Velobuild VB-R-177

[gruengelb]

Hi, i´ve just received this saddle (http://www.velobuild.com/products/carbon-fiber-saddle-with-pu-wrapped) together with my Frame and other parts.
Just built the bike today and did not manage to do a ride, so what i can say is that it looks well made and fits the Seatpost-interface.
The "PU-wrapping" looks quite convenient but the overlay does not overlap the edge of the saddle and ends exactly where the thigh normally rubs past with each pedal. I'm afraid that this will rub on the thigh on the one hand and possibly also loosen after some time.

Will report more details as soon as i did some kilometers.

Thank's for the feedback! I also ordered the same one. Let's see how long it holds up. If the pu is getting loose i may as well try to print a new cover myself ;-)

[patliean1]

Probably a good time to follow up with my thoughts on the 177. Anecdotal of course, so take with a grain of salt.

1. By and large I think the 177 is the better frame versus the 168. It's lighter, much stiffer, and I've found it to be more responsive of a riding experience. EPS molding if that's important to you. The geometry is more forgiving as well.

2. I've tested both the 168 and 177 with a variety of wheels: Winspace Hypers, Farports EVO, Elite Drive, and VeloBuild's own 38mm depth road wheels. This is where the differences in the frames became most apparent. The 177 comes alive with quality wheels. Despite most of the aforementioned wheels being stiff race wheels they felt somewhat soft under load with the 168. Marginal but noticeable. While the 168 is an aero frame (and arguably looks faster), you can easily slap some aero wheels on the 177 as well as optimize your on-bike position.

3. Velobuild's 38mm depth road wheels - Yes they're heavy but retail is only $339 USD. 1778g for what is suppose to be climbing wheels. Very noticeable on bad pavement and upon acceleration. Steel spokes and Novatec's cheapest generic hubs. For an ULTIMATE budget build where weight isn't a priority they are probably fine. Overall system weight is still more important. Sidenote...Novatec's top-tier hubs on the other hand are fantastic and I run them on my gravel wheels.

4. Front derailleur cable port - If you're running mechanical shift cables, routing and setting up the FD will most likely account for half of the entire time you spend on the bike build itself. The 177, 168, and CX-002 all use this style of cable port. Just be patient...

5. Separate Stem Combo - We can all agree the supplied stem which comes with the separate bar/stem combo is flawed in its design. VB updated the supplied metal C-ring/clip and removed the metal tabs, however you may still find difficulty removing all the headset slack/play. A fool-proof alternative is to opt for the integrated handlebars, use FSA's ACR system, or my favorite which is the FSA no.69 headset if you need to run your own stem. Hoping one day VB offers a separate stem with internal routing capabilities but with a tradition round top-cap design.

So for $500+shipping you get a classic looking frame resembling an S-Works SL6, a non-proprietary seatpost, and a frameset that comes in well under 1000g without paint and hardware. Solid if you ask me. Sadly I had disassemble my 177 (for a 2nd time) to donor the components for another build.

I'm running SRAM eTap on my VB CX-002 frame and the setup/experience is so awesome...I'm most likely gonna rebuild my 177 yet again but also use eTap. Make it my travel/climbing/holiday bike. Won't have to worry about FD routing issues either. THIS IS THE WAY.

[hazzer19]

Awesome summary of your experience on the 177 patliean1, thank you. I've been riding a 168 for almost 2 years now (May 2021) and have been super happy with it. I have a 177 on the way and excited to look out for the differences you pointed out between the two.


 

Probably a good time to follow up with my thoughts on the 177. Anecdotal of course, so take with a grain of salt.

1. By and large I think the 177 is the better frame versus the 168. It's lighter, much stiffer, and I've found it to be more responsive of a riding experience. EPS molding if that's important to you. The geometry is more forgiving as well.

2. I've tested both the 168 and 177 with a variety of wheels: Winspace Hypers, Farports EVO, Elite Drive, and VeloBuild's own 38mm depth road wheels. This is where the differences in the frames became most apparent. The 177 comes alive with quality wheels. Despite most of the aforementioned wheels being stiff race wheels they felt somewhat soft under load with the 168. Marginal but noticeable. While the 168 is an aero frame (and arguably looks faster), you can easily slap some aero wheels on the 177 as well as optimize your on-bike position.

