Chinertown
Chinese Carbon MTB => 29er => Topic started by: SARED on December 14, 2017, 03:24:05 AM
-
All very simillar, CS-218 are the lightest, but 18.5” frames fits me best. (Long inside leg, short torso). I am NOT looking at the Workswell 063 or 057 frames as they are big bulky old and heavy designs. The MB01 have great geometry but looks bulky/awkward with the seat stay vibration damper.. slightly heavier than CS-218. The CS-887-SL have a massive 65mm BB drop and heavier than MB01, but TT are spot on correct lenght.
Have anyone build a CS-218 or CS-887-SL or LCM904 from Yishin Bike?
-
This is the Yishun LCM904 frame
-
Here are the geometry for the CS-887-SL 18.5” frame
-
Those frames are definitely lighter but the chainstays are way too long for my liking. I don't understand why all of the generic frames are still using 440mm stays or longer. Even full suspension 29er's are under that now.
Other than not being the lightest, the WW-062 is one of the more modern non-boost frames. Plenty long enough in the TT at 620mm for the 18.5" and short enough CS's at 430mm. I guess I'm just confused on why you're saying that the WW-062 is bulky and has old geometry. I can definitely vouch for the quality of products and customer service you will get from XMCarbonSpeed but the CS-887 has relatively old geo with a TT under 610 and CS at 440 for the 18.5". But that is just me, I tend to like my TT's long and stems and chainstays short.
-
I have the MB01 and very happy with it. Used it in a few races and have over 3000 trail miles on it to date. Having BMX history and experience, I wanted an XC bike that was extremely nimble and agile. This bike has a superb riding experience for that. Easy to do wheelies, stoppies, track stands, etc. My build is 20.3 lbs with GX drive train, Hope X2 Brakes, and Fox 32 SC Factory fork. XX1 would put it sub-20.
-
Ok old should be refrased as trusted / proven. Bulky More directed to the 057 (1280+-40g thats heavy). I looked at 062, it’s a good choice, also proven, on/off coms with seller, had/ have some issues with internal cable routing.
The better question are: All the other mentioned frames vs the 062 frame.
My perfect TT are 609mm With a 90mm stem. thus with long legs and short arms a 620TT will give me a +-80mm stem depending on the reach. (I don’t worry that much about Stack as i have long legs...i don’t have such big kahona’s
-
All very simillar, CS-218 are the lightest, but 18.5” frames fits me best. (Long inside leg, short torso). I am NOT looking at the Workswell 063 or 057 frames as they are big bulky old and heavy designs. The MB01 have great geometry but looks bulky/awkward with the seat stay vibration damper.. slightly heavier than CS-218. The CS-887-SL have a massive 65mm BB drop and heavier than MB01, but TT are spot on correct lenght.
Have anyone build a CS-218 or CS-887-SL or LCM904 from Yishin Bike?
I have not built any of the frames that you listed, but I am looking to a new frame as well as you.
Take a look at the frames below, perhaps you may add them to your list:
WM07 short chainstay: 430
https://www.alibaba.com/product-detail/Winow-2017-mtb-carbon-frame-29er_60594656804.html?spm=a2700.7724838.2017115.206.5e1f548feAgXuQ (https://www.alibaba.com/product-detail/Winow-2017-mtb-carbon-frame-29er_60594656804.html?spm=a2700.7724838.2017115.206.5e1f548feAgXuQ)
QTour M03 original geometry
https://qtour.en.alibaba.com/product/60567728987-804584786/OEM_Factory_UD_29_DISC_BRAKE_Carbon_MTB_Frame_M03.html?spm=a2700.8304367.prge37c812.21.39af34cfMSHjM8 (https://qtour.en.alibaba.com/product/60567728987-804584786/OEM_Factory_UD_29_DISC_BRAKE_Carbon_MTB_Frame_M03.html?spm=a2700.8304367.prge37c812.21.39af34cfMSHjM8)
VB-M-095 very light
http://www.velobuildmall.com/velobuild-2018-mtb-29er-carbon-fiber-frame-vb-m-095_p0101.html (http://www.velobuildmall.com/velobuild-2018-mtb-29er-carbon-fiber-frame-vb-m-095_p0101.html)
-
Ok old should be refrased as trusted / proven. Bulky More directed to the 057 (1280+-40g thats heavy). I looked at 062, it’s a good choice, also proven, on/off coms with seller, had/ have some issues with internal cable routing.
