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Messages - Sakizashi

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1
It looks like you can finally buy the new FSA SMR II stem. It is a -10, but if you run it for internal routing, there is quite a bit of drop at the bar clamp because of the design.  I suspect this stem will result in a position lower than the -17 degree option from SQ lab.

Unfortunately, stems aren't dimensioned to reflect eventual bar height as stack clamping height and drop at the bar clamp can be hard to find. I expect to pick one of these up in the next few weeks, as soon as I can get one from a source other than BikeInn in the 130mm length.

It's a decent price and available in the 120mm size here: https://www.gambacicli.com/en/fsa-ns-smr-ii-10-road-stem.html

The Specialized Sworks Tarmac -12 stem is lighter, and I can confirm that at the 130mm length, the bar position is equal, height wise, to a 130mm -17 Kalloy Uno.

2
Road Bike Frames, Wheels & Components / Re: Speeder Cycling SC-R55D
« on: November 25, 2024, 05:09:25 PM »
Got my frame size 51

Took about a month for it to be shipped and 20 days for shipping, eu tax prepaid

On first look everything seems good, mounts are faced, no rough bearing seats, bb is faced and inside seems smooth
Only the headtube to downtube juction has something yellow? on the inside of the frame not sure what that is, everything else is smooth.

Wow, that does look good, and given the rep Speeder has built, mainly from their forks, it sure looks like it holds up. Honestly, the exterior also looks really clean too. Really curious to hear how cleanly it builds up.

3
Yeah getting something non chinese QC'd and supported for electronics is probably the most reliable long term, but the price and huge user base of the magene is super attractive for a first time power meter user.

@Sakizashi thats a killer deal! thanks for sharing. Although maybe you can help me with this... I'm mechanically inclined but when it comes to bikes I've been having to do a ton of research regarding what fits what, what components can work together etc, as there seems to be a vast difference of standards between brands lol.
So correct me if Im wrong.
I have a shimano 105 r7100 52/36 crankset being shipped to my house currently that I got from aliex for $120. (which is why I was looking at left sided shimano crank arms originally) To use the rotor brand, Id need to get a 30mm t47 bb for my frame instead of the t47 24mm that I currently had ordered with it? + a different spider to support the shimano gears I already have? Or just go full rotor gears as well? The only reason I was wanting to keep shimano gears was simply because I ordered an 8100 series cassette/chain for hyperglide+ ability (not sure if its worth the extra or not but figured I'd try it) and wasn't sure If a different crankset would affect that, but as far as I can tell HG+ is only at the rear.

I would confirm this with Rotor, but I believe you would need a 30mm T47 BB, and Rotor chainrings. The chain and cassette you ordered will work fine. I would also get a spacer kit with 0.5 and 1mm spacers.

4
Right now, i would probably get a rotor in power as their axle-based PM crank is currently 267USD for black friday: https://rotorbike.com/rotor-inpower-dm-road-gloss.html

5
If ENVE recommends 27c tyre as best aero optimized for 25iw, then for sure you can run 30c on 26iw... That's my logic anyways.

ENVE has a specific list of tires tested to work specifically with their rims. There is no generalizable design principle here that can be applied to other wheels as the problem lies with the tire geometry, rim geometry, and the tire-rim interface

There are two sets of somewhat conflicting general recommendations. There are the ETRTO-based charts from the tire makers earlier in the thread, but also their general recommendation that there be a minimum of 5mm between the marked tire width and the rim's inner width. Many brands, including ENVE, Zipp, and Hunt, do not like either recommendation. Ultimately, those in favor (Continental, Mavic, etc.) won out, and the UCI adopted the 5mm recommendation as a rule. This forced teams like UAE to use the 30mm GP5000 S TR and move away from the 28mm TT TR tire.

This became an issue because of a bunch of high-profile tire blowoffs, largely on Zipp wheels, that resulted in injury to pro riders. However, there are also a lot of anecdotal blowoffs of other brands as well that you can find by searching other forums.

