Considering Winspace SLC3, any thoughts?

[Takiyaki]

Also Joe from China Cycling/Panda Podium has left the building, so marketing wise they are not up there anymore...

What do you mean?

[patliean1]

What do you mean?

Joe was Winspace's primary marketing force during the pandemic. Basically the face of Winspace when he worked there.

[Dareios]

I have about 4k km on mine and it is an all round great bike. I don't know what I would want more out of a roadbike.
I did the built myself and let me tell you, the build quality is top notch, nothing to complain about. E.g.cable routing through the fork was a breeze and the BB shell I right on the money. I did not want to faff around with shitty tolerances, so the slightly higher price did not bother me at all, mind you, I got it on the black friday deal.

Looks good, what size do you ride?

[KaiDeus]

Looks good, what size do you ride?

I ride a size medium (500), 105mm stem, 380mm bars. The frame geo fits me very well, but I also had a bike fit prior to purchase to get everything dialed. 174cm, 82cm inseam.

[Dareios]

I ride a size medium (500), 105mm stem, 380mm bars. The frame geo fits me very well, but I also had a bike fit prior to purchase to get everything dialed. 174cm, 82cm inseam.

Nice. I'm 183cm tall with an 88cm inseam, so i fear that size L might be a bit too low/too much of a seatpost to handlebar drop for me.

[Rone69]

For some time now, I've been gathering information from owners of the SLC3.
More or less all of them agree that it is a good granfondo frame with a predilection for climbing and race geometry.
Most of them also feel that comparing it with the SL8 or other similar frames is rather risky.
It is worrying that some well-known YouTubers have received defective forks and that the after-sales service is not the best.

[jrasero]

I got my SLC3 during the Christmas sale last year for $1475 with bars shipped.  Weighs 16lbs with pedals, cages, mounts, and sensors.
Winspace SLC3 Superlight Black Small 48cm
Winspace Zero SL Bars 85 x 380
EXS Airtape 30g
K-EDGE Pro Chain Catcher
SRAM AXS Red E1 Shifters w/ Force D2 Calipers
Galfer Wave CL 160mm Rotors
GP5000 S TR 28mm Setup Tubeless
Elite Wheel Drive D50 Wheels 1300g
SRAM AXS Force D1 48/35t Chainring w/ Red E1 160mm Cranks and Power Meter
BBInfinite BB86 DUB Ceramic One-Piece Bottom Bracket
SRAM AXS Force D2 Front Derailleur
SRAM AXS Force D2 Rear Derailleur w/ BBInfinite Oversized Ceramic Jockey Wheels
Red E1 Chain (Waxed)
Red E1 10-33t Cassette
Roval Alpinist 300mm Seatpost, will supply stock post as well
Specialized SWORKS Power Mirror Saddle 143mm w/ Garmin Varia Mount
Winspace Carbon Computer Mount
Wolf Tooth Seat Collar

A lot of the parts I already had, so the total build was $2300.  In hindsight while I really love this bike, but there is this Tarmac SL 8 envy I constantly get.  For $1500-$2000+ more I could have built a similar Tarmac SL 8 Pro but probably with the regular two piece stem and aero bars.  I can say from riding a friends SL 8, the SLC3 is not a SL 8 in a do it all aero bike, but is more akin to a Canyon Ultimate or Giant TCR in a more lightweight race bike.  It's snappy, quick, stiff enough to be responsive but not stiff enough to be detrimental to compliance.  It climbs well and descends well, but it's not an Aethos in terms of weight and definitely not in terms of compliance since that bike's rear is like a noodle, but it also doesn't give you that surging aero feel due to the lack of aero profiles and weight, but that is to be expected.  Maybe Patrick Lino can comment since he has both the Tarmac SL 8 Pro and the SLC3, but there are some days I am riding and I think, wow the SLC3 is everything I need, and there are other days I ride up to the cafe and see a sea of Tarmacs and wonder, should I just have paid an extra $1500-$2000 to just get the bike that is faster, holds its value better, and the bike more people will admire?  I know these questions probably don't resonate with people on this sub since most of the bikes on here are way bellow the $3500 cost of the SL 8 Pro frameset let alone the sub $2K of the SLC3, but just things I rack in my brain with lately.

