Let's open with the conclusion: don't buy fakes.
And let's acknowledge that i don't endorse buying fakes, mostly because it's illegal in the jurisdictions i live in, and i think it borderlines on cringe.
On the back of the Ostro fake thread (Replica Factor Ostro VAM) and the white Factor that looked pristine on the inside, i did a bit of Aliexpress homework.
- Speaking with the seller (First-Class Carbon Fiber Store) that made that white frame raised red flags. His arguments were empty, baseless statements and promises. Basically saying that he's wonderful, but won't prove it, and everybody else is shit. Rule #1 of the internet: dont trust strangers on the internet. Black list for me.
- From the pictures posted by Estingo, his frame is using bladders, and the inside looks pretty awful. Store: Taiwan factory bike parts Store. I didn't engage with that shop. Black list for me.
- I came across the shop called Tourus inflatable paddle board store, claiming to have stock of fake SL8 in France. I chatted the seller, who said the stock was in germany. 2 days later, the shop disappeared, he said it's because someone flagged IP infringement: he was using pictures of SL8 frames with the sworks logo on them. He pointed me to another store of his, "shop1102901440 store", claiming to have stock in Spain, but he says it's the same German stock (this tells me sellers can re-spawn to infinity on AliX in a matter of clicks). The reviews look fraudulent, in the sense that every single review looks perfect. Everybody posted at least 1 picture, and everybody saying the stuff is amazing. The 1st shop reappeared later after he'd removed the logos from the frames (exact same photos, just without logos, everything else is 100% the same, implying an explicit & direct complicity of Aliexpress themselves. All the reviews clearly show frames with Sworks logos, so AliX is really insulting the spirit of the law here). Nobody posted pictures from the inside of the frame: after asking multiple times for such photos, it's clear the frame is bladder compressed, and poorly (major resin pooling residues). He is adamant that it is EPS moulded. I then asked if he's a factory or a broker. he said factory (common lie). I asked a photo of the foam they use in the frame, he said it's rude to ask, at which point he told me to eat a dick, metaphorically. He also refused multiple times to send a picture of a frame on a scale, and refused to give the weight of a frame standalone (only quoting a frameset weight). He claims it's 100% T1000, and the prices are about 1k eur.
So, 1. lots of lies 2. old method, and there's no way sworks SL8 frames are bladder moulded which tells me the advertised weights are also fake 3. fraudulent as hell (the reviews). I have been paid before by chinese amazon sellers to lie about a product to give 5 star reviews. They have a streamlined process it's pretty amazing. i notified amazon, they deleted my review and refused any accountability, the seller continues his scam to this day on Amazon, something that's been documented a lot already in various outlets. There's literally an industry of fake reviews, i suspect it's reached aliexpress, given the amounts involved, it makes sense. The seller refused to give info about the factory because he said he'd be sent to prison (his words) if he is found, so he knows full well what he's doing. Black list for me.
So, it's been discussed here before that one shouldn't give their money to a seller that's selling fakes, because it's based on deceit, lies, fraud, and beyond the legality, why would you trust your life on a frame rather literally made of lies.
So, even on the high end side of fakes, it's more of the same shit: don't buy fakes.
Edit Sep 27 2024.
- taiwan eisen bike store - black list (don't use EPS and compression so bad it leaves shards of carbon in the BB area (see factor thread, oralmaster post (...))
- Adding "nicole bicycle store" to the black list. It's selling SL8, S5 fakes, among others. I asked about the SL8, but also any frame that takes 32C. The response: none of their frames take 32C. Yet they market a 2024 SL8, an S5, frames that 100% take 32C. Begging the question: wtf? That one is full on worrying, i dont have an explanation, other than maybe they just ship random frames that dont even look like what you thought you ordered? I'm not going to find out.
Edit Oct 7 2024.
As per Avalius on the forum, Yohobike is added to the blacklist. Frame self destructed as BB area cracked when sprinting out of a corner (1st time i hear of spontaneous self destruction of a carbon frame in a VERY LONG time). And Yoho is ghosting him to avoid dealing with warranty.
Edit 08 Oct 24.
Black list again: allstarobm website / OEM Taiwan Store on aliexpress (same people). Final nail in the coffin for me "i dont have time to take photos for you right now... You can purchase from other places". This is after me insisting, after i got the usual "we will give you the perfect frame".
Shady AF. it started well then it went downhill fast. they have canned answers for the most basic questions, then the moment you go off script, they shut down like a clam when they realize they can't fool you. In a way it's not too dissimilar to any other scammer.
I'm done with this exercise. I really gave it a shot, but all these people are clowns, basically. Now if you want to risk your life on a clown bike, go ahead. Might be fine, but also, might not. I've dealt with bike related chinese suppliers for close to 10 years now, and honest counterparts i work with never, ever react like that.
Sad.
Edit 09 Oct 24. Good candidates for light frames:
https://www.icanbikes.com/Products-list/t1000-carbon-road-disc-brake-frame-fl1-795g/#Ican, 800g in size 54.
https://www.flybike-asia.com/product/139.htmlFly bike (mothership behind carbonda, and OEMs for a lot of brands, ICAN included, de rosa...). They dont advertise weights here but i suspect the specs to be similar to the ican one.
And if you buy these, you get something that's 1. not illegal and 2. will not break from under you in a sprint.
this isn't meant to be an exhaustive list, but rather i just came across these so posting here for reference.
Edit 14 Oct 24.
Another good candidate for light frame: Speeder SC-R55D - 51cm Weight: 780g (frame) + 77g (Aluminum Parts) + 50g (Painting). As per their website. They used to offer different layups, now they only offer this light layup version. Great reputation as an OEM. It looks like a Rose Xlite, which i think looks amazing. I like that look better than the SL8, so my interest in fakes is officially over. if i were to pull the trigger on a frame today, i think i'd buy that 55D.