At the least, I would follow the 5mm rule on this one and run 32mm tires, as the consequences of a blowoff are the same as rolling a tubular tire off the wheel--if it's on the front, you will likely crash. I plan to follow both the tire maker charts and the 5mm rule, as I like not crashing.

6
That's really debatable, unless it's really apples to apples. If you compare 2 OEMs shipping to the same place at the same time making the same thing, then yes, you'd expect prices to be similar. But if you're comparing the cost structure of a western brand, inventory, VAT, distributors, marketing, and so on, then you can't say that a 4k frame is automatically better than a 500 frame.
In fact, a factory that makes the actual factor frames probably charges factor less than 500$ for each frame.
So, it really depends on where your money is going / which layers of fat it's padding.

I've heard estimates that the raw material for a top-end frame is $300-$400 alone. Rob Gitelis from Factor gave an interview earlier this year where he pegged the price of raw materials at $365. Once you include the stuff done at the factory including labor, engineering and testing to ensure the bike is safe to ride, and the mold costs + production issues/scrap rates, I believe that the prices that brands like Quick, Elilee, and Seka are asking for aren't that crazy for their top end bikes (i.e., there is no way their factory cost is ~$500 for their top models)--with Quick maybe even being a pretty good deal even if they aero they do is more marketing than development when compared to a company like Specialized.

That also makes me appreciate the efforts that ICAN, Speeder, and others are making to sell us frames and forks at the price point they do, even if they would be second or third-tier for brands like Specialized regarding raw material inputs.

Rims seem to be similar, with a steep markup for t1100 or t1000 lightweight models, but whole wheels also need to account for the cost of hubs and spokes, which vary quite a bit. Again, you also pay a premium for Chinese brands even if you can find similar rim molds, often due to higher-end hub designs that use more expensive bearings and metal inputs (e.g., Farsports vs. Wheelsfar). Similar to my comment on frames, I really appreciate the efforts to sell directly by Peter and others because what they are offering for the cost...while not for me right now is a remarkable deal. They have put together what seems to be a great combination of rims, H-Works hubs and carbon spokes.

7
Metal Frames / Re: Titanium Tandem - Advice
« on: November 19, 2024, 08:07:34 PM »
I don't know that much about tandem design, but this builder does Z-style couplers, which might be a nice upgrade vs. S&S.

8
Component Deals & Selection / Re: Quickpro AR:one
« on: November 19, 2024, 12:49:12 PM »
Plenty of fast bikes weren't actually developed in the wind tunnel. Most times the wind tunnel is just used to verify or create data for marketing after the bike has already been finalised.

I feel like this statement lacks context. Most WT-level race bikes have prototypes or scaled models that are put into low-speed wind tunnels in multiple rounds as part of the development phase to verify the design after using CFD as the primary tool. Still, these bikes are also a tiny percentage sold, even by high-end brands. It is worth noting that higher-end wheels are developed this way, too, often using 3d printed mockups for round one post-CFD, and then going back in with the final design. Hunt is very transparent about how they do this in their whitepapers, so you can get a feel for what that process looks and feels like.

The other thing is that CFD can get complicated so not all CFD is equal. Many engineers who took the 400-level undergrad courses in fluids could do some basic stuff, but effective analysis to squeeze out gains does require someone with specialist skills. I suspect AI tools are changing this pretty rapidly, but as far as I know, we aren't there yet. The counter to this is that it doesn't make a difference on a road bike to most of us; frames, in general, are pretty darn marginal.

9
That's awesome! Well done! How do you find your clients / market to your clients?

I do place some ads. I've worked with a few smaller teams and sold stuff to mechanics associated with some larger ones. Sometimes when verifying addresses, I get some interesting additional details. The one thing that confounds me is how many pro athletes, cycling-related and otherwise, have bought dynaplug holders. I have no idea how these people found me, but I won't complain.

