Chinertown
Other Resources => Component Deals & Selection => Topic started by: elmtree on September 08, 2024, 10:23:44 PM
-
I just noticed that the tantan seraph tt-x43 is advertised as 14 speed with wheeltop eds. I looked at the pictures and counted sprockets and it does indeed have 14. The cassette is listed as ”CNC hollow colorful cassette-14 speed, 10-36T".
Can anyone find it? I'm curious if they're using a standard 12 speed chain and freehub body.
-
Danggg that is some find. Them living in 2035 while I rock 10s mechanical.
The rear wheel spacing is the regular 12x142 and no mention of any odd freehub so I guess they have managed to fit 14 cogs on existing MS/HG freehub body? Also the chain seems 14 speed made by SUMC. Couldn't find any mention of 14s stuff on Aliex, yet. And the whole thing is $1050. Crazy.
-
At which point does adding cogs require new hub & rear thru axle widths?
Has anyone tested longevity of 10 vs 11 vs 12 vs 13s? Intuitively, the more cogs you add, the narrower the chain, the more fragile and fiddly, and the less durable, right?
-
At which point does adding cogs require new hub & rear thru axle widths?
Has anyone tested longevity of 10 vs 11 vs 12 vs 13s? Intuitively, the more cogs you add, the narrower the chain, the more fragile and fiddly, and the less durable, right?
It will inevitably get more fragile, I guess. That being said: I'm running Campy Ekar 13sp for around 3.500k now in all kinds of weather, full season, including winter and salty roads. I put it through a lot. Chain and cassette are hot waxed and still good as new. I got a Sram crank with a 13sp compatible chainring from Ratio components. That might be good for another 3000k but it'll need replacing first, I guess. But that's normal since it's the only aluminium part of the drivetrain and it has to deal with some pretty hardcore cross chaining compared to a 2x setup, I guess. And it's actually reasonably priced.
I can't speak for the quality of the Aliexpress stuff, though. I had a pretty bad experience with a ZTTO 12sp chain and I'm definitely not going to buy cheap chains on aliexpress again, no matter how light and shiny they are. ZTTO and SROAD cassettes (monobloc steel) however have been absolutely fine for me.
-
At which point does adding cogs require new hub & rear thru axle widths?
Has anyone tested longevity of 10 vs 11 vs 12 vs 13s? Intuitively, the more cogs you add, the narrower the chain, the more fragile and fiddly, and the less durable, right?
Yes. There are still people lamenting the switch to 10 (nevermind 11 and 12) speed because everything wears out faster and is harder to adjust. 9 is still the sweet spot for them
But most of the 13 speed cassettes afaik use 12 speed chains (campagnolo unofficially, rotor and now sram) with the largest cog moved inwards which may interfere with spokes in some wheelsets, to still fit 12*142
-
And they are charging just 1049 USD for the full bike with carbon wheels and electronic shifting? Am I missing something (besides shipping)?
Otherwise that's a hell of a promising package. Much better than anything advertised to "beginner cyclists" locally.
-
And they are charging just 1049 USD for the full bike with carbon wheels and electronic shifting? Am I missing something (besides shipping)?
Otherwise that's a hell of a promising package. Much better than anything advertised to "beginner cyclists" locally.
Someone from china on another forum said twitter bikes have a reputation for being very shitty and poorly built in china. That's the only feedback I've seen for twitter. But at those prices it's weird nobody gambled on them, even if it's just to poach the wheeltop groupset you're getting good value
-
Just to clarify: I guess you meant "tantan" when your autocorrect typed "twitter"? Otherwise I need some clarification :D
-
sorry i just misread and assumed the thread was about twitter as they've advertised 13 speed wheeltop for a while. i can't talk about tantan i simply misread
-
Yes. There are still people lamenting the switch to 10 (nevermind 11 and 12) speed because everything wears out faster and is harder to adjust. 9 is still the sweet spot for them
But most of the 13 speed cassettes afaik use 12 speed chains (campagnolo unofficially, rotor and now sram) with the largest cog moved inwards which may interfere with spokes in some wheelsets, to still fit 12*142
Campy 13sp chains and cogs are narrower than their 12sp stuff and they're not compatible with each other. I know, cuz I'm using both.
Sram has kept the spacing for their newest 13sp cassettes the same. They just moved the 46tooth sprocket further inboard and since it's so big, it can still clear the spokes. It wouldn't be possible with a 10-36, I guess.
-
Campy 13sp chains and cogs are narrower than their 12sp stuff and they're not compatible with each other. I know, cuz I'm using both.
Sram has kept the spacing for their newest 13sp cassettes the same. They just moved the 46tooth sprocket further inboard and since it's so big, it can still clear the spokes. It wouldn't be possible with a 10-36, I guess.
which 12sp chain are you using on ekar cassette? a flattop sram chain works best
-
At which point does adding cogs require new hub & rear thru axle widths?
