Hello. I wondered when your FM822 frame will be released? I cannot find anything about it.. can you share any information?
Thank you
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#2
29er / Re: TanTan FM199-B-SL
October 12, 2019, 08:30:37 PM
https://forums.mtbr.com/29er-bikes/chinese-carbon-29er-640919-49.html#post13941629
Not sure any of them care too much tbh
My biggest problem is still finding a somewhat modern reach..
Not sure any of them care too much tbh
My biggest problem is still finding a somewhat modern reach..
#3
29er / Re: TanTan FM199-B-SL
October 08, 2019, 08:23:18 PM
Hey, just wanted you all to see how the customer support with TanTan is: nonexistent.
I had a frame arrive with damage in shipping, which Alibaba terms from the seller stated is NOT a warranty issue and is the responsibility of the buyer.
Now the dropout and frame have eaten away at each other, even though the single tiny fastener on the dropout was tight. The response from TanTan is silence.
I recommend to steer clear of this brand and seller in particular, they will only speak to you if you bring them money.
For my next build I will be using Pro Mance FM015, which is 7-10mm longer in reach and has a more stout seat tube, I am hopeful as the brand is well known.
It will be nice to use a stem smaller than 110mm anyways.
From now on - all my builds will have the dropouts set into place with Loctite 609, or 641 and primer.
Word to the wise, if your dropout/hanger fastens to the frame with one single screw, it will move around in the frame. Don't trust the engineers, be proactive and treat it like a press-fit , because in essence it is.
Happy trails!
I had a frame arrive with damage in shipping, which Alibaba terms from the seller stated is NOT a warranty issue and is the responsibility of the buyer.
Now the dropout and frame have eaten away at each other, even though the single tiny fastener on the dropout was tight. The response from TanTan is silence.
I recommend to steer clear of this brand and seller in particular, they will only speak to you if you bring them money.
For my next build I will be using Pro Mance FM015, which is 7-10mm longer in reach and has a more stout seat tube, I am hopeful as the brand is well known.
It will be nice to use a stem smaller than 110mm anyways.
From now on - all my builds will have the dropouts set into place with Loctite 609, or 641 and primer.
Word to the wise, if your dropout/hanger fastens to the frame with one single screw, it will move around in the frame. Don't trust the engineers, be proactive and treat it like a press-fit , because in essence it is.
Happy trails!
#4
29er / Re: TanTan FM199-B-SL
June 17, 2019, 03:40:21 AM
I don't run clips yet, my flat shoes are more comfortable, and I have an identical second 29er wheelset - Ti spokes, Notavec hubs with Schwalbe Big Apples which are faster and doesn't eat the mountain tires on the road. Actually I just realized I posted photos of both wheelsets, so you can see both options I have. The knobbies eventually will be on a different bike, but may swap back to this for racing. I spin out at 34 mph with this gearing, fast enough especially for touring. I plan to work my way up to longer bikepacking tours and possibly travel internationally with this setup.
For performance, I compare it with gravel bikes, which I tried 42mm tires on 28mm Stans rims prior. Rim strike, punctures, all bad - and only marginally faster uphill. On flats, with slicks the drag is minimal anyways. And a slick 2.4 at low PSI tracks similarly to a 42mm file tread gravel tire in terms of speed and grip, unless loaded up or racing in a group. Sliding a little is OK.
I use this bike for shopping actually, but usually won't leave it outside. The front wheel and headset top cap are Pitlock, not easy to remove. I plan to also run a Pitlock on the crankset. Still I would use 2 locks and watch the bike.
It would be a good race bike. On the street, acceleration is "insane", barely any flex in the frame and it's so light. Probably a carbon thing in general but it's my first carbon bike. I had an e-biker ask me what kind of bike it was and why I was so fast - that was on the road. On mountain, I PR'd everything I touched on my first real ride offroad.. stuff I was descending on a 170mm enduro bike, but I was over a minute faster in some parts. It was pretty scary though. So, suspension might be something I use as an in-between step. Really I built this bike for road and touring, but I am too aggressive for road/randonneuring frames, wheels, etc. I also like being able to go offroad without any concern for being able to ride out.
