Author Topic: Muffin Top (AKA Workswell WCB-M-078 Plus frame)  (Read 8040 times)

bxcc

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 377
    • View Profile
Re: Muffin Top (AKA Workswell WCB-M-078 Plus frame)
« Reply #15 on: April 04, 2016, 07:25:54 PM »
Bike is finished. 21.8 pounds with XT Trail pedals.








Carbon_Dude

  • Global Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1832
    • View Profile
Re: Muffin Top (AKA Workswell WCB-M-078 Plus frame)
« Reply #16 on: April 04, 2016, 07:49:33 PM »
Bxcc, very nice pics!  I was thinking of throwing on a set of 27+ wheels on my Chiner Hardtail but after seeing your pictures, they are making me want to build a 29+ complete bike instead.  I've been looking hard at the Trek Stache and this is close to being a Chiner version of the Trek, I may just wait a bit and build up something like what you have.
2017 Trek Stache 9.8 (29+)
2016 Specialized Stumpjumper FSR Carbon Comp 6Fattie (27.5+)
2016 Trek Stache 9 (29+) w/upgrades (Sold)
2014 -036 Full Suspension Chiner (Sold)
2013 -057 Hardtail Carbon Chiner (Sold)
Atlanta, GA

SportingGoods

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 360
    • View Profile
Re: Muffin Top (AKA Workswell WCB-M-078 Plus frame)
« Reply #17 on: April 05, 2016, 02:13:57 AM »
I guess that 29+ is the way to go if you want full rigid. And this bike is just awesome. The only point I don't like is the cable routing of the rear derailleur (out of the frame in the middle).
Then, I still believe that 27.5+ is better for hard tail or short travel full.

bxcc

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 377
    • View Profile
Re: Muffin Top (AKA Workswell WCB-M-078 Plus frame)
« Reply #18 on: April 05, 2016, 05:27:06 AM »
Thanks. I am very pleased with the bike so far. The rollover is just amazing. I had the pressures up around 22 to 25 pounds (wanted to make sure they were sealed up good and didn't want to have to walk home) so I know I didn't get the full traction benefit. But with that, it didn't feel like sluggish or slow at all. After trying the WTB Trailblazers on my 062 frame, I knew I wanted to have a dedicated plus bike for winter / crappy weather riding. I also wanted something with great "rollover" capabilities as one of the riding areas next to my house is full of rocks and roots and there is ZERO flow or buffed trails as you can see in one of the pictures. Carbon_Dude, I wouldn't say that a new wheelset for converting an existing frame to 27+ is a waste of money but if the bike budget allows, just go for the dedicated 29+. You won't be disappointed. And with the higher tire pressures, I really couldn't tell much difference in handling vs my rigid 062 bike.

I guess that 29+ is the way to go if you want full rigid. And this bike is just awesome. The only point I don't like is the cable routing of the rear derailleur (out of the frame in the middle).
Then, I still believe that 27.5+ is better for hard tail or short travel full.

As far as rigid vs HT vs FS, I would have to agree with some members on MTBR. For rigid and HT, if you can comfortably fit on a 29+, don't waste your time on a 27+. And yes I've ridden a 27+ rigid bike. The benefit over a standard 29er is there but it just isn't that much of one. Now for a FS bike, I would have to stay with 27.5 x 2.3ish tires on 30mm internal rims. I'm not sure yet if it's worth the weight penalty when traction isn't an issue in the standard format. The nice things is that there are SOOO many options right now and it's only getting better.

The cable thing is just an unfortunate necessity. There really isn't any other way to do it other than dropping the stay to the normal level and keeping it internal which also makes the CS's longer, or just use the cable stops that are pop riveted on but those are just ugly IMO.

jja

  • Member
  • *
  • Posts: 14
    • View Profile
Re: Muffin Top (AKA Workswell WCB-M-078 Plus frame)
« Reply #19 on: April 05, 2016, 09:35:49 AM »
How does the fork feel? Can you measure the actual geometry as built, e.g. head angle and axle-to-crown?

bxcc

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 377
    • View Profile
Re: Muffin Top (AKA Workswell WCB-M-078 Plus frame)
« Reply #20 on: April 05, 2016, 11:29:32 AM »
The fork feels like a rigid fork. Fun and painful at the same time. The tires do help though. The A to C measurement is 495mm and with that, the HA should be around 71.5 but I can take the digital level home and see how accurate that is. I am assuming I would take the angle measurement from the imaginary line that runs between the center of the lower headtube hole and the center of the axle?

jja

  • Member
  • *
  • Posts: 14
    • View Profile
Re: Muffin Top (AKA Workswell WCB-M-078 Plus frame)
« Reply #21 on: April 05, 2016, 12:28:37 PM »
The fork feels like a rigid fork. Fun and painful at the same time. The tires do help though. The A to C measurement is 495mm and with that, the HA should be around 71.5 but I can take the digital level home and see how accurate that is. I am assuming I would take the angle measurement from the imaginary line that runs between the center of the lower headtube hole and the center of the axle?

I think that would measure the angle of the triangle created by the fork offset, and the HA is the angle of just the (extended) head tube line. WW has a measurement shown for a 530 fork, if that's accurate, and I wondered how much steeper it got in reality with the shorter rigid fork. Thanks!