3. Velobuild's 38mm depth road wheels - Yes they're heavy but retail is only $339 USD. 1778g for what is suppose to be climbing wheels. Very noticeable on bad pavement and upon acceleration. Steel spokes and Novatec's cheapest generic hubs. For an ULTIMATE budget build where weight isn't a priority they are probably fine. Overall system weight is still more important. Sidenote...Novatec's top-tier hubs on the other hand are fantastic and I run them on my gravel wheels.

4. Front derailleur cable port - If you're running mechanical shift cables, routing and setting up the FD will most likely account for half of the entire time you spend on the bike build itself. The 177, 168, and CX-002 all use this style of cable port. Just be patient...

5. Separate Stem Combo - We can all agree the supplied stem which comes with the separate bar/stem combo is flawed in its design. VB updated the supplied metal C-ring/clip and removed the metal tabs, however you may still find difficulty removing all the headset slack/play. A fool-proof alternative is to opt for the integrated handlebars, use FSA's ACR system, or my favorite which is the FSA no.69 headset if you need to run your own stem. Hoping one day VB offers a separate stem with internal routing capabilities but with a tradition round top-cap design.

So for $500+shipping you get a classic looking frame resembling an S-Works SL6, a non-proprietary seatpost, and a frameset that comes in well under 1000g without paint and hardware. Solid if you ask me. Sadly I had disassemble my 177 (for a 2nd time) to donor the components for another build.

I'm running SRAM eTap on my VB CX-002 frame and the setup/experience is so awesome...I'm most likely gonna rebuild my 177 yet again but also use eTap. Make it my travel/climbing/holiday bike. Won't have to worry about FD routing issues either. THIS IS THE WAY.

[Sebastian]

Thanks for your thoughts, @patliean1

I gotta say the VB177 really starts to grow on me. Overall it’s a nice offering.
Combined with a solid bar and stem solution it’s a very nice frameset.

Regarding Novatec hubs: As an amateur wheelbuilder I gotta say, Novatec hubs are just very solid value for money. Even their lower level offerings are good hubs. Easy to service. And super flexible because you can convert them to work with almost anything. I’m running 6 wheelsets with various types and levels of Novatec Hubs. Disc and Non Disc. Entry level up to flashy lightweight stuff with carbon hub shells. And they’re all running smoothly. Especially if you source them from Aliexpress, you might occasionally get a set with rough bearings. I’ve had two hubs which I had to replace bearings on pretty early. I wonder sometimes if there’s sellers on Ali who are selling b-stock or stuff that didn’t quite make it through qc. But overall, I really rate them.

[coffeebreak]

Any thoughts on 177 vs 218? Will appreciate that @patliean1 and others who have both. I know 218 is copy of Dogma and probably looked down upon but I like it and don't mind owning a copy.

[Sebastian]

Any thoughts on 177 vs 218? Will appreciate that @patliean1 and others who have both. I know 218 is copy of Dogma and probably looked down upon but I like it and don't mind owning a copy.

I own a 218 but not a 177. The 218 will obviously always end up being heavier than the 177. Other than that, it’s a stiff frame and not exactly a very forgiving ride. Which might not really be surprising. I think its most striking characteristic is its handling - at least for the size XXL (54) that I’m riding. The head angle is very steep, the fork rake is shorter than on the 177 and the front Center is very short as well. That results in a frame that is super quick in responding to steering impulses despite my longish 120mm stem. It’s borderline nervous but I like it. This feeling is offset by a very low bottom bracket at -72mm which results in a planted feeling. Still I’ve never had trouble with striking my pedals on the ground despite running 175mm cranks.
The geometry and handling of this frame is what I like most about it.

[jcr]

Probably a good time to follow up with my thoughts on the 177. Anecdotal of course, so take with a grain of salt.

1. By and large I think the 177 is the better frame versus the 168. It's lighter, much stiffer, and I've found it to be more responsive of a riding experience. EPS molding if that's important to you. The geometry is more forgiving as well.