I may run a 100-120mm (depending on the air spring length) fork on this bike until building a 120/130mm XC bike, in the future. It would be a similar Chinese carbon frame. LightCarbon LCFS911 has caught my eye, but it can wait. https://www.lightcarbon.com/lightcarbon-new-27-5plus-29er-cross-country-mountain-bike-frame_p39.html
My only issues with this FM199-B-SL currently are the fit (my fault), shorter reach - which may come in handy if I use drop bars, and trying to find a good position with the bars. I like aggressive riding and it's difficult to balance a 740mm bar with a horizontal sprinting position on the road, it's either too short with a 90mm stem, comfortable sitting upright, or 110mm which feels really weird cornering, and wheelies to break the bike leaning one direction or another by steering feels really floppy, and slower. Drop bars are appealing but I think until the LCFS911 or similar is complete, not worth considering. Drop bars are limiting for terrain, and I would also need a new brake setup as well as new shifters and adapters for the derailleur.
short answer is yes :p
For performance, I compare it with gravel bikes, which I tried 42mm tires on 28mm Stans rims prior. Rim strike, punctures, all bad - and only marginally faster uphill. On flats, with slicks the drag is minimal anyways. And a slick 2.4 at low PSI tracks similarly to a 42mm file tread gravel tire in terms of speed and grip, unless loaded up or racing in a group. Sliding a little is OK.
I use this bike for shopping actually, but usually won't leave it outside. The front wheel and headset top cap are Pitlock, not easy to remove. I plan to also run a Pitlock on the crankset. Still I would use 2 locks and watch the bike.
It would be a good race bike. On the street, acceleration is "insane", barely any flex in the frame and it's so light. Probably a carbon thing in general but it's my first carbon bike. I had an e-biker ask me what kind of bike it was and why I was so fast - that was on the road. On mountain, I PR'd everything I touched on my first real ride offroad.. stuff I was descending on a 170mm enduro bike, but I was over a minute faster in some parts. It was pretty scary though. So, suspension might be something I use as an in-between step. Really I built this bike for road and touring, but I am too aggressive for road/randonneuring frames, wheels, etc. I also like being able to go offroad without any concern for being able to ride out.
I may run a 100-120mm (depending on the air spring length) fork on this bike until building a 120/130mm XC bike, in the future. It would be a similar Chinese carbon frame. LightCarbon LCFS911 has caught my eye, but it can wait. https://www.lightcarbon.com/lightcarbon-new-27-5plus-29er-cross-country-mountain-bike-frame_p39.html
My only issues with this FM199-B-SL currently are the fit (my fault), shorter reach - which may come in handy if I use drop bars, and trying to find a good position with the bars. I like aggressive riding and it's difficult to balance a 740mm bar with a horizontal sprinting position on the road, it's either too short with a 90mm stem, comfortable sitting upright, or 110mm which feels really weird cornering, and wheelies to break the bike leaning one direction or another by steering feels really floppy, and slower. Drop bars are appealing but I think until the LCFS911 or similar is complete, not worth considering. Drop bars are limiting for terrain, and I would also need a new brake setup as well as new shifters and adapters for the derailleur.
short answer is yes :p
#9
29er / Re: TanTan FM199-B-SL
June 15, 2019, 10:18:03 AM
Sorry for the delay y'all,
I just finished building a desktop computer which was very helpful in sitting through writing this review.
The frame is now riding pretty well, but I'm working on my fit on the bike, and I'm about to re-dish my wheels, carbon grit the seatpost again and lube the rear thru axle to try to get a better alignment for myself, but I'm sure the frame is not bent. I have a history of bending frames - 3 surly Ogre, 1 Niner Sir 9, then the Kinesis I ordered arrived bent by 6mm or so, and I also received a rear triangle replacement for a mondraker dune which arrived bent, and it was outside of warranty so they wouldn't ship another (not original buyer of that one). So I had decided on carbon to avoid all those issues. I also ordered through alibaba using paypal, and in talking with the seller I was able to negotiate ~100 off the price.
There was a small chip of carbon area in the headtube which the upper headset bearing seats on top of which was cracked and fell out of the frame when I received it, but its not a linear crack and seems fine so far, I let them know and they informed me that actually the buyer is responsible for any damage in shipping - its in the contract terms, I did check, so I'd buy this with a VISA rather than Paypal just to be able to make a claim more easily (not entirely sure but I think VISA would be better for this). I forget if VISA was an option for payment now.. maybe go through paypal with VISA or something. It's been a while now so I forget.