As per Winspace, I personally think their bikes are worth the price.  I think the quality is good, my personal experience with their customer service has been good, and there pricing even compared to the upper tier of Chinese bikes like Setka, Tavelo, and new brands like Evolve are good.  I think again in the context of this sub yeah, a $2000 SLC or $2400+ T1600 now seems crazy when people on here are talking about $500 frames, but like another poster stated, I personally wanted the safety that Winspace traditionally has very good tolerances and quality and two has some kind of name.  Now, again anyone who has had a China frame let a lone a Winspace knows how much you have to educate other riders about the brand since they have no clue and how if you ever sell the bike you will be taking a bath, but there is a growing circle of people that know and understand Winspace products.  I agree with Patrick that most people were introduced to Winspace via their wheels, but Winspace has drastically fallen behind in the carbon wheel race spectrum.  There are countless wheel companies that make lighter, more aero, wider, and even cheaper wheels.  ie this is why I switched to Elite Wheels after owning some 23 Hypers D45, which I did love.   

I currently use this as my secondary bike, or climbing bike since my main bike is a MY22 Scott Foil RC.  In the spectrum of things, it's nice having a dedicated aero bike and a dedicated lightweight/climbing race bike, since I can choose my bike based on the route elevation.  I really wish Winspace did aero testing.  Even if it was decently close to other major brands, I think this would be a huge plus for Winspace as a brand.  Again, for me the SLC3 really comps similar to a Canyon ultimate SL in price and a Canyon Ultimate SLX in performance, or a Giant TCR Pro, which kind of brings up the problem with this bike.  Yes, I got the bike exactly how I wanted it, with some pretty nice splurging on certain components, but again a Giant and Canyon in a mid tier config will be very close to what an upper mid tier Winspace will cost     

[Nkearb]

I got my SLC3 during the Christmas sale last year for $1475 with bars shipped.  Weighs 16lbs with pedals, cages, mounts, and sensors.
Winspace SLC3 Superlight Black Small 48cm
Winspace Zero SL Bars 85 x 380
EXS Airtape 30g
K-EDGE Pro Chain Catcher
SRAM AXS Red E1 Shifters w/ Force D2 Calipers
Galfer Wave CL 160mm Rotors
GP5000 S TR 28mm Setup Tubeless
Elite Wheel Drive D50 Wheels 1300g
SRAM AXS Force D1 48/35t Chainring w/ Red E1 160mm Cranks and Power Meter
BBInfinite BB86 DUB Ceramic One-Piece Bottom Bracket
SRAM AXS Force D2 Front Derailleur
SRAM AXS Force D2 Rear Derailleur w/ BBInfinite Oversized Ceramic Jockey Wheels
Red E1 Chain (Waxed)
Red E1 10-33t Cassette
Roval Alpinist 300mm Seatpost, will supply stock post as well
Specialized SWORKS Power Mirror Saddle 143mm w/ Garmin Varia Mount
Winspace Carbon Computer Mount
Wolf Tooth Seat Collar

A lot of the parts I already had, so the total build was $2300.  In hindsight while I really love this bike, but there is this Tarmac SL 8 envy I constantly get.  For $1500-$2000+ more I could have built a similar Tarmac SL 8 Pro but probably with the regular two piece stem and aero bars.  I can say from riding a friends SL 8, the SLC3 is not a SL 8 in a do it all aero bike, but is more akin to a Canyon Ultimate or Giant TCR in a more lightweight race bike.  It's snappy, quick, stiff enough to be responsive but not stiff enough to be detrimental to compliance.  It climbs well and descends well, but it's not an Aethos in terms of weight and definitely not in terms of compliance since that bike's rear is like a noodle, but it also doesn't give you that surging aero feel due to the lack of aero profiles and weight, but that is to be expected.  Maybe Patrick Lino can comment since he has both the Tarmac SL 8 Pro and the SLC3, but there are some days I am riding and I think, wow the SLC3 is everything I need, and there are other days I ride up to the cafe and see a sea of Tarmacs and wonder, should I just have paid an extra $1500-$2000 to just get the bike that is faster, holds its value better, and the bike more people will admire?  I know these questions probably don't resonate with people on this sub since most of the bikes on here are way bellow the $3500 cost of the SL 8 Pro frameset let alone the sub $2K of the SLC3, but just things I rack in my brain with lately.