The better question are: All the other mentioned frames vs the 062 frame.
My perfect TT are 609mm With a 90mm stem. thus with long legs and short arms a 620TT will give me a +-80mm stem depending on the reach. (I don’t worry that much about Stack as i have long legs...i don’t have such big kahona’s
It may not be for everyone but the trend is definitely going towards longer TT's with shorter stems. I transitioned that way over the past couple of years. Started with a 605 TT, 100mm stem, and 685mm wide bars. Now I'm at 620+ TT's, 50mm stems, and 760mm wide bars. I have 3 bikes, all with the same bar / stem combo, 2 have 620mm TT and one has 621mm. I've tried 35mm stems with 800mm bars but it's just too wide for me. For reference, I'm just over 5'11" with relatively normal proportions.
I have the 062 and I love it. But you are correct with the communication being hit or miss. And it isn't the lightest. My 18.5" frame with BSA BB came in at 1198g. If it ever fails, I would probably go for the CS-496 and have to get some boost wheels for it. If XMCarbonspeed has what you are looking for, it's definitely the safest option to go with.
-
Thanks Wal-ter for the M01 comment - indeed a good frame, as can be seen on the posts in the forum.
bxcc.. thanks for your imput. I agree, with my Scott Spark i swopped the 100mm stem to a 70mm and at first it felt very twitchy but way more responsive, after a couple of rides i loved it! Both my bikes had +-440 Rc's up to now, i am sure i'll feel the difference if i go for a 430 RC.
710 Bars works perfect for me.
i am not likely to buy a frame that have not been discussed on this forum, and shipping cost are a big deal killer for me. Thus free shipping on AliXpress are my best option...That puts Workswell top of my list and Xiply second.
The Geo on Yishun LCM904 and Xiamen CS-218 are identical but BB choice.
With same Geo the choice boils down to Seat tube size and wheel size. I'll rather take the 2.35" and 27.2mm options as i won't ever go dropper on this frame and more tyre clearance with wider rims (which does pull the tyre wider as my Brother in law found out on his Spark 900 SL and AM Classic Wide Lighning rimms... a 2,25 did not fit but did on 19mm ali rims)
Weight wise:
Lighter = more expensive = flimsier = Much better chance of failure
Slightly Heavier = cheaper = stronger = Less chance of failure
Thus i do think a couple of grams extra are not so bad to live with ..thats frame and rims.
I just pulled the trigger on a set of Carbon hoops from SpeedSafe on AliX. 365+-10g , 160kg rider weight, Asym 25Depth, 23w 28outer.
-
I just pulled the trigger on a set of Carbon hoops from CarbonSpeed on AliX.
Peter opened an AliExpress shop ?
-
My mistake... SpeedSafe not CarbonSpeed. For the price i took the chance. Will see if they last.
-
Looked at Velobike M091 geo, have an 445 RC and 615 TT... Long rear + short Front, +-1250g. The 095 seems one size to small on the geo chart ..19" TT600!
-
I had this one http://www.lightcarbon.com/mtb_hardtail-14-29er-mtb-hardtail-light-carbon-frame-lcm903. Relatively long geometry but oldschool headangle (71°).
Flat seat stays made the frame comfortable and very responsive at the same time.
It's a good choice for flat, but less capable on steep or fast descents than new school slackened frames.
-
My mistake... SpeedSafe not CarbonSpeed. For the price i took the chance. Will see if they last.
Ive had no problems with my SpeedSafe carbon asymmetric 29er wheels 28 spoke rear 24 front and :D power way straight pull hubs :D Did you deal with Tommy, I had the invoice made out as warranty replacement so didn't pay any import duty in UK ;D
-
Thanks Rick64, glad to hear your good news, yes i spoke to Tommy. Very helpfull... they have not shipped in 10 days now... but i a getting black decals for free, so i will patiently await shipping. Bought via Alix with p/protection and no paypal fees!
-
My mistake... SpeedSafe not CarbonSpeed. For the price i took the chance. Will see if they last.
Ive had no problems with my SpeedSafe carbon asymmetric 29er wheels 28 spoke rear 24 front and :D power way straight pull hubs :D Did you deal with Tommy, I had the invoice made out as warranty replacement so didn't pay any import duty in UK ;D
Thanks numberzero, I had a look at the LCM903. Also long rear and short front. 062 still my best choice.