I had a few issues with the build - namely the XT non-boost crankset I was hoping to use didn't clear the chainstays, and I was left with SRAM Dub as the best option as they are designed for PF BB and don't increase Q factor to accommodate boost. So I went with XX1 Dub cranks$$$. At this point in the build, the crankset I'm using cost more than the frame. Another issue I noticed is not being able to drop the saddle much without cutting the seatpost down by several inches, but this frame is really not for Trail riding even if I do XC race with it at some point.
The rear brake mount was difficult to accomodate 180mm rotor with flat mount - luckily Cannondale makes an adapter that works perfectly, it just took some time to find it online. No issues with the rear brake setup so far.
The cable routing for the shifting on this frame seems poorly thought out as the adapters that fit into the frame to hold the cable on the headtube where they insert into the frame wasn't designed for full length shifter housing - I just drilled out the adapter before I put it into the frame. If you didn't run them full length what you would end up with is the cable grinding away internally at the bottom bracket curve of the frame.. I then covered the unused holes in the headtube and BB with electrical tape, which keeps mud and water out and looks decent. I do get some cable rattle which is super annoying but there are a number of fixes for that I haven't explored yet.
After I built it up I was getting creaking and was sure it was the PF BB, which I tapped out and pressed back in 3x with loctite, first 609, then 641 and primer 2x, before going to a shop and they pointed out it may be the axle creaking in the rear dropout. Once a little grease went there, the creaking stopped. I think the creaking came from both spots so it was still a good thing to loctite the BB.
One thing that still bothers me about this frame is the reach is a bit short compared to modern geo or forward geo frames, so I'm currently running a 110mm stem.. working on that with different bars. 110mm is really too long for trail riding, but I forgive this bike a lot because of the way it puts down power, and its so light. I ordered a 19" which has a 448mm reach, on paper it looks fine but the numbers I was basing off of (520mm reach + stem combined total) are for Enduro setup with a dual position air fork that I can drop down. I have a 2.25 rear and 2.35 front tire so a larger rear may help slightly.
Another thing I did was wrap the top tube in mastic tape 6x then put a final layer of electrical tape over that, which is to prevent damage if the bars spin, my SRAM shifter doesn't clear the frame and that same event caused some bad TT damage to the Kinesis I was using before this.
I still think this is one of the best options based on the geo numbers, but please let me know if you guys are aware of any similar frames with a longer reach that don't sacrifice head tube angle or use much longer chainstays.
To answer Carbonazza, I didn't paint it and wish I had waited for the unpainted carbon version to see the layup and cracks may be more visible, not sure - mine is UD Matte which looks great anyhow, flat black paint.
Specs:
Novatec D542 rear hub, D641 front hub. Gold Titanium spokes from Danscomp. Alloy nipples with steel nipple washers. No, they dont flex and I love Ti spokes, but tension is crucial.
Rocket Ron rear tire, Continental Mountain King Protection front tire
XTR M9020 brakes - 180mm rear and 200mm front rotor - metallic pads
Salsa seatclamp, Thomson Elite Seatpost, Ergon SMC4-M saddle
Easton Havoc bars, thomson Elite X4 stem, ODI Oury lock on grips
Shimano Saint pedals which I will likely swap for OneUp plastic pedals to save ~150g
Sram Dub XX1 cranks and Dub BB
Sram Eagle X01 shifter, derr, cassette
Topeak alloy WB cages
Surly Krampus fork with mudguard
Stock headset with a cane creek upper cap
Thanks for existing, chinertown, it was very helpful to read these threads in gaining any confidence in ordering one of these frames.
I just finished building a desktop computer which was very helpful in sitting through writing this review.
The frame is now riding pretty well, but I'm working on my fit on the bike, and I'm about to re-dish my wheels, carbon grit the seatpost again and lube the rear thru axle to try to get a better alignment for myself, but I'm sure the frame is not bent. I have a history of bending frames - 3 surly Ogre, 1 Niner Sir 9, then the Kinesis I ordered arrived bent by 6mm or so, and I also received a rear triangle replacement for a mondraker dune which arrived bent, and it was outside of warranty so they wouldn't ship another (not original buyer of that one). So I had decided on carbon to avoid all those issues. I also ordered through alibaba using paypal, and in talking with the seller I was able to negotiate ~100 off the price.