As per Winspace, I personally think their bikes are worth the price.  I think the quality is good, my personal experience with their customer service has been good, and there pricing even compared to the upper tier of Chinese bikes like Setka, Tavelo, and new brands like Evolve are good.  I think again in the context of this sub yeah, a $2000 SLC or $2400+ T1600 now seems crazy when people on here are talking about $500 frames, but like another poster stated, I personally wanted the safety that Winspace traditionally has very good tolerances and quality and two has some kind of name.  Now, again anyone who has had a China frame let a lone a Winspace knows how much you have to educate other riders about the brand since they have no clue and how if you ever sell the bike you will be taking a bath, but there is a growing circle of people that know and understand Winspace products.  I agree with Patrick that most people were introduced to Winspace via their wheels, but Winspace has drastically fallen behind in the carbon wheel race spectrum.  There are countless wheel companies that make lighter, more aero, wider, and even cheaper wheels.  ie this is why I switched to Elite Wheels after owning some 23 Hypers D45, which I did love.   

I currently use this as my secondary bike, or climbing bike since my main bike is a MY22 Scott Foil RC.  In the spectrum of things, it's nice having a dedicated aero bike and a dedicated lightweight/climbing race bike, since I can choose my bike based on the route elevation.  I really wish Winspace did aero testing.  Even if it was decently close to other major brands, I think this would be a huge plus for Winspace as a brand.  Again, for me the SLC3 really comps similar to a Canyon ultimate SL in price and a Canyon Ultimate SLX in performance, or a Giant TCR Pro, which kind of brings up the problem with this bike.  Yes, I got the bike exactly how I wanted it, with some pretty nice splurging on certain components, but again a Giant and Canyon in a mid tier config will be very close to what an upper mid tier Winspace will cost     

Frame reviewers remind me of people who would review the audio quality differences from different hdmi cables. It is basically scientifically impossible for there to be a audible difference between different digital cables at short cable lengths under normal conditions. But youll find dozen of reviewers online writing paragraphes describing the differences. The difference you feel between a SLC3 and a SL8 that you attribute to the frame is likely Placebo

[jrasero]

Well I think that's the point to a degree.  The SLC might be the cheap Amazon Chinese cable that is perfectly fine but makes bold claims for transfer speeds but isn't certified and the Tarmac might be a Belkin that costs a ton more and is certified.  At the end of the day they both do the same purpose, but I think the founder of Vielo said it best, some bike companies are purely marketing companies that sell bikes and others are just bike companies.  I think Winspace is a good bike company trying to be a marketing company and Specialized is a very good bike company but a prolific marketing company.

[KaiDeus]

I honestly don't know how you would rate the aero performance on a frame that clearly does not fit you. Your saddle is way low and you have huge amounts of spacers in. You must sit very upright. 80% of aero is counting on your body position and yours is clearly not in any way aero on that bike.

If your Scott foil fits you better, no wonder you don't feel as fast on the SLC 3.

I don't claim the SLC 3 has big aero features, but I did ride mine next to people in a race on aero bikes and 20kg weight advantage and did not feel like I missed that much, when riding in a good low position.

Nothing against your personal experience, but I honestly would argue that yours can't be taken as a good example, when talking about aero performance.

[patliean1]

1. If you ultimately want an SL8 over your SLC3...get the SL8. Whatever makes you happy and inspires you to play bikes more. Your money your choice end of the day.

2. There won't be any tangible performance benefits (speed) to justify switching to the SL8 however. Maybe if you regularly do 3-4 hour uninterrupted solo rides at 300w. But even then there other more important factors to consider like optimal bike fit, wheels, clothing etc. Your frame definitely wont matter in an actual race scenario where drafting and bike handling are essential over everything else. This is a hard pill to swallow. Our egos and cognitive dissonance play a huge role.