-
I am busy reading the 062 build tread.. at page 20 now.
seems BSA with GXP are the most popular option. No issues, no creaks, more used spares available. I was set on a PF30 because i can always go to a 24mm spindle with reducers and BB's, but the more i read the more i think BSA.
I am no mechanic or bike tec, but i am mechanically minded and do all our bike maint (4 MTb, 1 Road bike... kids and mine)
I am certain i can use a SRAM GXP XO1 / XX1 with a reducing BB with a PF30. I just think BSA have less issues.. fool and bullet proof, but it's a100g heavier frame. BB92 works well because it's wider, but the chinese frames are not a BB92 frame.. they just widen the BB cups.. Scott did it on the Scale and had issues. If your chain comes off it damages the carbon sticking out from the frame.
Comments wellcome.
-
BB92 works well because it's wider, but the chinese frames are not a BB92 frame.. they just widen the BB cups..
That's a rather strange statement. BB92 implies a shell width of 92mm and 41mm threadless bore (see Parktool (https://www.parktool.com/blog/repair-help/bottom-bracket-standards-1#article-section-4)). If that was the case, we'd surely see a lot of negative compatibility reports. Maybe you meant something else? My experience with a BB92 frame does not align with what you've said at all. I'm concerned because such claims might spread false rumors about reliability of open mold frames.
-
What i see on the BB92 Open mold Chiner frames are a narrow frame section what are73mm width for BB30, PF30 and BSA. To give you a BB92 (92mm) they either glue 2 inserts into the PF30 BB shell or mold a 92mm alloy sleeve into the 73mm carbon frame and you have 2 sections either side of your frame sticking out.
-
What i see on the BB92 Open mold Chiner frames are a narrow frame section what are73mm width for BB30, PF30 and BSA. To give you a BB92 (92mm) they either glue 2 inserts into the PF30 BB shell or mold a 92mm alloy sleeve into the 73mm carbon frame and you have 2 sections either side of your frame sticking out.
The 041 frame is BB92, with a carbon interface.
-
I was quite set on the 062, but reading towards the end of the 062 build tread i am much much more sceptical about the quality.
Wendy from Workswell are quite helpful.. but also totally not helpful. Very quick to reply. First she send me a link to y-s paint website to choose a colour... the images are really bad quality unless you look at flat and neon's. then she sends me the worst pictures of the actual colour chart (skew, codes cut off and her own shadow halfway over the page) thus the colours are a mess and photo's useless. Like having a cigar without a lighter...
As most of the other designs have a 440mm RC... (i can spot the difference in tyre clearance to seat tube) ...does that really make such a big difference in handling, after all my Epic WC have a 439RC.
I do think that the Tideace M009 design are more structurally sound (The round curve of the seat stays where they connect to the seat tube vs the angular design of the 062) .... i think the CS-MB01 have a brace there like my FS Epic WC and that's one of the reasons Peter's bikes are so good.
-
The 041 frame is BB92, with a carbon interface.
[/quote]
Peter said the 041 are out of production, not sure when they will do a run again.
-
Too bad for the 041 :(
The M009 is a great looking frame.
However it hasn’t much clearance for bigger 1x rings, 34T seems to be the maximum.
-
How old are your 062 now? Any issues?
-
[...]
I do think that the Tideace M009 design are more structurally sound (The round curve of the seat stays where they connect to the seat tube vs the angular design of the 062) .... i think the CS-MB01 have a brace there like my FS Epic WC and that's one of the reasons Peter's bikes are so good.
Tideace was also one of my favorites, but at a closest look it revealed some drawbacks IMHO.
1) It is heavier than claimed. Several recensions on ALiX report a weight between 1089 gr and 1231 gr instead of 950.
2) The seatstay tube is a bit short
3) 27,2 diameter limits the options for a telescopic seatpost
Anyway if you like it, take into consideration the Leadnovo 958-II (version II). It is exactly the same frame but with additional guides for external routing cables and BSA bottom bracket. Two things that semplify the assembling.
-
[...]
I do think that the Tideace M009 design are more structurally sound (The round curve of the seat stays where they connect to the seat tube vs the angular design of the 062) .... i think the CS-MB01 have a brace there like my FS Epic WC and that's one of the reasons Peter's bikes are so good.
