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VB-177 vs VB-168: My Guide To Choosing A Frame
Step One: Frequently Asked Questions 1 - Is the 177 lighter than the 168? YES. 2 - Is the 168 more aero than the 177? YES. 3 - Does the 177 have more flex than the 168? Probably, since it’s lighter… 4 - Is the 168 more stiff than the 177? Probably, since it’s heavier… 5 - Does this mean the 177 is a “flexy” frame overall? NO. 6 - Is the 168 one the stiffest frames you’ve tested? NO. 7 - Are both frames stable at high speeds? Road stability is not exclusive to the frame. Bottom Line: The differences between the two frame are marginal at best. Especially for a $500 frame. There are more important aspects to your overall bike build to consider. 168 does in fact support 32c tires. The 177 (at least mine) does not. Maybe 30c max. This alone might be a deal breaker for the 177. The 177 uses is a standard seatpost which will be wildly easier to find on the open market for replacements. Step Two: Geometry VB 177 Geometry (Size 56/L) Stack: 556 Reach: 395 VB 168 Geometry (Size 56/L) Stack: 556 Reach: 398 VB 177 Geometry (Size 54/M) Stack: 536 Reach: 392 VB 168 Geometry (Size 54/M) Stack: 535 Reach: 388 Bottom Line: You should probably seek a professional bike fit if you’re uncertain. Geometry is similar for both frames, plus/minus a couple of millimeters in reach. I personally am not a fan of zero-degree setback seatposts. Neither frames are intended to fit all body types. I’m also not a fan of integrated handlebars either, since they limit adjustability later. Step Three: Aerodynamics Your wheel choice is one of the most critical areas where aerodynamics can be either saved or loss. The 177 paired with deep sectioned aero wheels will be faster on the flats than the 168 with shallow wheels. And the aerodynamic design of the 168 will inherently trump the lightweight of the 177 on the flats when paired with identical wheels. Bottom Line: DO NOT SKIMP on your wheelset. Step Four: Total System Weight There is not enough emphasis put on total system weight (bike + rider + gear). Nothing wrong with having weight weenie tendencies, but 50-200 gram weight savings isn’t going to make the difference for anything below a World Pro Tour Race. See example below: Bike: 7900g Rider: 74000g 2 Water Bottles: 1400g Helmet/Gear/Ect: 1000g Total System Weight: 84300 grams (84.3kg) Bottom Line: Striving to save even 100-200 grams (regardless of cost) is literally only like 0.25 percent of the total weight. 0.25 PERCENT. One-fourth of one percent. Also when it comes to wheels and frames...you WILL eventually be penalized on stiffness once the weight dips to a certain threshold. Step Five: Road Stability Your stem length and wheel choice play a pivotal role in stability at higher speeds. These aspects should be considered before asking the question of stability in general. Yes both frames are stable...but I run a 130mm stem paired with aero wheels at a depth (60-65mm) that is suitable for my weight (74kg). Final thoughts - For the pursuit of speed (and even climbing) your wheel choice, position on the bike, tire/innertube/tubeless choice, and drivetrain efficiency all matter significantly more than simply comparing weight. The 177 is probably the better choice if bike fit is a concern, you absolutely need a climbing bike, and you don’t need clearance for wider tires. Some people may also prefer the "look" of the 177 which is totally understandable. For everyone else…168 is mostly likely the more reasonable choice. And this actually makes sense, since the Tarmac SL7 is supposed to be the one bike to rule them all. Okay this guide took way longer than I anticipated. Time to suit up my party clothes, get some drinks in me, and hit the clubs. Have a great weekend. August 26, 2022, 07:43:40 PM |
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Re: High end big brand OEM road rims 38/45/50mm on sale!!!
Do you have a web link to these rims? Checked the link in your signature, but didn't find the matching wheels (R5026TL). Searched it in google and found the same wheels offered by Fact, is it the same company? Sorry, since these rims are OEM for big brand, we can not list them onto our website. We offer them at this on sale price since our factory has thousands of them available in stock, we can ship the rims in 3-4 days after order placed. We are confident in our rims quality, so we offer 2 years warranty. We can build the wheels with.carbon spokes or Sapim CX-Ray spokes Attachment is for the weight reference August 31, 2022, 08:25:01 AM |
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Re: Groupset News
RX 2x12 carbon hydraulic left brifter weight A L-TWOO employee recently posted a thread sharing some anecdotes on the company's hydraulic development process. It's too long and technical for me to properly translate but you can get a basic idea with machine translation. The gist is that L-TWOO faced some pretty significant patent barriers which limited their design direction. They eventually settled on a Campy style design for reasons practical and legal: the vertical master cylinder layout performed the best and also left the most room for the shifting mechanism. But most importantly, Campy didn't patent their hydraulic implementation! September 14, 2022, 03:11:42 PM |
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Re: Elite Wheels / Aliexpress / Trace Velo
... Can you share the screen shot of your comment on Trace Velo's video here so we can see both sides of the issue and evaluate properly for ourselves. Mind you, it is his channel and source of business and hence he has the right to do whatever he likes with his comment section. Most of us ended up in this forum because we started our journey watching Trace Velo and hence built our first bike ourselves and saved a lot of money in the process. Lots of people here also at one point or the other had issues with dealers. This has nothing to do with whichever youtube reviewers we watched before pulling the trigger. Just because you had a bad experience with a dealer he reviewed doesn't mean you should come here and run him under the bus. However, I do sympathize with you on the terrible situation which I feel you should take up with EliteWheels and probably Aliexpress. Maybe you should make your own YouTube video about the situation and put all the keywords that will direct even more traffic, visibility and awareness to your issue with EliteWheels and Aliexpress. Try doing something positive for the community first before throwing a major contributor of the community under the bus just because of your one bad issue out of many other successful customers. In addition, just like Velobuild once did regarding issues with their services, It will be good if Elite Wheels or even Trace Velo can comment on this issue since both have lots of customers and followers here respectively. Always the best to hear from both sides before throwing the baby out with the bathwater. November 01, 2022, 11:27:59 PM |
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Re: Hygge Aero Carbon Frame
My frame seems to be in Germany since yesterday, so I'm hoping to receive it in the next couple of days. So it has been very fast shipping until now. Edit: the frame should be here tomorrow. That's VERY fast 
August 08, 2023, 02:16:03 AM |
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Re: Hygge Aero Carbon Frame
Edit: removed post because of Hygge stealing my pictures.
August 10, 2023, 06:37:52 AM |
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Re: Interesting Aliexpress finds! - good deals, interesting stuff, new products etc!
Sadly, Shimano's cranks aren't bullet proof either That is the understatement of a lifetime. Three came unglued on me. So much for them never a replacement either or even a discount. They are never getting my money again. August 10, 2023, 05:51:55 PM |
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Re: Hygge Aero Carbon Frame
Edit: removed post because of Hygge stealing my pictures.
August 12, 2023, 07:30:35 AM |
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Re: Hygge Aero Carbon Frame
@tidy Yeah, I saw it...  They just took my pics and used them without asking... 
August 17, 2023, 02:32:27 PM |
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Re: Hygge Aero Carbon Frame
Yeah, I saw it... Complete rubbish practice right there... August 17, 2023, 02:53:45 PM |
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