3. I've ridden about 25 different frames in the past 4 years. And probably like 30 sets of wheels. I can very much tell the difference in the characteristics and dynamics of each frame. This has nothing to do with performance, speed, or HoW weLL iT HoLdS iTs sPEeD. I'm referring to how stiff the frame behaves out of the saddle. How it descends. Or how the back end of the bike responds to crappy pavement. And just the overall comfort of the bike when you're in the saddle for 7 hours. You don't even need a long-term review to realize any of this once you understand what to look for. It's why automobile journalists can hop into a new sports car, take it to the track or local canyon road, and immediately discern the driving dynamics. It's part of their job.

For myself...I just cleaned up my Giant Propel Advanced Pro frameset to be listed for sale the weekend. Will be doing the same for my Tarmac SL8 soon. The OEM suppliers and $1500-$2000 brands are plenty. Resell value aside.

[Nkearb]

Yeah I was exaggerating a bit. Id say comparing the slc3 and sl8 is like 2 nice wines of similar varieties except one is double the price. Sure theres a difference but its lost on 99% of people. And many people given the oppurity to test side by sidewill convince themselves they can tell the difference when they cannot

[jrasero]

I honestly don't know how you would rate the aero performance on a frame that clearly does not fit you. Your saddle is way low and you have huge amounts of spacers in. You must sit very upright. 80% of aero is counting on your body position and yours is clearly not in any way aero on that bike.

If your Scott foil fits you better, no wonder you don't feel as fast on the SLC 3.

I don't claim the SLC 3 has big aero features, but I did ride mine next to people in a race on aero bikes and 20kg weight advantage and did not feel like I missed that much, when riding in a good low position.

Nothing against your personal experience, but I honestly would argue that yours can't be taken as a good example, when talking about aero performance.

I would disagree the bike doesn't fit.  I purposely am running the full stack for a more "amateur" setup for longer rides.  As per the lack of seat post, ever see a non modern CAAD?  The SLC just isn't a really compact frame, maybe semi compact at best and combine that with my shorter legs, thus I don't have massive seat post showing.  It's true that will effect how I perceive the aero abilities of the bike, but I could also argue the lack of weight and larger tubing profiles make it easily apparent this isn't as fast as a all arounder or true aero bike.   

[KaiDeus]

Please don`t get me wrong, you can enjoy and ride your bikes like you want, that is all for your pleasure.

However with the remarks on the ride feel and performance, i think you might admit, it provides a hard time for anyone to take them at face value, when your riding that bike like a city bike. Regarding the round tube profile: The SL8 you mentioned as a comparison has mostly round shapes as well and the fork isn't deep either. Whenever you hear any expert talking about aero, almost nobody will tell you, they could just see how something would perform. I think there is a lot of confirmation bias in claiming to see how aero something is. Again, i'm not saying the slc 3 is as fast as an aero tuned allrounder or aero bike, but i argue, that you are exaggerating the difference quite a bit based on subpar parameters.

[jrasero]

Please don`t get me wrong, you can enjoy and ride your bikes like you want, that is all for your pleasure.

However with the remarks on the ride feel and performance, i think you might admit, it provides a hard time for anyone to take them at face value, when your riding that bike like a city bike. Regarding the round tube profile: The SL8 you mentioned as a comparison has mostly round shapes as well and the fork isn't deep either. Whenever you hear any expert talking about aero, almost nobody will tell you, they could just see how something would perform. I think there is a lot of confirmation bias in claiming to see how aero something is. Again, i'm not saying the slc 3 is as fast as an aero tuned allrounder or aero bike, but i argue, that you are exaggerating the difference quite a bit based on subpar parameters.

I mean that is a fair stance but I have ridden a Tarmac SL 8, just not long term and I own a dedicated aero bike with larger deeper profile tubing, so I can tell there is some difference.  The funny thing about aero positioning is that it's not static.  Yes if I were to ride on the hoods or tops all day, yeah I am pretty upright and have a lot of drag, but in a tucked in position with a 90 degree forearm bend or just riding on the drops gives me all experience I need to know if the bike is "fast" or not.  Maybe I am not an aesthetic queen like some and actually prefer a full stack of spacers since it allows me to be comfortable when I want to, but also allows me to hold an aero position for longer, thus riding further and possibly faster.  Either way, whether it's improper marketing or not, Winspace calls the SLC3 an endurance bike, make that as you will considering the geo is crazy close to even something like a Giant Propel.