Doh! I just realized you and I have already spoken on Instagram in the past. You offer up great products my friend! May need you to design a lower stack FSA no69 headset cover  8)

Yeah, I've sort of accidentally stepped into a gap for people who are willing to give up compatibility with cables for lower stack or better aesthetics. I am sure I can do something that looks better than what FSA came up with. I have been getting TPU inserts printed too so that hole isn't massive.

We can talk at at length about internal cable routing systems and their design, but specific to buying a frame direct from a factory, I would make sure to buy one that takes a 1.5" upper and lower bearing. Putting in a decent-quality headset is an excellent thing to do when building up a bike, but also, these systems require pretty high preloads, and some of the cheaper stuff doesn't seem to handle it well.

10
If it's not a secret, may I know what kind of accessories you print? Or direct me to your website/product page?

~50% headset covers to convert to different internal cable routing systems, 50% mounts for dynaplug tools. I done / do some custom stuff too. It's a cool little business. https://aprotobike.com/

I generally prefer to be just a person on forums like these and on Weightweenies rather than push products. After all, I am here to learn what I can about what other people are thinking. In my opinion, there is greater variation here than there is in the mainstream Western forums. Some of it is a different product development approach, for sure.

I ride quite a bit too, so between regular wear and tear and using the bikes to test different mounts headset adapters, etc., being able to swap parts and build / rebuild the bikes makes me have a bit of a different perspective than most.

11
I am sort of the opposite of @patliean1 in the sense that I have zero inclination to be an influencer and will probably never make a YouTube video about bikes. However, I do sustain my bike hobby through a bike accessory business which is largely done via 3d prints. It has also allowed me to afford a few adjacent projects/prototypes, including (e.g., a Ti frame, modified track bars for road, and picking parts for a new wheelset to test some thoughts around the Conti 111 tire).

The 1st was a bad business idea, the 2nd was a missed opportunity, and the 3rd I expected the tariff situation to kill, but it's led me to a more long-term purchase mentality for frames. In that vein, three frames are interesting choices, IMO for going the low-cost China route.

  • Speeder SC-R55D: I have never bought a frame from them, but I do have experience with their forks and bars / stem combos, and I believe in their quality. The use of UDH is a plus for future compatibility, but also because bent hangers are the thing that i hated most about my open mold frames and why all my bikes currently run the same hanger (the syntace x12)
  • Bigrock Sohtea Team (or regular): I think with the Panda Podium sale, this fits in your budget, and with some good FB marketplace / eBay skills, you might be able to also work in a wheel upgrade. The thing I like about this frame is that it uses a round seatpost with an external seat clamp, so getting your position dialed will be easier/cheaper, and this, more than anything else aero will make you fast vs. slow. Also worth noting that slipping or stuck seat posts are a common frustration with cheap frames, so this one avoids that trap too.
  • Ican FL1: if you are OK with a little more weight but don't want that horrible brand name, this is an alternative to the Bigrock. I

I haven't ridden any of these bikes, so I defer to others for their expertise, but I would consider these 3 bikes in your price range for those two reasons.

12
Are you not susposed to run a 28c tire on 24 internal rims?

ETRTO guidance and UCI rules would say no—so as of mid last season this would be an illegal combination for racing on the basis of safety. While blowoffs are the catastrophic failure, the more common issue of too wide of a rim is riding on the sidewall and getting more punctures.

The C on tire sizes has nothing to do with width—it’s the designation for the bead seat diameter (BSD) of the rim (622mm). The format you all are seeing are looking at is referring to the different dimensions of the rim. 700 is a size designation that is supposed to the OD of the system at some arbitrary tire size that was historically used. The only place where this is still relevant is for 650b vs. 650c. Tires are specified in the format of [size designation]x[width][BSD].

Actual tire width for road tires is specified on a different rim width thats sort of standard and sort of manufacturer dependent. Most 28s are specified for a 19mm or 21mm IW rim for example and most 32s are to a 23mm or 24mm IW rim. 34+ is usually true to size on a 25mm IW rim.

