Velobuild VB-R-218

[Irideslowly]

With that said, obviously it will feel sluggish compared to a frame that costs 10x the price, but i dont think its fair to velobuild, or any of these brands, to say their frame is sluggish.

I think it's important to use precise language. It is sluggish compared to the pinarello, not compared to frames in the same price range.

I hope I am coming off clearly..

[patliean1]

Nobody buys a Toyota corolla ( no offense) and expects it to drive like a Lamborghini.

I can show you the 75+ messages/emails I've received over the past 6 months, of people straight up asking me how my VeloBuild bikes (Corolla) compares to my Winspace T1500 (not quite a Lamborghini, maybe an Audi). No one EVER asks me about my Dengfu R12 which is a better comparison to VeloBuild.

No matter how obvious it is that a $500 frame is not competing with a $1500 frame, let alone $4000 SL7 expert frame, confirmation bias (and sometimes delusion) is still very real.

[Irideslowly]

I totally agree with the confirmation bias.



I should have stated,

You SHOULDN'T compare a Toyota to a Lamborghini. Enjoy your Toyota, its a great car, but not a supercar.


And that's ok.

[ant]

For me the brand new toyota (velobuild) is the nicest car I'd have ridden to date

[madmax]

Did any of you guys have any issues with

1. Misaligned FD/RD holes  ?

2. Paint in BB or alignment issues ?

3. Fork flex ?

4. Bolt/nut inside BB that needed to be filed or was hitting the crank ?


Based on above earlier responses, it does look like a rim/campy would be easier for me to build as a first bike & maintain

I have no clue about the toyota/audi/lambo comparisons as I would expect any carbon frame to be lighter than an alloy one & if we put the vbr-218 frame next to a dogma f and use the exact same components on each bike & the only difference being the 218 would be heavier by 300 -500 gm than the dogma, then given the same rider & riding conditions I would expect them to be equal in performance

Of-course my above comment may be totally ignorant, but in my head I see this as a piece of carbon that is painted or unfinished being propelled forward by a pair of legs

[Queen of Skulls]

You SHOULDN'T compare a Toyota to a Lamborghini. Enjoy your Toyota, its a great car, but not a supercar.

From what I can tell Winspace has better finishing and QC/QA but not better construction. Slightly different things, So the ones that make it out of the factory Are less likely to be flawed. Thats why you are paying more for the winspace. As far as I can tell from videos and blogs and what not. winspace uses the same types of carbon as VB. And are these more like corvette?  very sporty got some punch but not as BA as lambo. The toyoda is more the sub 1k bikes you can pick up. That are very decent but are not going super fast. Well ok, maybe a high-end supra if we are going to call them toyodas. Corrvette or supra

[carbonazza]

... it does look like a rim/campy would be easier for me to build as a first bike & maintain...
I have no clue about the toyota/audi/lambo comparisons ...

The learning curve is steeper for disc brakes.
But after sone misses and youtube vids, you'll know how it works.

Never had any of the issues you listed on many frames.
The most annoying though is misaligned brake mounts.
So common that I finally bought the tool to face them.

For the car metaphor.
For road bikes, since I descend often at 80-90km/h when possible, I psychologically preferred to rely on branded frames.

I did ride for few years a Canyon Ultimate CF-SLX, fine.
When a tube cracked just before a big Alpine event, I converted my Carbonda CFR-505 to a road bike, it did ride as fine.
Then got back the Canyon finally replaced, and didn't notice any significant difference.

I moved to an Aethos S-Works now, and... it is fine too. Again not a revolution either, except maybe the number of people telling me how nice my bike is
Each time however they were equipped with hi-end electronic shifting and hydro disc brakes and very good wheels and tires.

Most of us will be happy with the bike they build from a reputable seller here.
And for me the equipment and wheels/tires is what makes the bike.
I'm not convinced the frame is that important.

[madmax]

The learning curve is steeper for disc brakes.
But after sone misses and youtube vids, you'll know how it works.

Never had any of the issues you listed on many frames.
The most annoying though is misaligned brake mounts.
So common that I finally bought the tool to face them.

