Hi All!
I currently ride a Winspace T1500D.  I would like to buy a second frameset.  My choice would be Speeder Sc R52 D, TanTan X38 or Ican A9.
What would be a frameset of similar quality to the Winspace?  I do race so must be able to ride fast and reliable on the flat, mountains and downhill.

The Winspace is a great bike but let down by a very stiff rear , making it not that fast descending.

Any info very welcome, or do you have any alternatives?

Many thanks in advance.

Why would a stiff rear end slow you down?
Wouldn't a flexy rear end potentially slow you down ascending?

I'm guessing you're feeling a lack of compliance leading to a lack of confidence going downhill.

This is mostly down to tires and rims--excessively high tire pressure is the single largest factor in poor rear-end compliance.

You can reduce tire pressure while keeping rolling-resistance low by adopting wider tires, wider rims, higher-quality tires, and replacing butyl tubes with TPU, latex, or tubeless tires. The frame is mostly secondary to tire-setup, after all, the pros are riding Roubaix on aero-bikes these days.

What rear tire are you using? What width? What rim width are you using?

For example, I weigh 80kg, I am using 28mm Continental GP5000 with Ridenow TPU tubes inside, mounted to ICAN Aero 35 wheels, which have a 19mm internal rim-width. I run about 80-85PSI for races with high demands on cornering.

If you are really committed to buying another frame, I believe ICAN has the most solid reputation for quality, but their frames are somewhat heavy. And there's no guarantee it will be more compliant than your Winspace.

Quote from: dsveddy on December 17, 2023, 11:32:44 AM
I'm guessing you're feeling a lack of compliance leading to a lack of confidence going downhill.

This is mostly down to tires and rims--excessively high tire pressure is the single largest factor in poor rear-end compliance.

You can reduce tire pressure while keeping rolling-resistance low by adopting wider tires, wider rims, higher-quality tires, and replacing butyl tubes with TPU, latex, or tubeless tires. The frame is mostly secondary to tire-setup, after all, the pros are riding Roubaix on aero-bikes these days.

What rear tire are you using? What width? What rim width are you using?

For example, I weigh 80kg, I am using 28mm Continental GP5000 with Ridenow TPU tubes inside, mounted to ICAN Aero 35 wheels, which have a 19mm internal rim-width. I run about 80-85PSI for races with high demands on cornering.

If you are really committed to buying another frame, I believe ICAN has the most solid reputation for quality, but their frames are somewhat heavy. And there's no guarantee it will be more compliant than your Winspace.

I can pretty much guarantee it won't.

I ride a Speeder RC-48D and it's just as stiff as my Allez Sprint 2019 Disc IE almost zero compliance.

It's a fast bike but not one I would chalk up as comfortable by any means.

Thanks for your input.  I can assure you I did use several wheelsets and tyre dimensions and tyre pressures.  I weigh 68Kg, 1.77m.
I spoke to Cam Nicholls about it and he exactly confirms my Winspace T1500 riding experience. 

I am looking for another frame to build up that improves on the descending and acceleration uphill.

I was looking for a Seka but bad customer correspondence and I think too expensive.  I get a mainstream frame for less or about the same price.

Thanks again.

Quote from: Yunglord on December 17, 2023, 11:35:14 AM
I ride a Speeder RC-48D and it's just as stiff as my Allez Sprint 2019 Disc IE almost zero compliance.

I want one now.

Quote from: patliean1 on December 17, 2023, 03:55:07 PM
I want one now.

What is your current hierarchically sorted list of bikes to build?

On the actual topic: I ride a Speeder, and the frame is great. I only had some minor issues with play of the headset bearing, but nothing some tape (again thanks patliean1) could not fix.

The TanTan X38 has for me the perfect geometry, and I do like the style.  I do like the quality of Winspace T1500 which I bought 13 months ago at 1400euros all in and with integrated handlebar. Unfortunately the new T1550 is a bit more expensive and not really different from the T1500.

The Speeder and Ican works out about 1100euros all in. Tantan is a few 100euros cheaper.

A year ago I ordered and paid for a Velobuild but I cancelled the order as the waiting would have been too long, after a conversation with Chris who warned me about the changed delivery times.  I immediately received my money back.   Proper service!   Not so sure about the frame quality and ride characteristics.

Any ideas? 

Is Yishun a  reliable alternative perhaps?  Anybody had dealinghs with them?

Yishun bikes are really good. I think their R058D standard is now available for customers. I own an R086D so if you want a contact, I can give you one.