Has anyone tested longevity of 10 vs 11 vs 12 vs 13s? Intuitively, the more cogs you add, the narrower the chain, the more fragile and fiddly, and the less durable, right?
The new SRAM 13sp has same cog dimension and uses the same chain as 12sp. Apparently they got a little extra room either side of the biggest and smallest cog, which allowed them throw another gear in.
-
Yes. There are still people lamenting the switch to 10 (nevermind 11 and 12) speed because everything wears out faster and is harder to adjust. 9 is still the sweet spot for them
But most of the 13 speed cassettes afaik use 12 speed chains (campagnolo unofficially, rotor and now sram) with the largest cog moved inwards which may interfere with spokes in some wheelsets, to still fit 12*142
I'll die on the hill of 11 speed being peak bike tech!! lol!
My 11s XT is still going strong on my mtb. I see no need to upgrade.
-
which 12sp chain are you using on ekar cassette? a flattop sram chain works best
I’m using a Campy 13sp Ekar chain on the Ekar cassette and I’m using a Chorus 12sp chain on my 12sp Record mechanical groupset. No need to mix things up. I’ve used all kinds of chains and Campy chains actually last the longest for me.
-
Someone from china on another forum said twitter bikes have a reputation for being very shitty and poorly built in china. That's the only feedback I've seen for twitter. But at those prices it's weird nobody gambled on them, even if it's just to poach the wheeltop groupset you're getting good value
The main problem at least on my side has been the geometry of the cheaper options. Its super weird. When you get to 2k you have nicer geometries but at that price none of my clients want a non branded (western) brand when they can get for example a Superior for little more.
-
I reached out to them via their Alibaba store and inquired about purchasing just the cassette and chain (since the chain is spec'd to be 14S).
-
I’m using a Campy 13sp Ekar chain on the Ekar cassette and I’m using a Chorus 12sp chain on my 12sp Record mechanical groupset. No need to mix things up. I’ve used all kinds of chains and Campy chains actually last the longest for me.
What's your opinion of ekar? Tempted to put a 1x on my partner's bike because she struggles with the whole 2 chainring thing lol
-
What's your opinion of ekar? Tempted to put a 1x on my partner's bike because she struggles with the whole 2 chainring thing lol
If you got a frame with super short chainstays and internal routing through an integrated cockpit, I'd say better avoid it. I love it, but I'm running it on a custom steel gravel frame with external routing. Being 13sp mechanical, it depends on an accurate setup and smooth running cables. And super short chainstays (like <420mm or even less) lead to more extreme chainlines in the outermost gears which Ekar really doesn't like.
I got it very cheap cuz I bought most of the parts used. The 1st gen Ekar is currently heavily discounted in some stores since Ekar GT came out. If you buy a cassette new, go for the Ekar GT cassettes over the gen 1 cassettes. The gear ratios are better (10-48, for instance) and they do not have the creaking problem, that plagued some of the 1st gen cassettes (though this can be alleviated with a bit of Loctite IME).
I love the brakes. I love the super short lever throw for shifts. I like the thumb lever, but that's really a matter of taste. I love Campy's lever shape. Their electronic stuff has reached the point of irrelevance but they do know how to make good mechanical groupsets IMO. Ekar to me is the only 1X groupset that truly feels like 2X because of the available gears. I've been running Sram 11sp 1X before. I'd be interested to check out Sram 13sp. But I really can't be arsed to ride electronic on my gravel bike. I'm using it for ultras. I don't wanna be stranded in the middle of the night in the woods with a non functioning derailleur. I ride electronic on the road bike, though.
-
I reached out to them via their Alibaba store and inquired about purchasing just the cassette and chain (since the chain is spec'd to be 14S).
They won't sell components. That's lame.
-
Did they at least tell you what kind/"brand" of cassette that is?
-
My buddy just got his TT-X43 bike, and I was surprised to see it came with a 14-speed cassette. We didn't bother taking it off to check if it was hollow. After adjusting the rear derailleur, I was amazed at how smoothly the Wheeltop shifted through all 14 gears
-
He just ordered the bike without checking what components it comes with?! :D
But nice to see someone who actually has it. How's the bike in general?
-
He just ordered the bike without checking what components it comes with?! :D
But nice to see someone who actually has it. How's the bike in general?
Yeah he asked about bout but never got a response for it.
This is his first road bike. So he's not sure what to look for. All I can tell is that bike was well package and put together when shipped. His fallen few times already with the bike on the non drive side and no issues. Not sure what that tell you.
You can find the bike on Tantan/serpha social media account its the all white one.
-
Yeah makes sense. Bold of him to go "full china" when he's got little to no experience with it :D
But glad it worked out. Usually if there are no obvious flaws in the beginning the bikes are mostly fine.
