Velobuild VB-R-218

[Benbenben]

Hi guys, first post ever here 

For the ones who have the vbr218, someone mentioned a place to hold the di2 under the BB. Is it for the junction a box? That would be the first time I see that box not being held under the stem.

[Sebastian]

Hi guys, first post ever here 

For the ones who have the vbr218, someone mentioned a place to hold the di2 under the BB. Is it for the junction a box? That would be the first time I see that box not being held under the stem.

No. It’s a battery holder I think. Though I’m not an expert on Di2 groupsets. Once I receive my frameset I can post pics. Maybe someone else can clarify. I think this is because there is no space for a Di2 battery inside of the aero seatpost.

[michkus]

Yes it is a battery holder.
I use the 11 Speed Ultegra di2 and i use the barend junction box.

[TopGun]

Loving the current bike builds of this 218 frame. Personally the Pinarello Prince, the F12 and F are the most beautiful frames to me. The Prince is probably the only one realistically within my reach at a stretch to afford.

So, do i keep saving and try to get a real Pinarello Prince, or, should i buy a 218 Velobuild?

Could i ask what everyones experience with these frames / velobuild frames are? Im reading that the carbon layup is actually different to the originals, so how does that translate in real world riding? A few grams heavier? What about stiffness, thats more important to me than weight i would say.

One last question, would the Velobuild 218 be any better, or worse than an aliexpress replica (some of the paint jobs on those are incredible)

Many thanks everyone.

[Sebastian]

Loving the current bike builds of this 218 frame. Personally the Pinarello Prince, the F12 and F are the most beautiful frames to me. The Prince is probably the only one realistically within my reach at a stretch to afford.

So, do i keep saving and try to get a real Pinarello Prince, or, should i buy a 218 Velobuild?

Could i ask what everyones experience with these frames / velobuild frames are? Im reading that the carbon layup is actually different to the originals, so how does that translate in real world riding? A few grams heavier? What about stiffness, thats more important to me than weight i would say.

One last question, would the Velobuild 218 be any better, or worse than an aliexpress replica (some of the paint jobs on those are incredible)

Many thanks everyone.

It ultimately comes down to the question of whether you want the real thing or not and whether you think that the alleged difference in quality and performance justifies the higher price tag.
I'm in the middle of building a 218 rim brake frameset.
It's a carbon copy of the Dogma F. It's at least 200-300g heavier. I got my hands on both the disc and rim version of a size XXL/54 because I was sent the wrong frame. That's another thing you should be prepared to deal with when ordering from VB. Communication was always fast and friendly, but they're prone to making mistakes.  After two months, I finally ended up with the right frameset. BUT they did send me an unpainted seat post when I ordered a painted one and they forgot to include the spare derailleur hanger.

Frame and fork weighed roughly the same for disc and rim. Its around 1250g with derailleur hangers and the BB cover and Di2 holder installed. The real Dogma F is quoted around 850g for a medium sized frame, I think. Though I dunno whether that is with or without paint and hardware.

The finish is definitely rough here and there. Especially the headtube bearing seats are not very cleanly finished I gotta say. Installing the bearings was no problem, though.
The layup might be less sophisticated or not. The frame might be less stiff and/or less compliant. That's impossible to know without riding both back to back.
I'll post pics and a review once I have mine built up and once I've ridden it.

Now for the counterfeits on Aliexpress. Personally, I would stay away from it. Because at least with Velobuild, you can read through many different frame builds on this forum and have a bit of an idea as to what you're probably going to get and what kind of trouble might be involved. With Aliexpress, listings pop up and disappear on a daily basis. As do the sellers and their shops. Hard to tell what kind of quality you're buying. It's too much of a gamble, I think. If it is a reputable seller that's been around for years and has a lot of good reviews, then maybe. I've bought various parts from OG Evkin and they've always been rock solid. Also, I'd never buy a counterfeit that's made to look like a real Dogma with decals and everything. But that's just me.

[TopGun]

Thanks Sebastian,

Interesting, "alleged" performance differences between the copies and the original. I wouldn't care if the Velobuild 218 for example wasnt as good as the original, as long as it is plenty stiff enough, and it clearly isn't too heavy for a race bike. It will obviously be just as aero as the original. For the money what is not to love about these Chinese frame sets!