Tideace was also one of my favorites, but at a closest look it revealed some drawbacks IMHO.
1) It is heavier than claimed. Several recensions on ALiX report a weight between 1089 gr and 1231 gr instead of 950.
2) The seatstay tube is a bit short
3) 27,2 diameter limits the options for a telescopic seatpost
Anyway if you like it, take into consideration the Leadnovo 958-II (version II). It is exactly the same frame but with additional guides for external routing cables and BSA bottom bracket. Two things that semplify the assembling.
Yes: the weights will differ according to BB and frame size chosen
Seatstay length is what it is
I prefer the 27.2 post
Yes external routing are much faster to install but i am willing to do the fidling for internal.
Some pics received from Chris at Sobato of dif BB’s.
-
Some more pics from Sobato 062
-
Just a quick thank you to every comment, i do appreciate it. I am constantly learning.. which might make my decision more difficult. Lol.
I do like Peter’s frames, i think it’s really good designs, but they are more xpensive, +paypal commision, + USD55 for paint, + shipping. Wish he was on Alix.
Sobato and Workswell are nearly half the price via Alix (all considered).
-
Thanks Rick64, glad to hear your good news, yes i spoke to Tommy. Very helpfull... they have not shipped in 10 days now... but i a getting black decals for free, so i will patiently await shipping. Bought via Alix with p/protection and no paypal fees!
Order some extra spokes for front and rear wheel, I only had one spare arrive with the wheels so had to order more separately.
-
Lighter = more expensive = flimsier = Much better chance of failure
Yes, yes, yes, no.
I'm riding my CS-256-SL now for almost three year. It's still as new, no failures after crashes.
If I had to replace my beloved IP/CS-256-SL, I would go for the CS-218, because I don't like the twig at the rear of the 256. My 256 weights 1040gr (19"). And I like the service and after-sales of Peter. No problem to spend a little extra bucks for this.
-
Thanks Rick64, glad to hear your good news, yes i spoke to Tommy. Very helpfull... they have not shipped in 10 days now... but i a getting black decals for free, so i will patiently await shipping. Bought via Alix with p/protection and no paypal fees!
Order some extra spokes for front and rear wheel, I only had one spare arrive with the wheels so had to order more separately.
Thanks, i’ll get them laced localy on DT Swiss 240s hubs with XD driver and sapim CX-rays. . Unfortunately not straight pull... i bought them used (after a year the privious owner wrecked his frame and both hoops.. insurence gave him a boost fame and rimms) for a 1/4 of new price.
-
Thanks mtb2223, yes Kudu’s to Peter, but at nearly twice the price the 062 from Sobato or Workswell are such a good option.
Yes 218 very light, MB01 proven bombproof, 887-SL.. no reviews... M009 also proven and good. 256 had issues.. sorted just like 062, 041 out of production at moment. I saw the Leadnovo on Alix, but no reviews on forums that i have seen. I see there are a company Courage Carbon and Carbon Material Store selling MB01 on Alix for USD520 (no paint). Then there are Smile Team that sells what looks like 062, Trident Trust thay clains T1000 and very simmular to 062, but they cant tell what tyre size the frame take. BXT looks like M009.
Sobato also have an 062 with external cable routing.
Lots of options :o
-
Just a heads up, if you order from Peter at XM, he has great prices on CX-Ray spokes.
-
Thanks mtb2223, yes Kudu’s to Peter, but at nearly twice the price the 062 from Sobato or Workswell are such a good option.
Yes 218 very light, MB01 proven bombproof, 887-SL.. no reviews... M009 also proven and good. 256 had issues.. sorted just like 062, 041 out of production at moment. I saw the Leadnovo on Alix, but no reviews on forums that i have seen. I see there are a company Courage Carbon and Carbon Material Store selling MB01 on Alix for USD520 (no paint). Then there are Smile Team that sells what looks like 062, Trident Trust thay clains T1000 and very simmular to 062, but they cant tell what tyre size the frame take. BXT looks like M009.
Sobato also have an 062 with external cable routing.
