Cautionary experience with Mondince – FM366

[Vesryn]

Hi everyone,

I wanted to share my detailed experience with Mondince (Jack Ding) regarding my recent order for the new FM366 frame (Size S, custom paint). I hope this documented timeline helps potential buyers make an informed decision before ordering.

1. Timeline & Promised Lead Times
- Aug 7: Placed an order and paid in full via PayPal Goods & Services ($850 USD total) for an FM366 Size S (White Pearl + Gloss Raw UD Carbon). Estimated lead time given: ~18 days.
- Aug 25 – Sept 15: Repeated check-ins on progress. Each time, I was given shifting estimates: "painting this week", "ready next Monday", or "ready in 4 days".
- Sept 19: After 6 weeks of waiting and multiple missed deadlines, I sent a polite final notice stating I would need to open a PayPal dispute if a valid tracking number and QC preview video were not provided within 7 days.

2. Payment & Cancellation Flip-Flop
- Sept 19: Immediately upon mentioning a dispute deadline, Jack issued a full PayPal refund without consulting me. He stated that PayPal carries "huge risk" for them and demanded payment via Direct Bank Wire if I still wanted the frame.
- Sept 21: Jack emailed stating the frame was finished and sent a single low-resolution photo. I replied that I was still ready to complete the purchase provided there was buyer protection (either PayPal G&S or a direct Credit Card link via Stripe/Wise). Jack completely canceled the order in response.

3. Quality Control (QC) & Photo Red Flags
The single photo provided raised several serious concerns:
- Missing Fork: The frame was shown hanging alone; the matching painted fork was nowhere to be seen.
- Unfinished / Rough BB Shell: The bottom bracket shell was still taped up, with visible thick paint bleed and overspray edges around the lip.
- Chipped Paint at Rear Dropouts: Looking closely at the rear axle mount, the white paint was already jagged and chipped along the metal insert edge.
- Improper QC Environment: The frame was simply hanging in a messy storage area rather than being properly cleaned, prepped, and inspected in a dedicated QC setup.

Overall, the photo provided suggests a rushed, uninspected frame pulled directly from the paint rack rather than a finished, QC-passed product.

Summary / Takeaways for Buyers
If you are planning to pre-order or purchase from Mondince:
1. Lead Times: Be prepared for significantly longer lead times than quoted.
2. Payment Methods: Be aware that if delays occur and you request accountability, they may refuse PayPal and insist on unprotected Bank Wires.
3. Pre-Shipment Inspection: Inspect any photo/video preview very carefully before sending non-refundable funds.

(Attached photo sent by supplier for reference)

[FlorianS]

Let's start by saying that Mondince is a reputable company that sold lots of frames already and they generally have quite good quality control (compared to some other Chinese brands).
The main problem: Your expectations are way too high.

You might want to do some more research about Chinese companies and Chinese business best practices and such, before ordering directly from China (again).
Don't rush them. Patience is key. If you are impatient, ordering from China is not for you.

About the quality control: (cheap-ish) Chinese frames are not known for picture-perfect finishes. They might face the BB area / brake mounts before shipping, but there's no guarantee. Doesn't hurt to ask about that. The frame is propped up on a drying rack. Forks are stored separately on a drying rack for forks. Not sure what you expected, a clean, sterile white room where only your frame is suspended by some wire from the ceiling, perfectly lit? Not sure what you're up to, but what I'm seeing is not messy at all.

[Vesryn]

Thanks for your input, but I think you completely glossed over the main issue here:

1. Payment Security: Expecting buyer protection (PayPal G&S or Credit Card via Stripe) when paying $850+ to an overseas vendor is not "unrealistic expectations"—it is basic consumer protection. Unilaterally canceling PayPal and demanding an unrefundable Direct Bank Wire after 6 weeks of delays is a massive red flag, period.

2. Lead Times & Communication: There is a difference between "rushing" a builder and holding a supplier to their own promises. Promising ~18 days and then giving moving targets for 6 weeks ("ready in 4 days", "ready next Monday"), then stating on Saturday it will be ready Wednesday, only to suddenly pull out a "finished" frame on Monday morning isn't standard procedure—it's shifting goalposts.

