Warning! My Experience with Winspace After-Sales

[JustinFox]

OK I've run out of popcorn! This thread has been read 1830 times. Well played OP. If your mission was to get your message out there, then you've succeeded.

Do I think that threatening to pursue legal action over a defective round seatpost clamp worth $5 is ridiculous? Absolutely.

Do I think this hurts the Winspace brand? Absolutely.

If this happened to me I personally wouldn't at all be upset (you get what you pay for), but IMHO OP has a point (that he's made time and time again in this thread) in regards to how Winspace chooses to deal with issues (which is not at all surprising to me).

I love my bikes, the select parts on my bikes, and the brands that make them. If anything I feel sorry for OP that he owns and rides a bike made by a brand he despises so much.

[robinoco]

If anything I feel sorry for OP that he owns and rides a bike made by a brand he despises so much.

+1 yet he is calling all other contributors to this post 'Winspace Fanboys' 🤣🤣🤣

[Macedingle]

Biggest Karen in Chinertown history?

[SirBikealot]

The wrench is a professional Gedore, calibrated, next argument?

If you had actually read the post and looked at the pictures, you’d see this is a clear metallurgical failure, not overtightening. The real issue isn’t the clamp itself but Winspace denying the defect. If they had any interest in improving quality or customer safety, they would have asked me to send in the part for inspection. The fact that this didn’t even occur to them, and apparently doesn’t occur to you either, despite your industry experience, says a lot.

And about your “if you swear” comment, thanks for insinuating I’m a liar. Apart from being disrespectful, that’s not an argument.

As for other brands, if a collar fails spontaneously there too, that’s not an excuse or justification. A defect is a defect

“validation” ....you’ve missed the point entirely. I’m not looking for sympathy; I’m making people aware of how Winspace behaves. And thanks to your contribution, you’re keeping this post alive and visible.

Your line  “where I think this gets ridiculous is that you think the moral high ground is worth the time, emotion, shipping logistics, making this post" is especially ironic... considering you just wrote an entire essay about it and the post you are quoting

how old is it? Was it serviced on regular bases. Are you professionally trained to use a torque wrench?

So much argument they could find to deny your wish for a new clamp, although you used a torque wrench 

[gribs]

The cal cert as shown is missing a date and looks like one that's supplied with a tool. When was it last calibrated? Standard practice is a 12 month cal period, though it's largely pointless for tools only you use as used in their correct operating ranges good torque wrenches don't appear to drift. Being fully awkward why weren't you tightening the seat clamp to the specified torque of 6nm and using a tool capable of doing that?

[Pswiss]

What you wrote is indeed pointless. Maybe you could share pictures of your own torque wrench and its yearly calibration certificate? Or are you suggesting everyone on this forum does that?

Even if a torque wrench were out of calibration, it would only drift a few percent. Since I’ve always tightened to 5 Nm, it would have to be 40% off to result in significant over-torquing , and even then, still well below the level that could cause a fracture.

As for why I didn’t torque to the specified maximum of 6 Nm, the clue is in the word “maximum.” With round seat posts, I’ve always used 5 Nm, and if the post doesn’t slip at that setting, there’s no reason to go to the maximum. There are even some parts where the maximum recommended torque is not optimal.

What’s really awkward is that in the same breath you split hairs about torque wrench calibration, but then suggest blindly tightening every clamp to the maximum rated torque.

And by the way,  the fact I torqued it only to 5 Nm makes the case even stronger: this was a defect in the part, not misuse.

[lidation]

2 years is a very long time and from the perspective of a low cost bike frame manufacturer, they have to fend off all sorts of claims. Heck, I'm pretty sure most customer who really want free replacement will make claims that they did this or that. Some of them were true, Some were not.

Anyway, congratulations! You won a free replacement of an aluminum seat post clamp! 

[Pswiss]

how old is it? Was it serviced on regular bases. Are you professionally trained to use a torque wrench?

So much argument they could find to deny your wish for a new clamp, although you used a torque wrench 

How old was it...read the post maybe?

“Professionally trained to use a torque wrench”… now that’s funny. What’s next, a license to use a hex key?

Bringing up calibration or training doesn’t make sense here, and it sounds more a desperate attempts tp deny the obvious. If you had actually looked at the pictures, you’d see a clear brittle fracture consistent with a metallurgical defect.

And even if a torque wrench drifts, it’s only by a few percent. Since I’ve always tightened to 5 Nm, it would have to be 40% off to cause significant over-torquing leading to this kind of fracture. If it were truly out of calibration to that degree, I’d have been stripping bolts and breaking other parts all over the bike long ago.

And now it appears Winspace may have known all along they were sending out frames with defective clamps.

“Both of mine failed within the first couple of weeks of ownership. Roundabout the time I received my frame, there was talk on here of others who also experienced failed clamps; seems there must have been a bad batch.”

If they had the slightest interest in quality improvement or customer safety, they would have asked me to send the clamp in for metallurgical examination.

[Pswiss]

Biggest Karen in Chinertown history?

Maybe you could refrain from throwing insults from behind your keyboard. Either you have no argument and are reduced to name-calling, or you’re so emotionally attached to your new Winspace that you can’t make a rational point.

What makes your comment even more ridiculous is the fact that it appears Winspace may have known all along they were sending out frames with defective clamps.

“Both of mine failed within the first couple of weeks of ownership. Roundabout the time I received my frame, there was talk on here of others who also experienced failed clamps; seems there must have been a bad batch.”