There was a small chip of carbon area in the headtube which the upper headset bearing seats on top of which was cracked and fell out of the frame when I received it, but its not a linear crack and seems fine so far, I let them know and they informed me that actually the buyer is responsible for any damage in shipping - its in the contract terms, I did check, so I'd buy this with a VISA rather than Paypal just to be able to make a claim more easily (not entirely sure but I think VISA would be better for this). I forget if VISA was an option for payment now.. maybe go through paypal with VISA or something. It's been a while now so I forget.
I had a few issues with the build - namely the XT non-boost crankset I was hoping to use didn't clear the chainstays, and I was left with SRAM Dub as the best option as they are designed for PF BB and don't increase Q factor to accommodate boost. So I went with XX1 Dub cranks$$$. At this point in the build, the crankset I'm using cost more than the frame. Another issue I noticed is not being able to drop the saddle much without cutting the seatpost down by several inches, but this frame is really not for Trail riding even if I do XC race with it at some point.
The rear brake mount was difficult to accomodate 180mm rotor with flat mount - luckily Cannondale makes an adapter that works perfectly, it just took some time to find it online. No issues with the rear brake setup so far.
The cable routing for the shifting on this frame seems poorly thought out as the adapters that fit into the frame to hold the cable on the headtube where they insert into the frame wasn't designed for full length shifter housing - I just drilled out the adapter before I put it into the frame. If you didn't run them full length what you would end up with is the cable grinding away internally at the bottom bracket curve of the frame.. I then covered the unused holes in the headtube and BB with electrical tape, which keeps mud and water out and looks decent. I do get some cable rattle which is super annoying but there are a number of fixes for that I haven't explored yet.
After I built it up I was getting creaking and was sure it was the PF BB, which I tapped out and pressed back in 3x with loctite, first 609, then 641 and primer 2x, before going to a shop and they pointed out it may be the axle creaking in the rear dropout. Once a little grease went there, the creaking stopped. I think the creaking came from both spots so it was still a good thing to loctite the BB.
One thing that still bothers me about this frame is the reach is a bit short compared to modern geo or forward geo frames, so I'm currently running a 110mm stem.. working on that with different bars. 110mm is really too long for trail riding, but I forgive this bike a lot because of the way it puts down power, and its so light. I ordered a 19" which has a 448mm reach, on paper it looks fine but the numbers I was basing off of (520mm reach + stem combined total) are for Enduro setup with a dual position air fork that I can drop down. I have a 2.25 rear and 2.35 front tire so a larger rear may help slightly.
Another thing I did was wrap the top tube in mastic tape 6x then put a final layer of electrical tape over that, which is to prevent damage if the bars spin, my SRAM shifter doesn't clear the frame and that same event caused some bad TT damage to the Kinesis I was using before this.
I still think this is one of the best options based on the geo numbers, but please let me know if you guys are aware of any similar frames with a longer reach that don't sacrifice head tube angle or use much longer chainstays.
To answer Carbonazza, I didn't paint it and wish I had waited for the unpainted carbon version to see the layup and cracks may be more visible, not sure - mine is UD Matte which looks great anyhow, flat black paint.
Specs:
Novatec D542 rear hub, D641 front hub. Gold Titanium spokes from Danscomp. Alloy nipples with steel nipple washers. No, they dont flex and I love Ti spokes, but tension is crucial.
Rocket Ron rear tire, Continental Mountain King Protection front tire
XTR M9020 brakes - 180mm rear and 200mm front rotor - metallic pads
Salsa seatclamp, Thomson Elite Seatpost, Ergon SMC4-M saddle
Easton Havoc bars, thomson Elite X4 stem, ODI Oury lock on grips
Shimano Saint pedals which I will likely swap for OneUp plastic pedals to save ~150g
Sram Dub XX1 cranks and Dub BB
Sram Eagle X01 shifter, derr, cassette
Topeak alloy WB cages
Surly Krampus fork with mudguard
Stock headset with a cane creek upper cap
Thanks for existing, chinertown, it was very helpful to read these threads in gaining any confidence in ordering one of these frames.