Lots of options :o
just to add something else to the mix, ;D
two frames with the same geometry of Tideace M009
Iplay IP-M901:
http://www.xmiplay.com/ProductDetails1723 (http://www.xmiplay.com/ProductDetails1723)
Tideace FM-M101
https://it.aliexpress.com/item/Newest-carbon-MTB-bicycle-frame-29er-27-5er-frameset-carbon-mtb-bike-frame-with-clamp-headset/32540148439.html (https://it.aliexpress.com/item/Newest-carbon-MTB-bicycle-frame-29er-27-5er-frameset-carbon-mtb-bike-frame-with-clamp-headset/32540148439.html)
only the insertion points of the internal cable routing seem different.
-
Sorry for late reply.. been working and traveling .. and working. Hope all had a wonderfull Christmas...May you all have a blessed year ahead.
Thanks Wal-ter for the links
I have starter buying good condition used parts for the build. I try and read as much as possible about Hardtail bikes (pro’s & cons) and issues buyers had.
For some reason i am leaning towards Peter’s MB01 frame.. maybe because some had issues with the 062 cracking at the seat stay/ seat tube interphase....i like the vibration dampers, the cross brace in the seat tube. Yes it have a 5mm longer Chainstay and 31.6mm seat tube. (I havn’t been on my exel sheet lately to look at the geometry... (TT length).
Once i have most of my parts , i’ll pull the trigger om a frame.
-
The holidays were great and hectic. Keep us posted on your final decision.
I have a brand new Easton Haven 35 Carbon bar if you're interested. It's never been mounted and has the black decals.
https://www.eastoncycling.com/products/details/haven-35-carbon-bar
-
Well said: great and hectic!
Ok i am OCD... all the info goes into the blender and just mulls around untill all the good stuff sinks to the bottom..lol
Thanks for the offer, i have a spare bar and stem.
What i do need are all of your expertese: i have only used Shimano brakes untill now and are looking at Hope Tech3 x2 or Race x2...as per the M01 build on the forum.
1. Do they last?
2.are the quality as good?
3.are any of the other manufacturers brake pads interchangable with Hope? Or can you only use Hope pads?
Crank/BB:
1. Have anyone used any other brand Crank ( not XTR or XX1) that are as light (+-550g or less) and as strong/ durable for simmiliar price? I see Bike components.de have a special on XX1 GXP Q168 for €217 (with this crank i can use any frame with the appropriate BB)
2. Can i go Q156 on the MB01 and 062 frames or should i stick to 168?
Happy holidays!
-
For some reason i am leaning towards Peter’s MB01 frame.. maybe because some had issues with the 062 cracking at the seat stay/ seat tube interphase....i like the vibration dampers, the cross brace in the seat tube. Yes it have a 5mm longer Chainstay and 31.6mm seat tube. (I havn’t been on my exel sheet lately to look at the geometry... (TT length).
I don't have the MB01 or any of the frames you're looking at but I do have Peter's RB01. It's the road bike equivalent of the MB01. I don't know how but that vibration dampener system works.
-
I used Hope Race x2 brakes for 3+ years on a bike, and a year on another bike.
They are still great.
And I buy my pads on AliExpress.
XT brakes are great and strong too, but with a more ON/OFF feel.
-
Thanks for the headsup tripleDot
-
I used Hope Race x2 brakes for 3+ years on a bike, and a year on another bike.
They are still great.
And I buy my pads on AliExpress.
XT brakes are great and strong too, but with a more ON/OFF feel.
z
I agree with “on /off” ... i wiped out a couple of times with XT 785 and XTR 9020 trail brakes ... i thought i was ok, modulating progressively more .. and them wham bam on the gravel... thinking “ What the heck just hapened”, i also have issues with my 9020 left front. I think there are an air buble in there somewhere, if my bike lay on its left side the lever goes long, if it lay on the right, lever go short. I have bled and bled and just given up after 12 months of multiply bleds and setting bitepoint bla bla bla. Time for something else.
Thanks carbonazza for heads up.
-
I think the only cranks that are going to be any lighter than the Sram carbon cranks will be the Race Face Next SL cranks. They will probably cost roughly $200 usd more than Sram cranks.
As for Q factor, I would probably stick with 168. It will be a safer choice if you ever need to use the cranks on a different frame. I’m running a Sram X0 crank from 2011 on my 2016 SC 5010 which is Boost spacing. I just removed the 3x spider and rings and installed an Absolute Black oval ring with the 3mm boost offset.
You probably mentioned it elsewhere but where are you located? I can usually find Sram carbon cranks for well under $200 on Amazon. The catch is that they come as 2x or 3x and you’ll have to buy your direct mount ring of choice.
