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Re: Velobuild VB-R-218 Quick update on my end:
I noticed in the long run, that I routed my rear brake housing a bit too short, causing a kink in the housing at the headset and bad rear brake action.
So I needed to put in new housing and therefore take apart the whole bike basically.
So I decided to finally build up the replacement frame instead just for the sake of trying it. Also, I switched the groupset from Campy 11sp Centaur to 12sp Record - sourced the parts slightly used for cheap. Mechanical rim brake stuff isn't really worth much any more in this day and age.

The build turned out very nice. The seatpost clamping area holds up. The BB did not cause me any trouble. The cups screwed right in, the cranks spin smoothly.
Headtube bearing seats were slightly less tight on this frame, but the surface was a lot nicer finished. On my first frame it looked kinda rough. On this, it seems it was finished with some kind of lacquer coating. Again, I needed to drill the rear brake cable exit hole at the top tube. I explicitly told Chris at VB to make sure it's properly sized and he promised to take care of it. But alas, I guess stuff like this is just something you need to be prepared to do with Chiner frames.

I got another one of the superlight SROAD cassettes. A 12sp 11-32 cassette made from one block of steel, weighing about 215g. They only had it in stock in rainbow colors. Wouldn't have been my favorite choice but now that it's on the bike, I quite like it. I found these one piece cassettes to transfer more noise, especially in combination with deep wheels. So if you like your drivetrain to be dead silent, they might not be the best choice.

The build turned out very nice. I really like the bike. I dropped some weight in the process. This build as pictured, including all accessories (without Wahoo, bottles and saddle bag of course) does now weigh 7.6kg for the biggest available frame size (XXL/54).

Thanks also to madmax for giving me setup tips with Record 12sp.
May 16, 2023, 01:35:55 AM 		6
Re: Velobuild VB-R-218 Turns out my aftermarket 11sp chainrings don’t play well with 12sp chains. At least on the inner ring the chain skips on steep inclines. On the big ring it’s fine probably because the chain is engaging on more teeth.
I’ll replace the inner ring now with a Super Record 12sp one and see if that fixes things.
May 18, 2023, 02:39:47 AM 		2
Re: Velobuild VB-R-218 It might have to do with the dropped stays. That creates more stress in this area. Still it shouldn’t happen of course. Let’s see how VB handle this.
May 23, 2023, 11:34:47 PM 		1
Re: Velobuild VB-R-218
Quote from: Sebastian on May 22, 2023, 03:45:39 AM
There's already limited compatibility between original Campag 11sp rings and 12sp chains, usually at least resulting in accelerated wear. Now I'm running aftermarket chainrings, so compatibility is unknown.

I fit 12sp chainrings to my cranks today. 52/36 teeth combo. This seems to have fixed my issues. Chain runs quieter now. Front shifting is smooth. No chain skipping anymore on the small ring. I rode up a steep incline and everything was smooth. I deliberately tried to make the chain skip but it wouldn’t. So all good now.


May 26, 2023, 02:08:38 PM 		1
Re: Velobuild VB-R-218
Quote from: ScotAm123 on May 31, 2023, 04:27:44 AM
Qn from a newbie.
I have a 105 mechanical groupset on an old bike with rim brakes. Was looking at at buying a new chinese carbon frame, and transfer components on and just buy a wheelset giving me a new bike in effect for very little outlay.

Is the VB-R-218 my best option ?
I will be handing it to someone to do, will it be straightforward with the cabling given its mechanical
Has the headset issue been resolved with a new ring or is it still an issue. If it is, then this rules it out.

Thanks

Unless your old groupset has direct mount rim brakes, you would have to get new ones for this frame.
Is it straightforward? Well it depends on the skills of your mechanic. It is a fully internally routed frame. So installing a fully mechanical groupset on this and routing everything through the headset is obviously a bit of a nightmare job. Also, you will most likely have to drill the rear brake cable exit hole bigger on the top tube as it’s seemingly too small the way the frame is coming out of the mold. So no. it’s not straightforward. ;-)

There’s no issues that I know of with the compression ring on this frame. That would be the 168 and 177, I believe.

May 31, 2023, 11:39:58 AM 		1
Re: Velobuild VB-R-218
Quote from: Jimin on May 31, 2023, 11:53:03 AM
I have gone back and forth for a while now and would you still recommend this bike frame? :)
I remember that you also had rim brakes. Which wheelset did you got for that? :)

Well, if you’re looking for something like this, as in an aero rim brake frame with internal routing and if you’re fine with owning a replica then yes, I can recommend it.
Make sure to read this thread and be prepared for the issues you might have. But I love riding this bike. And I particularly love the geometry and handling as well as the ergonomics of the bars. Also to me this bike represents peak rim brake, the end of an era. Just as Campy 12sp represents peak mechanical groupsets for me. That’s why I wanted to build one. But I would never be able to spend 6grand on a real Dogma F frame nor do I expect this VB frame to perform the same.