To make matters worse there are two different ISO standards for tire clearance to the frame. 6mm is the off-road standard that gets used on a lot of allroad and gravel bikes. Some manufacturers (e.g., Trek) use 6mm on their road bikes too. 4mm is the road standard that also sometimes gets used for allroad and gravel bikes.

If you want to make sure a tire / rim fits your bike the best thing to do is measure or get a dimensioned drawing of your bike frame to compare. Most fork and frame manufacturers can provide this if its not in the listing.

TLDR: for road widths 23mm IW width rims give you the most options. 24mm-25mm is good too as it allows you to fit 30s. Measure your bike and the tires. You probably want 4mm of clearance on all sides of the tire and similar to the rims.

13
@toxin Peter showed me a picture of the 20h hub. It's 294g/set and slotted straight pull, not side entry.

The updated wheels will be nice when they are released. The only drawback I see is that, according to many manufacturers' charts, 26mm internal width needs a wider road tire than most people would want to run. I think I would feel comfortable with 32mm on those wheels, following the rough ETRTO guidance, but that's at odds with the charts from Conti and Schwalbe.

14
I placed the order last night for a set of wheels. It was a tough decision because we are seeing really light T1000 and T1100 layups, but many of the suppliers are releasing them only for narrower models—like those in the 28mm EW range. In other cases, they just don't want to sell them outside of Asia due to a high potential for returns. My 0011 rep sort of left me a lurch, too, so the business went to a very patient and responsive rep from a different company.

The build should come out under 1300g and I am very curious to see how they perform. Here are the specs:
  • Front rim: 50mm deep,  31mm EW (hooks), 24mm IW: ~400g
  • Rear Rim: 60mm deep, 30mm EW (hooks), 23mm IW: ~465g
  • Hubs: THR Industries R3
  • Spokes: Sapim CxRay Super with internal nipples

These are not cheap wheels at around $1150 (shipped), and I know I left 30g-40g on the table by not waiting for a lighter wheel layup that may be coming, but these are narrow enough IW for me to run GP5000 TT TR tires and wide enough that I think they should work pretty well aero-wise with those tires. Those tires, along with 6-bolt Galfer rotors, should make for a pretty light setup, while the internal nipples should help a bit to narrow the aero gap with my current setup.

The 28mm wide (hooks) and 21mm IW options were too narrow for my preference, and without a way to validate this would lead to an aero loss, I figured it would drive me to purchase another set sooner than having these built with the rim dimensions I wanted, even if they were heavier.

I will A/B test these wheels on a flat loop vs. my current wheels (Ascent Polaris 69mm) and see how they fare.

15
I am planning to accelerate some planned purchases this week or next. I am not going to stock up on consumables though, as the tech is evolving fast enough that it doesn't matter for most items vs. their lifetime that it doesn't make sense to buy those and stash them for a year or more. (i.e., sitting on a stash of tires and chains beyond having spares on hand isn't worth it).

I don't think we will see immediate action on the blanket tariff front. HTS codes are pretty complicated, and I expect to see a lot of lobbying for special treatment. Tariffs broadly applied will be like a sales tax, i think a very aggressive selective tariff regime designed to favor specific US industries is more likely as they can also be designed to limit the impact to things that effect the perceived cost of living (e.g., food). I also think a blanket tariff on all imported goods, while legally possible via executive order, would likely go to the courts because the courts made up the "major questions doctrine" to kill Biden's student loan forgiveness, and they can expect lawsuits using that same doctrine for any blanket policy unless its a law passed by congress.

If it ends up being more of a piecemeal implementation of tariffs and they do it by codes, I am hoping that it takes a while to get around to bike parts. However, an executive order to close the de minimus limit of $800 / day for imports to be tax-free is likely to happen sooner rather than later. It's already been drafted and considered by the Biden administration. This will affect many of us who buy from places like Aliexpress or sellers shipping from direct China, as we won't find our goods coming through tariff-free. We will find that we will be paying the 25% already imposed on bike part imports—which we are already paying on most parts imported to the US from China for resale at retail. Because this does not require congress to do anything, this is possible as a day 1 type action.


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