3. QC: Nobody expects a sterile cleanroom or a high-end European paint job. However, expecting a freshly painted frame to not have chipped paint along the rear axle mount right out of the gate, and expecting to see the matching painted fork before sending money, is completely reasonable.

If you are comfortable sending unprotected bank wires for frames with visible paint chips and no proof of a matching fork, that's your choice. But documenting this for potential buyers who value buyer protection and clear timelines is precisely what this forum is for.

[frewster]

Agreed. Myself and other users have paid for Mondince frames without Paypal protection (wire transfers) and received our frames. I understand that it's frustrating to have to wait longer, but that's part of the game in paying less than half of what you would for a "Western" frame and being able to customize things such as the paint.

The whole point of a forum like this is to vet vendors as a group and have faith that other users are providing honest feedback so we can all make informed decisions on who to trust, set expectations properly, etc. There are many threads on Mondince frames and dozens (hundreds?) of users here who received their frames. I thought wiring was a bit odd for my FM336 frame, but it's part of what lets vendors like Mondince keep prices low by avoiding transaction fees and after reading about the many users here who have had success with Mondince I was comfortable enough to go through with it and had no issues.

Florian is right, this is a picture of the drying rack, and not an indication that the BB is going to ship with paint on it. The paint otherwise looks fine to me, especially since it's not finished and still has touch up/facing work to be done.

Your expectations were too high and perhaps doing a more thorough read through of some of the build threads here would've set them more accurately.

[Vesryn]

Appreciate your perspective, but normalizing unprotected bank wires as "part of the game" sets a dangerous precedent for this community.

1. PayPal wasn't rejected from day one to "avoid transaction fees"—it was accepted and held for 6 weeks through multiple missed deadlines. It was only refunded and swapped for a wire transfer AFTER accountability was requested. That is not fee management; that is removing buyer protection when timelines fail.

2. "It worked for me" is classic survivorship bias. Just because previous buyers received their frames via wire doesn't mean requiring basic buyer protection for an $850 transaction is "unrealistic."

3. Low prices don't have to mean forfeiting consumer rights. Plenty of reputable DTC Chinese manufacturers (Carbonda, LightCarbon, TanTan, etc.) routinely accept protected payments via Credit Card, PayPal, or Alibaba Trade Assurance without forcing buyers into non-refundable wire transfers.

Everyone has their own risk tolerance, but calling basic buyer protection an "overly high expectation" only encourages vendors to shift 100% of the risk onto the customer. I'm documenting this so future buyers can make an informed choice about their own financial safety.

[Serge_K]

when i m offered paypal as an option, i refuse, i do swift transfers to save the fee. If you dont trust that your seller will send your frame, dont do business with them.
Deadlines are often vibes, unfortunately. Lightcarbon is king of vibe deadlines.
If you raise a claim with paypal, it can cost them a lot of business because paypal may blacklist them.
You got impatient and they refunded you.
There's nothing you can do against deadlines, other than agreeing in some contract for delay based reparations, to which they would never agree / sign.
Now, i've never bought from them, and Jack is shifty for sure. The failed aero frame process earlier in the year with indiegogo was a mess.
i've bought a dozen frames and probably 20 wheelsets from various vendors, i dont remember using paypal once.

Edit because of message below saying the frame is brand new. If that's a brand new model, then by definition you can't rely on initial deadlines, they're almost meaningless by definition.

[FlorianS]

 

Thanks for your input, but I think you completely glossed over the main issue here:

1. Payment Security: Expecting buyer protection (PayPal G&S or Credit Card via Stripe) when paying $850+ to an overseas vendor is not "unrealistic expectations"—it is basic consumer protection. Unilaterally canceling PayPal and demanding an unrefundable Direct Bank Wire after 6 weeks of delays is a massive red flag, period.

2. Lead Times & Communication: There is a difference between "rushing" a builder and holding a supplier to their own promises. Promising ~18 days and then giving moving targets for 6 weeks ("ready in 4 days", "ready next Monday"), then stating on Saturday it will be ready Wednesday, only to suddenly pull out a "finished" frame on Monday morning isn't standard procedure—it's shifting goalposts.