#10
29er / TanTan FM199-B-SL
January 06, 2019, 09:31:15 PM
Went ahead and ordered this frame to build with parts from a Kinesis Maxlight X which arrived bent from the UK and then my shifters took out the top tube in a crash. Having a history of bent frames carbon seems like a sure way to avoid that happening again.
Hopefully mounting 180 post mount brake on a flat mount frame is simple.
Using a Token BB92 w/ ceramic bearings. I'll update when I get the frame.
https://www.amazon.com/Token-Threaded-Press-Bracket-Shimano-Ceramic/dp/B0090G6G0I/ref=sr_1_4?ie=UTF8&qid=1546763888&sr=8-4&keywords=token+bb92+ceramic
https://www.aliexpress.com/item/2019-carbon-Mountain-Bicycle-Frame-29er-Boost-29er-plus-frame-with-BB92-with-29er-2-35/32919519287.html?spm=2114.search0104.3.1.f30e1888RXX7v7&ws_ab_test=searchweb0_0,searchweb201602_2_10065_10068_204_10130_5727215_318_10547_10546_10059_10884_10548_5727315_10545_10887_10696_100031_10084_10083_10103_10618_452_10307_532,searchweb201603_2,ppcSwitch_0&algo_expid=c01a5905-a708-412c-b883-6c897368cbb1-0&algo_pvid=c01a5905-a708-412c-b883-6c897368cbb1&transAbTest=ae803_4&priceBeautifyAB=0
Hopefully mounting 180 post mount brake on a flat mount frame is simple.
Using a Token BB92 w/ ceramic bearings. I'll update when I get the frame.
https://www.amazon.com/Token-Threaded-Press-Bracket-Shimano-Ceramic/dp/B0090G6G0I/ref=sr_1_4?ie=UTF8&qid=1546763888&sr=8-4&keywords=token+bb92+ceramic
https://www.aliexpress.com/item/2019-carbon-Mountain-Bicycle-Frame-29er-Boost-29er-plus-frame-with-BB92-with-29er-2-35/32919519287.html?spm=2114.search0104.3.1.f30e1888RXX7v7&ws_ab_test=searchweb0_0,searchweb201602_2_10065_10068_204_10130_5727215_318_10547_10546_10059_10884_10548_5727315_10545_10887_10696_100031_10084_10083_10103_10618_452_10307_532,searchweb201603_2,ppcSwitch_0&algo_expid=c01a5905-a708-412c-b883-6c897368cbb1-0&algo_pvid=c01a5905-a708-412c-b883-6c897368cbb1&transAbTest=ae803_4&priceBeautifyAB=0
#11
29er / Re: FM 289 from Hong Fu with boost
September 05, 2018, 12:40:33 AM
Numberzero, thank you that looks like a nice frame, however 445mm chainstays are long. Seat tube is slack. Good TT length though. Compare that with the specs of the frame I just mentioned with 425mm chainstay, 74 deg ST.. If it were 27.2 it would be perfect.
#12
29er / Re: FM 289 from Hong Fu with boost
September 05, 2018, 12:37:00 AM
Check out the geometry of the new FM199
69.5 degree HTA, 425mm chainstays.
https://www.aliexpress.com/item/2019-carbon-Mountain-Bicycle-Frame-29er-Boost-with-BB92-with-29er-2-35-tire-fm199-Frame/32907997171.html?ws_ab_test=searchweb0_0,searchweb201602_4_10065_10068_10130_10547_10546_10059_10548_10545_10696_100031_10084_10083_10103_451_452_10618_10307,searchweb201603_55,ppcSwitch_5&algo_expid=de33e44b-9ecb-4554-98a4-d8f75927f861-44&algo_pvid=de33e44b-9ecb-4554-98a4-d8f75927f861&transAbTest=ae803_1&priceBeautifyAB=0
https://tantansports.en.alibaba.com/product/60793716308-803082304/2019_carbon_Mountain_Bicycle_Frame_29er_Boost_with_BB92_with_29er_2_35_tire_FM199_frame.html
There's this bizarre one also, same company SERAPH, super slack seat tube 70.5 degrees, 68.5 HTA: https://www.aliexpress.com/item/2018-new-27-5er-BOOST-MTB-frame-EPS-whole-shaped-technology-Chinese-bike-frame-hard-tail/32873013891.html?gps-id=pcDetailBottomMoreThisSeller&scm=1007.13339.99734.0&scm_id=1007.13339.99734.0&scm-url=1007.13339.99734.0&pvid=97a7bb7e-8277-4c9b-a96c-856aa22c7041
Much better geometry than FM199-B listed here:
http://www.hongfu-bikes.com/html_Products/Mountain_Frame/29ER_Mountain_Frame/2016/1113/2017%20New%20Full%20carbon%2029ER%20MTB%20Frame%20HF-FM.html
Haven't seen anyone post about this yet. But what is the seat tube size?
