LTwoo rim brake / mechanical 2024 refresh

[Alex Jones]

@AlexJones

Where did you order your groupsets from? I'd like to get my hands on some too.

"LTWOO Official Store" on AliExpress.

[raisinberry777]

For a laugh and to use up some spare parts I've ordered the R7 10-speed rim brake, mechanical groupset in the 2024 version.

Having used a variety of Campag groupsets in the past it will be interesting to see how this feels in comparison.

65 USD on AliExpress for shifters, FD and RD - certainly pretty cheap. Shame that the newer FD (with the tension adjusting screw) and RD (shadow style) don't seem to be available on AliExpress yet but maybe that's a later upgrade.

[raisinberry777]

Video (not mine) of the new RX mechanical rear derailleur. Looks nice.

[raisinberry777]

R7 parts arrived yesterday.

Real weights:
Shifters (with inner cable) - 521g
FD (braze-on): 101g
RD: 269g

Other parts I'm using - probably useful for those trying to do a similar budget build:
Riro Racer R9 crankset (50/34, 170mm, with preload cap) - 821g
ZRace R700 brakes - 379g

First impressions of the shifters are very good. The hood rubber has a lovely texture, is just the right softness. The matte finish looks nice (given the price), clicks feel well-defined - I'm seriously impressed at $65 USD for the shifters/FD/RD. The FD and RD are a little more basic (but at about the level I'd expect for the price) - hopefully in the future the package is available with the new FD and RD. RD is a typical mid-cage size of 70mm bolt-to-bolt, same as the mid-cage options for Tiagra 4700 / 105 5800 / Ultegra 6800, so will work fine with at least an 11-32 cassette.

Operation is basically identical to the 2015-current Campagnolo Powershift levers. Single shift down, multiple shifts up. Left shifter operates similarly to Powershift too. 4 positions, one sweep of the shifter will get you all the way up, a light press of the shifter gets you back to position three, and a full press gets you back down to position one. The gradual release minimises chain drops - basically what happens is (starting from position four), pressing down on the lever takes it back to position two, then the release takes it back to position one. This means that the FD doesn't go through its whole travel in one click. Of course, there's absolutely no instructions (and none on their website) so I'll set it up the same way as a Powershift lever and see how we go.

The ergonomics of the left shifter alone make this a much better buy than Sensah, IMO. I would only consider Sensah for a 1x build - my experience with the front shifting on Sensah Phi was pretty terrible. I do wonder what's in Sensah's future as we haven't seen any changes for a while.

Interestingly total price for the 8 main groupset pieces (L/R shifters, FD, RD, crank, brakes, chain, cassette) has come out to about $140 USD - this makes for some really interesting opportunities to refresh old bikes with modern ergonomics and gear range on a budget.

EDIT: And now somehow in playing around with it the indexing mechanism in the right hand lever has broken. Sigh. Good start, L-TWOO....

[Serge_K]

EDIT: And now somehow in playing around with it the indexing mechanism in the right hand lever has broken. Sigh. Good start, L-TWOO....

LOL.
fwiw, a friend broke his er9 shifter paddle by falling in slow motion. First ride of the season, he's like 55yo, he was chatting with a friend, i think he forgot to unclip or something, fell in slow motion like we've all done at some point, but he was unlucky and that was enough to break the paddle. Now he's pissed off because he's convinced his ultegra paddle wouldnt have broken in the same conditions. He's saying he thinks whatever plastic polymer LTWOO uses, is shit.

He may have a point then
Saving 5 cents on every plastic paddle by using a shitty grade of plastic would be such a chinese thing to do, they'd likely consider it to be smart, culturally (as per Poorly made in China book i read, full of interesting anecdotes).

[raisinberry777]

LOL.
fwiw, a friend broke his er9 shifter paddle by falling in slow motion. First ride of the season, he's like 55yo, he was chatting with a friend, i think he forgot to unclip or something, fell in slow motion like we've all done at some point, but he was unlucky and that was enough to break the paddle. Now he's pissed off because he's convinced his ultegra paddle wouldnt have broken in the same conditions. He's saying he thinks whatever plastic polymer LTWOO uses, is shit.

He may have a point then
Saving 5 cents on every plastic paddle by using a shitty grade of plastic would be such a chinese thing to do, they'd likely consider it to be smart, culturally (as per Poorly made in China book i read, full of interesting anecdotes).

Well, it wasn't immediately obvious as to what had broken, the shift was for some reason feeling a little hard, then a snap, then nothing. There's no obvious external damage, but it's something in the indexing mechanism that's perhaps broken off. I'm no expert in these things, and in our wasteful modern times, because it's a Choice purchase I've just sent it back and there's another one coming (I'm a sucker for punishment).

It's a shame because, in every other respect, it's a seemingly very nice shifter. The ergonomics are very similar to the 2009-onwards Campag levers (which are probably my favourite mechanical levers - though the current Shimano rim brake stuff seems very close).  If it fails again second time around, I'll cut my losses and try something else - at the end of the day it's just an experiment in how cheaply I can refresh an old bike as a winter/spare bike, with my beloved Campag ergonomics but the convenience of Shimano compatible spares. Perhaps by the end of next week we shall see, if the gods of shipping are in my favour.

[raisinberry777]

Anyway, one week later + a bike I found cheaply on FB Marketplace and an experiment began - is L-Twoo R7 a good option to do a refresh of an old bike on the cheap?

Found this beautiful little 2008 Giant OCR 2W - it had been converted to a flat bar but after running the numbers, I suspected that with a reasonably aggressive fit I should be able to make the geometry work. What made this frame a particularly interesting option is the tyre clearance, it's designed around mid-drop brakes but I suspected as rim brakes started to be designed for larger tyres that short-reach brakes might work after all (and they did). Currently running a 30mm tyre and there's room for a bit more (about 32mm measured width is probably a sensible limit - but great for a rim-brake bike).

The drivetrain is full AliExpress, being (prices in USD:
L-Twoo R7 10 speed shifters/derailleurs - $65
Riro Racer R9 crankset - $39
ZRace R700 brakes - $18
YBN 10s chain - $11
Sensah 10s 11-32 cassette - $10

That's $143 for a 10 speed drivetrain, before any coupons/cashback. I reused the Shimano bottom bracket, but that would only be another $10. I also added an Elita One seatpost ($15) and Kocevlo bars ($27), and the saddle, stem and tyres were spares I had lying around.

After last week's debacle (see above) I decided not to play with the shifters until it was fully cabled up - however first impressions are great. Lever ergonomics are good, for those who have ever used a Campy Powershift lever it will immediately feel familiar. Shifts feel nice from the tops and drops. Shifts don't feel as nice as R7000, but they're crisp, nicely defined and the ergonomics are a winner.