Edit: and I see that WW does spec it at 71.5deg for the 495mm a-c fork. A reality check would be nice if possible.  :)

« Last Edit: April 05, 2016, 12:31:21 PM by jja »

bxcc

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 377
    • View Profile
Re: Muffin Top (AKA Workswell WCB-M-078 Plus frame)
« Reply #22 on: April 05, 2016, 12:36:12 PM »
Yup. You are correct. I forgot about the offset part of it. I will see what I can get tonight. By the numbers it appears to be about 1 degree steeper than the Trek Stache. Which for me is fine as this is a purely XC bike. But it was one of the deciding factors when looking at frames before I got this one.

bxcc

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 377
    • View Profile
Re: Muffin Top (AKA Workswell WCB-M-078 Plus frame)
« Reply #23 on: April 05, 2016, 03:17:02 PM »
I measured the HA with the rigid fork at 71.5 degrees. Seems they are pretty accurate on their claims.

Carbon_Dude

  • Global Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1832
    • View Profile
Re: Muffin Top (AKA Workswell WCB-M-078 Plus frame)
« Reply #24 on: April 06, 2016, 01:19:03 PM »
If you have an iPhone you can use the electronic level to make a HA measurement.
2017 Trek Stache 9.8 (29+)
2016 Specialized Stumpjumper FSR Carbon Comp 6Fattie (27.5+)
2016 Trek Stache 9 (29+) w/upgrades (Sold)
2014 -036 Full Suspension Chiner (Sold)
2013 -057 Hardtail Carbon Chiner (Sold)
Atlanta, GA

bxcc

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 377
    • View Profile
Re: Muffin Top (AKA Workswell WCB-M-078 Plus frame)
« Reply #25 on: April 06, 2016, 02:18:07 PM »
If you have an iPhone you can use the electronic level to make a HA measurement.

One would think I would have thought of that. I ended up bringing the old school prop protractor home and taking a manual measurement. So technically I measured it at 71.4.  ;)

jja

  • Member
  • *
  • Posts: 14
    • View Profile
Re: Muffin Top (AKA Workswell WCB-M-078 Plus frame)
« Reply #26 on: April 06, 2016, 03:17:29 PM »
Old school works! Thanks for doing it. Good to hear that Workswell is accurately reporting their geometries.

Carbon_Dude

  • Global Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1832
    • View Profile
Re: Muffin Top (AKA Workswell WCB-M-078 Plus frame)
« Reply #27 on: April 06, 2016, 08:43:58 PM »
I would rather have a 69.5 deg head tube angle, that's what my -057 has and I really like the geometry of that frame.  If I were to build this frame I'd go with 120mm travel which would give me 69.5, maybe a little less which is fine with me.

I am even considering a 29+ full suspension frame if I can find one, however, nobody seems to be making a FS version yet.
« Last Edit: April 08, 2016, 06:54:33 AM by Carbon_Dude »
2017 Trek Stache 9.8 (29+)
2016 Specialized Stumpjumper FSR Carbon Comp 6Fattie (27.5+)
2016 Trek Stache 9 (29+) w/upgrades (Sold)
2014 -036 Full Suspension Chiner (Sold)
2013 -057 Hardtail Carbon Chiner (Sold)
Atlanta, GA

groussere

  • Member
  • *
  • Posts: 16
    • View Profile
Re: Muffin Top (AKA Workswell WCB-M-078 Plus frame)
« Reply #28 on: May 14, 2016, 10:09:13 PM »
Hey bxcc,

Love the pics of your bike built up. Looks great, and is ridiculously light!

Was wondering about the carbon wheels you had built up for your bike. How do you like them?

I went ahead and got a great deal on a Stache 9, am loving it so far! Don't think I could go back to my 29er or even 27.5+. The reason I'm asking about the wheels is that's the next upgrade to the bike. Would like your feedback if posssible.

Thanks

Carbon_Dude

  • Global Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1832
    • View Profile
Re: Muffin Top (AKA Workswell WCB-M-078 Plus frame)
« Reply #29 on: May 15, 2016, 07:57:14 AM »
Hey bxcc,

Love the pics of your bike built up. Looks great, and is ridiculously light!

Was wondering about the carbon wheels you had built up for your bike. How do you like them?

I went ahead and got a great deal on a Stache 9, am loving it so far! Don't think I could go back to my 29er or even 27.5+. The reason I'm asking about the wheels is that's the next upgrade to the bike. Would like your feedback if posssible.

Thanks

Hey, a fellow Stache owner!  Upgrading wheels is in the plan but for now I am sticking with the Mulefut alloy wheels.  I figure I'd drop about 600 grams if I did an upgrade to 50mm carbon wheels with DT Swiss hubs which would be sweet as Im not too crazy about the single wall alloy wheels that come on the Stache but so far no problems.
« Last Edit: May 15, 2016, 06:30:50 PM by Carbon_Dude »
2017 Trek Stache 9.8 (29+)
2016 Specialized Stumpjumper FSR Carbon Comp 6Fattie (27.5+)
2016 Trek Stache 9 (29+) w/upgrades (Sold)
2014 -036 Full Suspension Chiner (Sold)
2013 -057 Hardtail Carbon Chiner (Sold)
Atlanta, GA