If they had the slightest interest in quality improvement or customer safety, they would have asked me to send the clamp in for metallurgical examination. Not to mention a recall...

[Pswiss]

OK I've run out of popcorn! This thread has been read 1830 times. Well played OP. If your mission was to get your message out there, then you've succeeded.

Do I think that threatening to pursue legal action over a defective round seatpost clamp worth $5 is ridiculous? Absolutely.

Do I think this hurts the Winspace brand? Absolutely.

If this happened to me I personally wouldn't at all be upset (you get what you pay for), but IMHO OP has a point (that he's made time and time again in this thread) in regards to how Winspace chooses to deal with issues (which is not at all surprising to me).

I love my bikes, the select parts on my bikes, and the brands that make them. If anything I feel sorry for OP that he owns and rides a bike made by a brand he despises so much.

Fair points,  and thanks for actually reading before commenting.

The $5 clamp was never the issue. The real problem is Winspace denying a clear defect and calling it “normal.” I only escalated after they refused to acknowledge it, which is ridiculous for a brand that claims to be premium.

To make things worse, it seems now that Winspace probably knew about the problem all along:

“Both of mine failed within the first couple of weeks of ownership. Roundabout the time I received my frame, there was talk on here of others who also experienced failed clamps; seems there must have been a bad batch.”

If Winspace actually cared about quality or safety, they’d have asked me to send the part back for examination, not he mention a recall / customer information

Also, you wrote “you get what you pay for.” Are you saying Winspace is cheap crap? I could have paid half the price and bought the same frame from Speeder, so at the very least I expect quality control and proper service from Winspace.

So no, I don’t “despise” the bike. I’m just pointing out how poorly the company handled this. If that helps others before buying, then the point is made.

[Pswiss]

+1 yet he is calling all other contributors to this post 'Winspace Fanboys' 🤣🤣🤣

Not all contributors, just the ones coming up with ridiculous arguments like splitting hairs over torque wrench calibration, yearly calibration, or offering no argument at all beyond insults. That kind of reaction can only be explained by emotional attachment and bruised feelings that the bike they just bought might be coming from a questionable company.

And by the way,  to make things worse, it seems Winspace probably knew about the problem all along:

“Both of mine failed within the first couple of weeks of ownership. Roundabout the time I received my frame, there was talk on here of others who also experienced failed clamps; seems there must have been a bad batch.”

If Winspace had even the slightest concern for quality or customer safety, they would have asked for the part back for examination, not to mention considering a recall.

[Pswiss]

one of the big advantages selling out of china is handling quality issues the way they do.
Nothing will change, people will still buy, get defectives and chinese companies usually do not care.
the first layer of customer support always tries to make a benefit out of your complaint (selling this 1.5 USD part for 30 USD is a get profit, having in mind, shipping if for nill overthere)
This escalates , if customer think, wow, i got a reply and they will send a new one, problem is solved.
We have seen broken aluminium parts on a tt bike where the complete front end failed. luckily on a trainer..
The part showed the same stressfractur signs yours did, a couple of hundred frames are outthere...the company never did anything to inform buyers about this, they even asked for 129 USD for the new part...
In this case, winspace tries to establish a premium touch as pricing is ridiculous...hambine did also review frames of them and loved them :-) if i am correct..
So....calm down, it is nothing personal, its just the way they handle this...LTWOO does not even answer dealership complaints..

Thanks for your comment, and I agree, nothing personal, it’s just the way they choose to handle things.

But to make matters worse, it seems Winspace may have been aware of the issue all along:

“Both of mine failed within the first couple of weeks of ownership. Roundabout the time I received my frame, there was talk on here of others who also experienced failed clamps; seems there must have been a bad batch.”

If Winspace had even the slightest concern for quality or customer safety, they would have asked for the part back for examination, maybe even considered a recall. Instead, denial and brushing it off...

[bxcc]

Are you from the German parts of Switzerland?

[Pswiss]

Not sure what exactly that has to do with the topic...or are you planning a visit? If you do, you might then realize the potential danger of a seatpost clamp failing while going down a mountain pass at speed. Come ride a down mountain pass sometime, then tell me a seat clamp failure is no big deal

[bxcc]

Not sure what exactly that has to do with the topic...or are you planning a visit? If you do, you might then realize the potential danger of a seatpost clamp failing while going down a mountain pass at speed. Come ride a down mountain pass sometime, then tell me a seat clamp failure is no big deal

Haha. I've been visiting Switzerland on a regular basis for quite some time. I've been all over the country and I can't get enough of the valley's of Ticino. I've found it cheaper to stay in Cannobio IT which allows my visits to be a bit longer. I asked as I was generally curious.

However, I asked an innocent question and you felt the need prove a point without actually answering my question. In fact, I have ridden in Switzerland, not nearly as much as I'd like though. I also never questioned your view on the safety aspect, even though you made the assumption that I currently don't realize the potential danger. Your view is your view and I'm cool with that. I can see how it could create a dangerous situation. We Americans have a stereotype that is well known around the world. Some parts of that stereotype are good and some are not. Also, not all of us fall into that stereotype. That being said, the citizens of the German speaking portions of Switzerland have a stereotype as well. One part being that they love to find a soapbox to stand on and preach about how they are correct. If someone is even slightly out of line in public, they will called out for it. What they miss is that even when they are correct, people will see them as being "Karen's" when the issue is relatively small in other peoples eyes. A person can be technically correct, but still seen as being overly dramatic.

Take care and enjoy your beautiful country. I am envious that I cannot spend more time there.