle, or VeloBuild.
Branding and customer experience is still important to those who don't waste hours on the internet like myself.
If only you could see my wife's face, who works in banking, when I tried to tell her I wanted to Paypal/ Wire Transfer to a FACTORY IN CHINA to buy a frame. There is something more about an actual brand, it really is us forum members that have been here awhile that would go the even cheaper direct from factory route. It took me 2 years of being on this forum to even entertain the idea of buying from Velobuild/Lightcarbon.
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If it's not a secret, may I know what kind of accessories you print? Or direct me to your website/product page?
~50% headset covers to convert to different internal cable routing systems, 50% mounts for dynaplug tools. I done / do some custom stuff too. It's a cool little business. https://aprotobike.com/
I generally prefer to be just a person on forums like these and on Weightweenies rather than push products. After all, I am here to learn what I can about what other people are thinking. In my opinion, there is greater variation here than there is in the mainstream Western forums. Some of it is a different product development approach, for sure.
I ride quite a bit too, so between regular wear and tear and using the bikes to test different mounts headset adapters, etc., being able to swap parts and build / rebuild the bikes makes me have a bit of a different perspective than most.
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~50% headset covers to convert to different internal cable routing systems, 50% mounts for dynaplug tools. I done / do some custom stuff too. It's a cool little business. https://aprotobike.com/
That's awesome! Well done! How do you find your clients / market to your clients?
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~50% headset covers to convert to different internal cable routing systems, 50% mounts for dynaplug tools. I done / do some custom stuff too. It's a cool little business. https://aprotobike.com/
I generally prefer to be just a person on forums like these and on Weightweenies rather than push products. After all, I am here to learn what I can about what other people are thinking. In my opinion, there is greater variation here than there is in the mainstream Western forums. Some of it is a different product development approach, for sure.
I ride quite a bit too, so between regular wear and tear and using the bikes to test different mounts headset adapters, etc., being able to swap parts and build / rebuild the bikes makes me have a bit of a different perspective than most.
Doh! I just realized you and I have already spoken on Instagram in the past. You offer up great products my friend! May need you to design a lower stack FSA no69 headset cover 8)
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That's awesome! Well done! How do you find your clients / market to your clients?
I do place some ads. I've worked with a few smaller teams and sold stuff to mechanics associated with some larger ones. Sometimes when verifying addresses, I get some interesting additional details. The one thing that confounds me is how many pro athletes, cycling-related and otherwise, have bought dynaplug holders. I have no idea how these people found me, but I won't complain.
Doh! I just realized you and I have already spoken on Instagram in the past. You offer up great products my friend! May need you to design a lower stack FSA no69 headset cover 8)
Yeah, I've sort of accidentally stepped into a gap for people who are willing to give up compatibility with cables for lower stack or better aesthetics. I am sure I can do something that looks better than what FSA came up with. I have been getting TPU inserts printed too so that hole isn't massive.
We can talk at at length about internal cable routing systems and their design, but specific to buying a frame direct from a factory, I would make sure to buy one that takes a 1.5" upper and lower bearing. Putting in a decent-quality headset is an excellent thing to do when building up a bike, but also, these systems require pretty high preloads, and some of the cheaper stuff doesn't seem to handle it well.