It’s just a nice bike to ride. And a fast one at that.
The wheels are fully custom. Built by me. Front hub is an old Roval that I polished. Rear hub is Novatec. Sapim CX Ray spokes. 60mm deep, 30mm wide, 23mm internal. Grooved brake track. About 1450g weight. I sourced the rims from an Aliexpress seller that I’ve had good experience with in the past.
May 31, 2023, 01:20:17 PM 		1
Re: LTWOO ER9 & ERX - Electronic groepsets
Quote from: patliean1 on June 08, 2023, 09:37:22 AM
If you spec the ERX version to pair with Shimano Ultegra-level components (crank, chain, cassette, rotors) you are looking at around $1500 which is still cheaper than a complete 105 Di2 yet much lighter.

GC Performance latest video shows the ERX being comparable in weight to Sram eTap Red. And in general, Di2 is lighter than eTap.

I dunno about retail prices in the US. I can get a full 105 Di2 group for 1100 EUR in Europe. A Sram Rival AXS upgrade kit can actually be had for less than the LTWOO kit. So unless this comes down further in price, I would not take the chance.
June 09, 2023, 12:11:25 AM 		5
Re: dcrf26 frame - Scott Foil?
Quote from: patliean1 on June 08, 2023, 09:00:32 AM

2. Geometry - The size 56 is both taller in stack and shorter in reach than my typical setup. However, it's clear this frame was inspired by a TT bike. The trend these days is for riders to optimize their bike position more forward over the bottom bracket and on the hoods rather than the drops. Basically a TT position on the hoods. So the geometry makes a lot of sense. My attempt is to replicate this position  :o

Are you going to use a separate bar and stem setup?
I’m eyeing this as well. But the stack really is unusually high if you take into account that the integrated bars will require at least the headset bearing top cap to route the brake lines and the other spacer which acts as a cable cover beneath the stem. That will add at least another 3cm of stack making it very high by the looks of it.
Also, Tan Tan is offering this with BSA, BB30 and PF30 bb configuration (under the Ceccotti bike label) on Aliexpress. So if you think you’re taking a chance with T47, presumably you don’t have to.
Really looking forward to seeing how this works for you.
June 09, 2023, 12:17:41 AM 		1
Re: SROAD lightweight cassettes Quick update for everyone eyeing these cassettes:

I've been riding two of these for the last 6 months.
I ordered an 11sp 11-32 cassette with grey finish that I used on my steel roadie with Campagnolo Chorus. It has been flawless. No issues. Being a one piece unit, it transfers more noise to deep carbon wheelsets. So your drivetrain can seem noisier at times, if that concerns you.

On my VB 218 I put on another one of these, this time a 12sp 11-32 cassette. They only had it in stock in rainbow finish. I ordered it regardless. Again, it's very well finished. BUT after just two rides it developed a creaking sound. I narrowed it down to the black aluminium spider that the steel cogs are riveted to. There is some slight play in there, so you can rock it slightly back and forth on the spider. So particularly on the big cogs of the cassette under high torque (i.e. when climbing) I got a very loud creaking. It probably doesn't affect the functionality. Time will tell how durable the thing is.
I took the cassette off, cleaned it and put some Loctite on all the riveted interface areas between the spider and the cogs. I let it dry for a night and did another ride yesterday. Now it's quiet. Let's see for how long.
You could probably also just grease it every now and then. But I'm using wax on my drivetrain and didn't want to introduce oil or grease to my drivetrain.
June 09, 2023, 12:31:17 AM 		2
Re: Carbon spokes or CX Ray? My take as an amateur wheelbuilder:

I built multiple wheelsets with CX Rays and I myself am running three sets. Among steel spokes, these are simply the best compromise. I have not ridden carbon spokes but my guess judging from their properties would be that:
- the wheel feels stiffer laterally and less comfortable (as in harsher on rough roads) vertically
- responsiveness is usually what people refer to when it comes to transfering torsional loads / how direct do the spokes transfer the power to the rims and tires. Carbon spokes are not even remotely as elastic as steel spokes, which is why they have to be tensioned pretty hard in order for them to not go slack when the wheel takes impacts. This is what makes them feel harsher and it is also what makes them feel "more responsive". The spokes in a wheel are basically just pre-tensioned springs that must never lose tension.
- carbon spokes are obviously harder to source and replace - so I would definitely choose a design where the wheel can still be trued with regular tools (Winspace Hypers for instance) and I would make sure to get at least one replacement spoke in every length used so in the event that a spoke does break, I can at least replace it.

Which one is better? It depends on what's most important to you. If I was building an all out no compromise race bike, I might choose carbon spokes. I think the wide tires and lower pressures that people use these days will go some way to alleviate the harsher ride feel. On a gravel or endurance bike however, I'd probably not use them. The weight difference is not really an argument to use them IMO. It's more that for the same weight you could make the spokes have a much more aerodynamic cross section or you could use less spokes for the same overall wheel stiffness.

And lastly of course theres the price difference.
June 21, 2023, 06:35:57 AM 		2