-
Thanks for your imput bxcc. I am in Cape Town, RSA.
I agree on the Q168 are more versatile and safe option. I pulled the trigger on a new XX1 crank GXP Q168 from Bike-components.de. On sale for €217 (thats within 60USD of used).
I also found a set of XTR M9000 brakes for same price as Hope Tech3 x2(but i will keep a keen eye for a set of these and test them when available in the used market).. weight won over modulation.
I just worry about the banyo thats crimped on the brake hose... how am i going to route the brake hose from the bottom to the headtube?
-
Remove the hose from the lever and leave the hose connected to the caliper. You will need a new olive and barb if the set doesn’t come with a spare. Whatever air that is introduced to the system will be close to the lever so bleeding is also simpler this way.
Also, the XTR Race brakes don’t have the servo wave like the rest of the line so they don’t suffer from the “on / off” feel like the rest. If that was your main complaint with Shimano brakes, you may be pleasantly surprised.
-
;D ;D that’s fantastic news! Thanks
Tomorrow i am looking at a used 2014 Rockshox SID WC with a OneLock. Then i only need the frame!
-
You’re welcome. That’s what we are here for.
That’s a great fork too. I have the XX with the hydraulic lockout button. I didn’t think I would use it much until I had it. Super happy with it. I put it at 120mm on my 062 frame.
-
I am super greatfull for all your (thats every one on this forum helping) advice.
I have never done such a big project... slightly scary this dawnting task, at least i know i am backed by an amazing group of riders.
I emailed Peter yesterday for a MB01 frame!
(If the spelling sucks sometimes... sorry.. this in my second language and this fricken small touchscreen buttons on my iphone
-
Pulled the trigger on a CS-MB01 frame from Peter. Because of Chinese holiday and late production, frame will only be shipped end March. 19' Frame as i am 5,10 (1.78m) 87.5cm inseam.
I took the BSA frame option for GXP XX1 crank. Still second guessing my decision not taking BB30 frame.....
I will start another post for the bike build.
-
I was skeptical at first but trust me only go with BSA, not worth the hassle to go with anything else to risk creaking and needing much more tools to install the bottom bracket, BSA will only add like 50-75 grams I believe. I use the shimano deore BB52 bottom bracket which cost like $15, basic tools to install, using it for 2 years now and spins super nice and smooth just like the day I got it and never heard a single creak from it
xtr 9000 brakes are absolutely amazing to me, their braking power is just as good if not better then all other shimano brakes I have tried and the modulation is really good, i'm not a big fan of servo wave. The brakes are really light and good looking but the downside is they are super expensive, luckily for me I found a used set for $150 USD in mint condition :)
I tried a few other lightweight brake sets like the formula r1's but wow those are horrible brakes, shimano has the best brakes hands down, easy to bleed, easy to adjust, awesome modulation, easy to center the rotor and pads without rub which is my main complaint with other brakes especially the formula r1's
-
I was skeptical at first but trust me only go with BSA, not worth the hassle to go with anything else to risk creaking and needing much more tools to install the bottom bracket, BSA will only add like 50-75 grams I believe. I use the shimano deore BB52 bottom bracket which cost like $15, basic tools to install, using it for 2 years now and spins super nice and smooth just like the day I got it and never heard a single creak from it
The same can be said about press fit BB.
To tighten a BSA you need a special tool.
While you can do a press/extractor for about $5 with a 13mm bolt and washers, or get some more sophisticated ones for $15 on ebay.
When my bearings are not smooth enough to my liking, I replace them with Aliexpress ones.
I ride about 8,000km per year, and change them twice.
Probably because I live in the muddy Belgium, and I like them very smooth.
On the dry, a couple of ceramic bearings from aliexpress at $10 would last ages.
For the creaking, you first have to be sure it comes from the BB, which is often questionnable.
A carbon frame is like a drum, a noise you ear somewhere can come from the other side.
If in the end the BB is creaking, add some Loctite, and put it back.
Like everything, you mostly read stories about people complaining.
And do not see the silent majority( most new bikes are PF ) who have never had any problems in thousands of km, like me.
I've had a couple of failed frames, that I looked into or cut to see more details in them.
And each time, I was appalled by the poor quality of the alloy shells in the frames we buy.