-
What are the gear ratios of that 14s cassette?
14s would be really nice for road 1x if the range is ~400%
-
Says "CNC hollow colorful cassette-14 speed, 10-36T" on their website. As I understand it, that's the limit the WheelTop EDS TX RD allows for.
-
gotten a full bike to test it out myself.
this is the 14 speed cassette.
-
Does it have any name or "brand" on it?
By the looks of it, the biggest cog is aluminum and rest is steel. Can you confirm?
-
Does it have any name or "brand" on it?
By the looks of it, the biggest cog is aluminum and rest is steel. Can you confirm?
No brands at all.
The whole piece of cassette is milled from a single block of steel, the last piece is actually aluminium which acts as the hub interface as well.
Also the hub body is a weird thing, it is a shimano with modified lock nut/ring.
-
Definitely looks "special". Maybe a way to avoid any patent issues?
-
Definitely looks "special". Maybe a way to avoid any patent issues?
Looks more like the lockring is longer to fit more cogs. The HG lockring patent long expired
-
Looks more like the lockring is longer to fit more cogs. The HG lockring patent long expired
That was my first thought too, but how would that fit in a normal frame?
-
That was my first thought too, but how would that fit in a normal frame?
Its actually a shorter HG hub body with longer lockring.
Thinner cassette and thinner chain.
-
Its actually a shorter HG hub body with longer lockring.
Thinner cassette and thinner chain.
Aha! I see the smallest cog is 10T, so that cassette would not fit on a standard HG freehub... So they have invented a work-around.
So this cassette will not fit on any mainstream freehub I suppose?
-
So when is this setup available on AliEx? ;D
It looks similar in construction to my ZTTO 11 speed 9-46t cassette. So far I have no complaints with the design other than I'm not a fan of alloy granny cog. I try to avoid avoid using that gear if possible.
-
No brands at all.
The whole piece of cassette is milled from a single block of steel, the last piece is actually aluminium which acts as the hub interface as well.
Also the hub body is a weird thing, it is a shimano with modified lock nut/ring.
Interesting, this is probably why they would not sell me a cassette.
-
Interesting, this is probably why they would not sell me a cassette.
You will not be able to mount it on any other wheel...
-
You will not be able to mount it on any other wheel...
... Yes that is understood now that we have a closer look at the cassette.
-
Can you attach a standard HG/XD freehub on that wheel? What happens if you need to replace the cassette?
-
Interesting, this is probably why they would not sell me a cassette.
Actually I spoke with them and they are willing to sell just the cassette, around 150usd. Just that you won't be able to mount it on standard hubs which defeats the purpose.
So far I have yet to change to another cassette, might try soon.
The bike surprisingly works very well given the cheap pricing.
-
Actually I spoke with them and they are willing to sell just the cassette, around 150usd. Just that you won't be able to mount it on standard hubs which defeats the purpose.
So far I have yet to change to another cassette, might try soon.
The bike surprisingly works very well given the cheap pricing.
Which bike is it? Can you share so pics and details on pricing and shipping?
-
Very first post of the thread has the info x43
-
Actually I spoke with them and they are willing to sell just the cassette, around 150usd. Just that you won't be able to mount it on standard hubs which defeats the purpose.
So far I have yet to change to another cassette, might try soon.
The bike surprisingly works very well given the cheap pricing.
Curious if this is because you already own the bike. I reached out via their website, aliexpress, and taobao. All responses were no.
-
Curious if this is because you already own the bike. I reached out via their website, aliexpress, and taobao. All responses were no.
Would make sense since if you don't have the bike you can not install the cassette. And than they would get bad reviews for selling those cassettes that do not fit...
-
Looks like a very similar solution as the Rotor 1x13 cassettes and freehubs. Theirs however let you use a normal shimano cassette on the freehub, with their 10T sprocket screwing onto the 11 tooth and an elongated lockring securing the whole lot to the freehub. The hub was spaced similar to if you use a boost adapter on a normal 142mm rear wheel, so slightly iffy chainline, but it works.
I have a vague memory of a company in the early 90's (maybe mountain tamers) selling a small sprocket for standard (7 speed?) cassettes of the time that replaced your lockring and overhung the axle a bit...kinda reminds me of that.
-
Found a video about it
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MhQVCKCjIRM
-
Can anyone else see the video above?
Anyways, went to youtube and saw this short video;
https://youtube.com/shorts/3QXORBnJpi4?si=zQ_MKtQ6kkPnadAV
-
No, the forum cannot display it. This is the link kbernstein posted (same channel as your short, just longer review):
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MhQVCKCjIRM
-
Can anyone else see the video above?
Anyways, went to youtube and saw this short video;
https://youtube.com/shorts/3QXORBnJpi4?si=zQ_MKtQ6kkPnadAV
How about longterm review of 14 speed cassette?