Lots and lot of hate and scaremongering on the internet. Most of the hate probably comes from snobs who can never admit to themselves they payed £10,000 extra to save 300g and have a cleaner looking bearing interface

[hazzer19]

New GC Performance video with initial impressions of the 218

[Sebastian]

New GC Performance video with initial impressions of the 218

I'm very curious to see how he gets through the building process.
I'm almost done but it wasn't without problems - as expected.
The exit hole for the rear brake cable on the top tube (i got the rim brake frame) was way too small for any cable outer to fit through. It almost looked like it was meant to be a cable stop. That wouldn't make sense however since there's no cable stop on the other end of the top tube. So I very gently widened the hole by hand with a drill, working my way through various sizes of drills until it was big enough, trying to not scratch the paint in the process. Not for the faint hearted.

The fork steerer's wall thickness is not uniform. It looks clean on the in and outside but still, that doesn't inspire confidence in the quality control at whatever factory builds these things.

The paint came off the fork dropouts as soon as I clamped it for the first time with skewers. No big deal. It shouldn't have been painted there in the first place. But it sure doesn't look pretty.

The compression ring for the upper headset has super sharp edges where it meets the fork steerer. Not exactly confidence inspiring. So I sanded it to make all the edges smoother. Not hard to do because it's made of super soft aluminium. So soft in fact that I bent it by quite a bit when sanding it without noticing. It's so thin at the cable holes that you can easily brake it, so be careful. I'm probably going to replace the fork expander plug with a longer one, but the one that came with it is probably fine. No headset play. It all went together smoothly.

The paint is not perfect here and there if you look closely. But it's still much better than I would ever be able to do myself.

All in all, I'm rather curious to see how durable this thing is in the long run. At least with wheels installed, everything looks to be straight and in line.
The bars are not the stiffest in the world but I've had worse. On the positive side, I found it quite easy to route mechanical outers through the bars and it steers smoothly. We'll see how well it shifts. Hangers are straight front and back, no setup issues.

I'll finish the build tonight and post pictures later.

[timelap]

Have been riding the 218 for the last few weeks put around 140 miles on it and have had no issue so far.  My build was a small and was a little long for me so I ordered 0 setback seat post from aliexp that fits the frame. 

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/3256803912995653.html?spm=a2g0o.order_list.0.0.21ef1802HC7fRR

[Sebastian]

My build is done. I did a shakedown ride of around 45k. No issues like seatpost slippage or headset play. Everything works fine. Shifting is also smooth despite the full internal routing. The frame is surprisingly comfy. The bars are really nice as well. The shape works very well for me. Fit is not dialed in yet 100%. Saddle position not yet right. But it's great.

Final build as pictured with pedals, cages and garmin mount weighs 7.65kg. I'm pretty happy with that.
More pics and a full review once I got a few more Ks with this bike.

[hazzer19]

My build is done. I did a shakedown ride of around 45k. No issues like seatpost slippage or headset play. Everything works fine. Shifting is also smooth despite the full internal routing. The frame is surprisingly comfy. The bars are really nice as well. The shape works very well for me. Fit is not dialed in yet 100%. Saddle position not yet right. But it's great.

Final build as pictured with pedals, cages and garmin mount weighs 7.65kg. I'm pretty happy with that.
More pics and a full review once I got a few more Ks with this bike.

Nice looking build! Love the color and choice of groppo

[memebike]

My build is done. I did a shakedown ride of around 45k. No issues like seatpost slippage or headset play. Everything works fine. Shifting is also smooth despite the full internal routing. The frame is surprisingly comfy. The bars are really nice as well. The shape works very well for me. Fit is not dialed in yet 100%. Saddle position not yet right. But it's great.

Final build as pictured with pedals, cages and garmin mount weighs 7.65kg. I'm pretty happy with that.
More pics and a full review once I got a few more Ks with this bike.

nice one, that colour is awesome!