There may be some good ones, but buying a frame now, I insure it is bare carbon PF.
-
I'm sure there are good and bad to both. I would think that a lot of it has to do with proper use and maintenance.
Personally, I stick with BSA and Sram GXP stuff as it's on 7 out of the 9 bikes in my house and I like things being interchangeable. Not that I would want to use my daughters 155mm NX crank on my bike, but in my head it makes sense ???. Just as all the brakes (8 of 9 as one is a roadie) are Shimano Deore or higher so I only keep one extra set of pads with me on weekend adventures with the family.
-
I was skeptical at first but trust me only go with BSA, not worth the hassle to go with anything else to risk creaking and needing much more tools to install the bottom bracket, BSA will only add like 50-75 grams I believe. I use the shimano deore BB52 bottom bracket which cost like $15, basic tools to install, using it for 2 years now and spins super nice and smooth just like the day I got it and never heard a single creak from it
The same can be said about press fit BB.
To tighten a BSA you need a special tool.
While you can do a press/extractor for about $5 with a 13mm bolt and washers, or get some more sophisticated ones for $15 on ebay.
When my bearings are not smooth enough to my liking, I replace them with Aliexpress ones.
I ride about 8,000km per year, and change them twice.
Probably because I live in the muddy Belgium, and I like them very smooth.
On the dry, a couple of ceramic bearings from aliexpress at $10 would last ages.
For the creaking, you first have to be sure it comes from the BB, which is often questionnable.
A carbon frame is like a drum, a noise you ear somewhere can come from the other side.
If in the end the BB is creaking, add some Loctite, and put it back.
Like everything, you mostly read stories about people complaining.
And do not see the silent majority( most new bikes are PF ) who have never had any problems in thousands of km, like me.
I've had a couple of failed frames, that I looked into or cut to see more details in them.
And each time, I was appalled by the poor quality of the alloy shells in the frames we buy.
There may be some good ones, but buying a frame now, I insure it is bare carbon PF.
I agree BSA isn't the best, but it is the least problematic, I got my BSA tool for $3 from ebay, acts as a chain whip too, works perfect as both
An example of a situation where press fit is good, the CS-041 frame was designed with a bigger and wider bottom bracket area which allows for wider chainstays, which stiffens the frame up nicely and you save the weight of not needing the BSA fitting, in this case press fit is very much worth it
An example of a situation where press fit isn't as good is the workswell 062 frame, because the chainstays were not designed around a specific wider press fit, you get no stiffness added when going to press fit, all you get is a little bit of weight savings which isn't really worth the trouble for most of the riders out there
I actually really want the CS-041 frame but why does it have to be so expensive! $570 USD now, $660 with shipping, my workswell 062 was $350 shipped, maybe ill bite the bullet and just order it I have heard great things about that frame
-
I agree BSA isn't the best, but it is the least problematic...
...
I actually really want the CS-041 frame but why does it have to be so expensive! $570 USD now, $660 with shipping, my workswell 062 was $350 shipped, maybe ill bite the bullet and just order it I have heard great things about that frame
bxcc is spot on, there isn't probably a clearly better BB style than the other.
We all seem happy of our BB choices, and tend to use the same standards on our various bikes, for ease of maintenance, and interchangeable parts.
It happens I have both the 041 and the 062.
From what I read recently here, it seems they do not build the 041 anymore, or maybe it is just temporary?
Not sure what makes the 041 so expensive, but I flashed on it when I saw it.
And don't regret buying it.
It is much more stable and stiffer than the 062 or other branded bikes I tried.
I would have a really hard time to replace it by something else if it broke.
I liked the M-009 from Tideace a lot, it looks nice, and is stiff too.
However the recent episode about their poor warranty support, and the limit to a 34T chainring turn me off now.
Good luck for your choice :)
-
I agree BSA isn't the best, but it is the least problematic...
...
I actually really want the CS-041 frame but why does it have to be so expensive! $570 USD now, $660 with shipping, my workswell 062 was $350 shipped, maybe ill bite the bullet and just order it I have heard great things about that frame
bxcc is spot on, there isn't probably a clearly better BB style than the other.
We all seem happy of our BB choices, and tend to use the same standards on our various bikes, for ease of maintenance, and interchangeable parts.
It happens I have both the 041 and the 062.
From what I read recently here, it seems they do not build the 041 anymore, or maybe it is just temporary?