2. I've tested both the 168 and 177 with a variety of wheels: Winspace Hypers, Farports EVO, Elite Drive, and VeloBuild's own 38mm depth road wheels. This is where the differences in the frames became most apparent. The 177 comes alive with quality wheels. Despite most of the aforementioned wheels being stiff race wheels they felt somewhat soft under load with the 168. Marginal but noticeable. While the 168 is an aero frame (and arguably looks faster), you can easily slap some aero wheels on the 177 as well as optimize your on-bike position.

3. Velobuild's 38mm depth road wheels - Yes they're heavy but retail is only $339 USD. 1778g for what is suppose to be climbing wheels. Very noticeable on bad pavement and upon acceleration. Steel spokes and Novatec's cheapest generic hubs. For an ULTIMATE budget build where weight isn't a priority they are probably fine. Overall system weight is still more important. Sidenote...Novatec's top-tier hubs on the other hand are fantastic and I run them on my gravel wheels.

4. Front derailleur cable port - If you're running mechanical shift cables, routing and setting up the FD will most likely account for half of the entire time you spend on the bike build itself. The 177, 168, and CX-002 all use this style of cable port. Just be patient...

5. Separate Stem Combo - We can all agree the supplied stem which comes with the separate bar/stem combo is flawed in its design. VB updated the supplied metal C-ring/clip and removed the metal tabs, however you may still find difficulty removing all the headset slack/play. A fool-proof alternative is to opt for the integrated handlebars, use FSA's ACR system, or my favorite which is the FSA no.69 headset if you need to run your own stem. Hoping one day VB offers a separate stem with internal routing capabilities but with a tradition round top-cap design.

So for $500+shipping you get a classic looking frame resembling an S-Works SL6, a non-proprietary seatpost, and a frameset that comes in well under 1000g without paint and hardware. Solid if you ask me. Sadly I had disassemble my 177 (for a 2nd time) to donor the components for another build.

I'm running SRAM eTap on my VB CX-002 frame and the setup/experience is so awesome...I'm most likely gonna rebuild my 177 yet again but also use eTap. Make it my travel/climbing/holiday bike. Won't have to worry about FD routing issues either. THIS IS THE WAY.

Great information I was looking at the 177. Regarding FSA No. 69, would it be similar to getting the headset cover like this? https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1005004647390416.html

[patliean1]

Great information I was looking at the 177. Regarding FSA No. 69, would it be similar to getting the headset cover like this? https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1005004647390416.html

Yup! Should work just fine. I might buy a few myself for future builds.

[oleg]

I have spare FSA N69 for sale, as I went with a custom solution:
https://chinertown.com/index.php/topic,4081.0.html

[ritxis]

I like Ritchey's solutions better

https://ritcheylogic.com/bike/headsets/Switch-upper-headset



https://ritcheylogic.com/bike/headsets/logic-e-1.5-integrated-is-upper-headset

[carbonazza]

I like Ritchey's solutions better...

If you have to pass only two hoses.
Otherwise, this is an open door to give the headset bearings a regular bath.

[jcr]

I like Ritchey's solutions better

https://ritcheylogic.com/bike/headsets/Switch-upper-headset



https://ritcheylogic.com/bike/headsets/logic-e-1.5-integrated-is-upper-headset

Would it be easy to route the 2 or 4 hole options vs. the slot?

[ritxis]

If you click on the link, you will see the solution.....

[abdbeg]

Hey guys, do you have flex with integrated handlebar that comes with this frame?

Should i buy it, or buy separate stem (like specialized tarmac stem with chinese handlebar)?

[gruengelb]

Hey folks,

I want to cut my steerer tube today but I want to confirm with you, that i am not doing something stupid. Instead of using the top cap that comes with the expander plug i need to use the one that comes with the stem (see images), right? So firstly i will cut the fork 3 mm below where the stem is touching  (red line in attached image, not to scale) then I will put the expander plug in there and tighten it. Then i will but the top cap (from the stem) and tighten the top cap. This will ensure that everything (spacers etc) is compressed properly.

Is this the right way to do it? Thanks for your help!