Could you  let me know what tool you used for the misaligned brake mounts on the vbr-218 (I'm assuming you had the issue on the 218   (rim or disc?))

For the disc stuff, I know that eventually I will have to bleed the brakes on the trek madone & at some point I will learn how to do that.

Canyon's are pretty nice, my wife is riding the canyon aeroroad, though she does not like the shimano 105 groupset (non-Di2), compared to her old campy chorus groupset from 2005

[carbonazza]

...From what I can tell Winspace has better finishing and QC/QA but not better construction...

For me they are just better at marketing.
They put their brand on the frame.
They flood youtube influencers with samples.
Trifox is kind of similar for MTB.
And put the prices higher.

I really like the nerdy side of this forum about finding cheap but good parts and helping each other to build their dream bike.
But this corruption of perceptions that started a year or so ago annoys me.

[kongo]

Time to hang the do not disturb sign on the door. My friend finally came in.

[carbonazza]

Could you  let me know what tool you used for the misaligned brake mounts on the vbr-218 (I'm assuming you had the issue on the 218   (rim or disc?))

For the disc stuff, I know that eventually I will have to bleed the brakes on the trek madone & at some point I will learn how to do that.

Canyon's are pretty nice, my wife is riding the canyon aeroroad, though she does not like the shimano 105 groupset (non-Di2), compared to her old campy chorus groupset from 2005

This one: https://www.vartools.uk/disc-brake-mount-facing-tool-c2x36007373
The investment doesn't make any sense to build just one bike.
I've never built a Velobuild. But many others and almost always disc.
We should all unionise and tell all sellers here: we only buy if you have the mount faced !

I can understand your wife! I moved my Campy EPS 12sp from the Canyon to the Aethos. No other group convinced me to switch.
Although I'm a huge fan of Eagle AXS for MTB and as a mullet for gravels.

[Queen of Skulls]

I really like the nerdy side of this forum about finding cheap but good parts and helping each other to build their dream bike.
But this corruption of perceptions that started a year or so ago annoys me.

I do believe there is a ton better marketing, true. From what I can see there is a lack of horror stories about misaligned BB inserts, disc brake mounts, seat tube issues, axle alignment, and what not. Which denotes better qc/qa.  Like I am hearing from VB or TT. With VB beating out tt with finish and quality by a lot.  I am saying winspace has better QA/QC and finishing. So there are no major issues.  But I can buy 2-3 frames for the price of ws frame.

ANd I would just find a LBS that could face the parts I needed. BB, disc, etc.  probably cost you 50 bucks max.

Though one tool would be nice to have is a BB tread tap.

[madmax]

This one: https://www.vartools.uk/disc-brake-mount-facing-tool-c2x36007373
The investment doesn't make any sense to build just one bike.
I've never built a Velobuild. But many others and almost always disc.
We should all unionise and tell all sellers here: we only buy if you have the mount faced !

I can understand your wife! I moved my Campy EPS 12sp from the Canyon to the Aethos. No other group convinced me to switch.
Although I'm a huge fan of Eagle AXS for MTB and as a mullet for gravels.

I looked at the tool.....and feared for my wallet & safety (wife) 
At this point I already have a large collection of ParkTools & other stuff

Ok so I think I will go for the rim option & campy recordset sometime in December & leave it matte black/unfinished 

I saw a few videos on painting & I think a can of Dupli-color Shift will give that frame a very nice shimmer just the Trek Project One bikes with the color changing scheme

[Queen of Skulls]

I looked at the tool.....and feared for my wallet & safety (wife) 

Ok so I think I will go for the rim option & campy recordset sometime in December & leave it matte black/unfinished 

Just find a local bike shop with the tool. and have them do it. You dont need all the tools even though you want all of them.

[carbonazza]

...Though one tool would be nice to have is a BB tread tap.

I got them in a bundle of tools from a bike shop that went bankrupt.
And never used them in 5+ years.
As you just said, probably one you don't need either.
But I agree they look nice