Not sure what makes the 041 so expensive, but I flashed on it when I saw it.
And don't regret buying it.
It is much more stable and stiffer than the 062 or other branded bikes I tried.
I would have a really hard time to replace it by something else if it broke.
I liked the M-009 from Tideace a lot, it looks nice, and is stiff too.
However the recent episode about their poor warranty support, and the limit to a 34T chainring turn me off now.
Good luck for your choice :)
Good Info! But omg now I really want to buy the cs-041 lol
Already spent enough in the last few days with a wearable gimbal and gopro 5, also made a order on wiggle for truing stand, dishing tool and spoke guage lol, the frame will have to wait for now unless I see it go on sale
-
I hear you all!
I have an PF30 “OSSB” or something Spez calls it on my Epic and i never had any creaking (i press it in myself with no compounds added). I just found that with the sideload bearing there are a very small margen between pinching the bearings and loose/ play on crank. I wish i can find a 30mm ID wavy washer to replace the cone tentioner... just to try it.
If the frame came in a PF30 i would have taken that option but it’s eather BSA or BB30. I also came accross a XX1 DM gxp Q168 for $217 at Bike- components.de. So i figured: BSA frame with appropriate BB and this crank= good enough. (I would have liked a Q156) PF frame and BB combo are just lighter than BSA. But sometimes out choices are directed in a direction due to external influences.
Brakes wise: i have never used any other hydraulic beakes other than Shimano. (Had my fair share of whipe outs lol) What i have seen and from my fello riders localy: avid and formula sucks. SRAM guide ok but overkill for XC, always good things from Hope but far and few used localy in South Africa. I will look for a used set of hope Tech x2 and give it a try. Can always sell it on.
It’s time i broaden my horizons a bit and try some new and different equipment.
-
Peter just replied to my email : They have stop producing the CS-041 Sl frame. No more , nada, nothing any more.
They now concentrate mainly on CA-057, CS- 218 SL and CS-887 SL frames. They still do MB01 frames but only in BSA and BB30, delivery end March due Chinese lunar calender holiday.
-
I love bb30 and pf30. Little trick I learned from using an eccentric BB for singlespeed... apply a thick coat of Oatey® Great White® Pipe Joint Compound With PTFE around the BB shell where it interfaces with the BB (just don't get it in on the bearing seals or wipe away the excess if you do).
Also, RE: MB01... I'd stay away from anything with polymer inserts. They'll eventually dry out and crack. Get your compliance from your wheels, not a seatstay gimmick.
-
... apply a thick coat of Oatey® Great White® Pipe Joint Compound With PTFE...
You mean using Oatey's compound instead of Loctite 609 or similar ?
-
I love bb30 and pf30. Little trick I learned from using an eccentric BB for singlespeed... apply a thick coat of Oatey® Great White® Pipe Joint Compound With PTFE around the BB shell where it interfaces with the BB (just don't get it in on the bearing seals or wipe away the excess if you do).
Also, RE: MB01... I'd stay away from anything with polymer inserts. They'll eventually dry out and crack. Get your compliance from your wheels, not a seatstay gimmick.
Just a quick Q: do you have a MB01?
-
... apply a thick coat of Oatey® Great White® Pipe Joint Compound With PTFE...
You mean using Oatey's compound instead of Loctite 609 or similar ?
Correct. Oateys is great stuff. Just make sure you don't buy the PVC glue
-
I love bb30 and pf30. Little trick I learned from using an eccentric BB for singlespeed... apply a thick coat of Oatey® Great White® Pipe Joint Compound With PTFE around the BB shell where it interfaces with the BB (just don't get it in on the bearing seals or wipe away the excess if you do).
Also, RE: MB01... I'd stay away from anything with polymer inserts. They'll eventually dry out and crack. Get your compliance from your wheels, not a seatstay gimmick.
Just a quick Q: do you have a MB01?
No. Polymer inserts have been around for a very long time though. They've always been prone to the same issues, and it's unfortunate Specialized decided to revive them.
-
...Just make sure you don't buy the PVC glue...
That could have some terrible consequences indeed :)
-
Guess we will find out how long they last.
-
Hello. I am brand new to the group
Can you recommend hardtails that work with the SRAM GX Eagle 12 speed with a 38T front ring?
Will the CS-057 and OHR930C rims work?
Thank you. John