3. QC: Nobody expects a sterile cleanroom or a high-end European paint job. However, expecting a freshly painted frame to not have chipped paint along the rear axle mount right out of the gate, and expecting to see the matching painted fork before sending money, is completely reasonable.

If you are comfortable sending unprotected bank wires for frames with visible paint chips and no proof of a matching fork, that's your choice. But documenting this for potential buyers who value buyer protection and clear timelines is precisely what this forum is for.

Looks like you got some trust issues here. If you don't trust them, don't buy from them.
PayPal is a huge risk for them. They offer it, because they kinda have to. But if anyone's opening a case, PayPal will most likely (99% of the time) side with the buyer, without properly reviewing the case. So Mondince will lose a lot of money.

About deadlines and timing: FM366 is a new frame design. Not one single FM366 has shipped yet. They're in the process of making the molds and testing the frame / refining the lay-up. That's probably why they're pushing deadlines further out. I don't want to defend Jack / Mondince here, but that is probably what is happening and you should've known about that if you followed the thread in this forum – well, you actually did so I'm a little confused why you're acting surprised?

[gribs]

I ordered a FM326 from Mondince when it was still just the FM316 with a choice of fork and paid via paypal. I'd previously used Light Carbon and it felt slightly more sketchy (from them I got a despatch email the day after it actually arrived but the rest was better) but after a chase up email after a month to see how things were progressing it was delivered 3 weeks later. A friend has also ordered one of their frames and I made it very clear to her to expect it to arrive eventually but not to expect great communication or accurate delivery dates.

You really need to reset your expectations when dealing with a small Chinese frame producer and I'm guessing they declined paypal payment once you'd mentioned disputes as they don't make enough profit on the frame to make the risk of selling to you worthwhile. 

[Vesryn]

Looking back, my initial post was definitely written in the heat of the moment out of frustration with the repeated missed promises and communication breakdown. As a first-time buyer directly from China, the sudden shift to bank wire after a dispute felt like a major red flag.

However, taking a step back and reading through the experiences here, I realize that these logistics hurdles and payment friction points are somewhat part of the territory when dealing directly with Chinese factories. I hope it's not just survivorship bias—I see plenty of members here navigating these risks successfully, so I'm evaluating my next steps with a much cooler head.

[Aerosoul]

Sorry you had a bad experience. I ordered my FM356 and it arrived last week -2 weeks later than promised. Some mistakes along the way -initially they got the colour slightly wrong (glossy instead of matte) and I rejected the offer of a replacement frame with a close enough colour. I changed colour and they shipped it with UPS so it arrived quickly and I didn't have extra duties to pay which I was worried about. Still shipped the wrong fork (with holes) but when I held it in my hand, I actually prefer it so this isn't a big issue.

Jack was happy to issue small refunds throughout (£70-100) for the delays and mistakes. Same as you, he would say painting next week and it would be the week after I would hear that its painted. He offered me an extra seatpost and integrated handlebar for free at some points. I declined the handlebar because their sizes weren't compatible with my bike fit but it came with an extra seatpost and hanger.

Frame looks to be ok quality. They have faced the interfaces but at the end of the day its a £500 frame. There are 1-2 random carbon threads visible inside the frame at some points but for the price I think it's acceptable.

Buying from china directly means you save 70% on the price of the frame but you have to tolerate the unreliable timescales.

[hubba]

With cheap frames I'm not expecting fast and perfect buying experience. I'm sure I'll get my frame eventually. But I must say I'm also not pleased how many Chinese sellers aren't honest about the delivery times. I'm sure they know from the beginning if they can't keep their word.

But with Mondince I appreciate that they answer fast. Nothing is more frustrating than getting delays and waiting for an answer for over a week. They also refunded me some money from the first delay and some more from the second which was nice. I can also cancel my order at anytime or switch to another frame if I'm in a hurry.

If they send my frame about month after ordering it's not that bad. I waited for my Yoeleo frame probably 3 months which was a lot more expensive.