69.5 degree HTA, 425mm chainstays.
https://www.aliexpress.com/item/2019-carbon-Mountain-Bicycle-Frame-29er-Boost-with-BB92-with-29er-2-35-tire-fm199-Frame/32907997171.html?ws_ab_test=searchweb0_0,searchweb201602_4_10065_10068_10130_10547_10546_10059_10548_10545_10696_100031_10084_10083_10103_451_452_10618_10307,searchweb201603_55,ppcSwitch_5&algo_expid=de33e44b-9ecb-4554-98a4-d8f75927f861-44&algo_pvid=de33e44b-9ecb-4554-98a4-d8f75927f861&transAbTest=ae803_1&priceBeautifyAB=0
https://tantansports.en.alibaba.com/product/60793716308-803082304/2019_carbon_Mountain_Bicycle_Frame_29er_Boost_with_BB92_with_29er_2_35_tire_FM199_frame.html
There's this bizarre one also, same company SERAPH, super slack seat tube 70.5 degrees, 68.5 HTA: https://www.aliexpress.com/item/2018-new-27-5er-BOOST-MTB-frame-EPS-whole-shaped-technology-Chinese-bike-frame-hard-tail/32873013891.html?gps-id=pcDetailBottomMoreThisSeller&scm=1007.13339.99734.0&scm_id=1007.13339.99734.0&scm-url=1007.13339.99734.0&pvid=97a7bb7e-8277-4c9b-a96c-856aa22c7041
Much better geometry than FM199-B listed here:
http://www.hongfu-bikes.com/html_Products/Mountain_Frame/29ER_Mountain_Frame/2016/1113/2017%20New%20Full%20carbon%2029ER%20MTB%20Frame%20HF-FM.html
Haven't seen anyone post about this yet. But what is the seat tube size?
#13
29er / Re: FM 289 from Hong Fu with boost
September 03, 2018, 05:54:39 PM
Hello,
Have been seeking an alternative to a 2018 Santa Cruz Highball CC Frame.
Well, I found this 289 listed on aliexpress just now. 71.5 degree HTA for the 19" version - WTH are they thinking?
https://www.aliexpress.com/store/product/29ER-BOOST-Carbon-Frame-Carbon-MTB-Frame-Mountain-Bike-148-12mm-T800-UAM-Official-Store-FM289/2993019_32904433624.html
By that measure, the FM-199B / Pro-Mance M9009-B give a 71 degree HTA with a slightly shorter a-c
https://www.aliexpress.com/item/Full-Carbon-Fiber-MTB-Frame-29er-Bicycle-Frame-FM199-B-BOOST-UD-Matte-BB92-148-12MM/32822540260.html
I was all set to wait for the FM289, but nothing makes sense anymore. I also want BSA BB, and 27.2 Seatpost. I may pay an extra $1300 to escape this madness.
Have been seeking an alternative to a 2018 Santa Cruz Highball CC Frame.
Well, I found this 289 listed on aliexpress just now. 71.5 degree HTA for the 19" version - WTH are they thinking?
https://www.aliexpress.com/store/product/29ER-BOOST-Carbon-Frame-Carbon-MTB-Frame-Mountain-Bike-148-12mm-T800-UAM-Official-Store-FM289/2993019_32904433624.html
By that measure, the FM-199B / Pro-Mance M9009-B give a 71 degree HTA with a slightly shorter a-c
https://www.aliexpress.com/item/Full-Carbon-Fiber-MTB-Frame-29er-Bicycle-Frame-FM199-B-BOOST-UD-Matte-BB92-148-12MM/32822540260.html
I was all set to wait for the FM289, but nothing makes sense anymore. I also want BSA BB, and 27.2 Seatpost. I may pay an extra $1300 to escape this madness.
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