[Sebastian]

Nice looking build! Love the color and choice of groppo

Thx!
I bought all the parts used or NOS. Campag Centaur is very underrated IMO. It's the poor man's Campag EPS, because it has the same down sweeping thumb paddles which makes it a lot easier to shift in the drops.
Brakes are Record, because I needed direct mount. I got them cheap NOS for less than half the new cost, bc in this day and age no one wants rim brakes . Crankset is H11, which is Record level. It's got a different chainline for disc frames, but that's only because the original chainrings are sitting further outboard. I got aftermarket 11 speed rings from Specialites and it works perfectly. Cassette is a regular Shimano 105, bc Campag 11 and Shimano 11 cassettes are virtually identical. Chain is Campag Potenza, bc Campag chains are just top notch.
So all in all, I could even make the bike a bit lighter with a lighter cassette and those fake EEbrakes on Aliexpress. But it's perfectly fine this way, since most of my rides are on pan flat terrain anyway.

I did use a longer expander plug in the end and I would recommend to everyone else to do the same, especially if you're using multiple spacers. The stock one is fine but on the short side. I don't trust these designs.

Tire clearance was a point of discussion here: I got a Vittoria Corsa 28mm tubular on the back. It's 29mm measured. I got about 4-5mm on either side of the chainstays, so I think 32mm might just about fit. BUT the limiting factor will eventually be tire height, because it get's very tight where the tire meets the seattube.

Personally, I see no reason to run bigger tires than this and I do ride shit roads and cobbles with it.

[StiffWeenies]

Have been riding the 218 for the last few weeks put around 140 miles on it and have had no issue so far.  My build was a small and was a little long for me so I ordered 0 setback seat post from aliexp that fits the frame. 

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/3256803912995653.html?spm=a2g0o.order_list.0.0.21ef1802HC7fRR

Thank you! these are the little nuggets of information that keep me interested in this frame

It makes me wonder what other non-Velobuild parts can be used on it. Hylix for example has a seatpost for the F12 which weighs 127.9g, although the seatpost shapes between the F and F12 are different (F is slimmer IIRC), it is an easy 100g saving over the stock VB unit when Hylix eventually releases one. Ditto for the Sigeyi DM hanger and disc hanger cap. And what about the cockpit? the stock VB unit is flexy so why not replace it with adapters for ACR, DCR, and conventional stems?

Hylex even has a replacement disc fork for the '19 Venge, the potential for weight saving will be absolutely huge should they ever decide to make one for the F, assuming it'll fit like the F seatpost on the 218. And this is something that is unique to the 218, as other '19 Venge and SL7 inspired open mould frames only possess visual resemblance versus supposed 1:1 fit for original parts.

[Sebastian]

Thank you! these are the little nuggets of information that keep me interested in this frame

It makes me wonder what other non-Velobuild parts can be used on it. Hylix for example has a seatpost for the F12 which weighs 127.9g, although the seatpost shapes between the F and F12 are different (F is slimmer IIRC), it is an easy 100g saving over the stock VB unit when Hylix eventually releases one. Ditto for the Sigeyi DM hanger and disc hanger cap. And what about the cockpit? the stock VB unit is flexy so why not replace it with adapters for ACR, DCR, and conventional stems?

Hylex even has a replacement disc fork for the '19 Venge, the potential for weight saving will be absolutely huge should they ever decide to make one for the F, assuming it'll fit like the F seatpost on the 218. And this is something that is unique to the 218, as other '19 Venge and SL7 inspired open mould frames only possess visual resemblance versus supposed 1:1 fit for original parts.

For what it’s worth: the painted stock seatpost I got weighed 226g. Now I got an unpainted one (with clear coat obviously) which weighs just shy of 200g. I upgraded it with a carbon seat clamp that I borrowed from an AliExpress seatpost. That saved another 25g. So you can get closer without spending too much.

Also I have to say that I don’t find the cockpit that flexy when actually riding the bike. The stem is super stiff. It’s really just the drops which are a bit flexier, probably because they have a sort of oval cross section. Dunno whether that’s to fit the hands better or whether that’s supposed to be aero. Either way, I found I don’t notice any excessive flexibility when riding it. I got an AliExpress aero bar that is reminiscent of a Zipp design which feels way worse. But even that one I’ve been riding for thousands of kilometres without issues and it actually feels quite comfy because it eats road buzz.