Velobuild VB-R-218

[neobiker]

Just pulled the trigger on this one

[RDY]

Alright, I am building the frame that I have received under warranty because the first one was showing cracks between to he 2 holes on the seat stay.

Now I have just tightened the same bolt (making sure not to go above 3.5 nm). See picture. I see similar hairline "cracks" around the hole.

Do you guys have the same thing? It's really small, but still I don't believe I should have those "cracks". Unless the paint (basic black matte) is really bad quality.

For now, the indications don't seem to transfer into the carbon layup. But if you guys tell me that some of you have the same thing, I would know it really is the paint ain't no risk for those indications to become cracks in carbon.

Looks like warranty number 2 to me.

It staggers me that people are still buying these (or really anything from Velobuild) given the number of cracked 218s in the last year.  But then I suppose people are buying Dogmas still for 10x the price when they've had a plague of similar cracks.

[Sebastian]

I'm not saying this frame is without issues. But if every little problem with brand name frames would be as public and as much discussed in detail as the Chiner frames are on this forum, you'd probably say the same thing about those.
Also, it is worth noting that from what I can tell, VB has respected the warranty for this frame in every single case that has been discussed here.

[neobiker]

By the way, they are stopping the sell of this model.

[joegal]

By the way, they are stopping the sell of this model.

Due to legal reasons or warranty/quality reasons?

[Benbenben]

I have sent Chris the picture. He said he was checking and will reply. At this point, I would prefer that they send another model. After waiting months to rebuild the bike with warranty frame, the feeling was not great when I saw the cracks again on a new frame. I will let you know what is the outcome of warranty discussion.

[Benbenben]

Positive discussion for now with Chris. He agreed to send another model, but I have to pay to compensate for fork, bar and seat post. That is fair.

I would go with the 177, but I am tempted by the 268. It seems to be almost as light as the 177.It seems that the 177 reputation is pretty good. Do you guys think I should jump with the 268 or stay conservative with the 177?

Edit: I just placed the order for the 268.

[kvnp]

Hello!

I’m a new member here. Last October, I bought a 218 frame and spent the winter season indoors using it with my Kickr Core. Recently, I’ve noticed some cracks around the screw seatposts, and it seems like other members have experienced this issue too.

Have any of you dealt with these cracks yourselves? How was the customer service in addressing this specific issue?

[Serge_K]

That is not good. I've bought 4 frames from Chris but not that one. Strange clamping system, especially 4nm. Did you use a torque wrench?
I'd email him and see what he says. AFAIK, frames that are cracked at the seat post are written off. Can it be just a paint thing? If you look inside the tube what do you see? Can you film what happens when you sit on the frame? Paint crack, fine, frame crack, landfill?

[blackpyros]

This is not the first frame with cracks in a seat tube in that specific area and I cannot fathom why these cracks even appear there in the first place as the bolts are not tightened to the frame itself. The holes are there just to access the bolts and all the force from tightening them should act on the seatpost so if anything the seatpost should crack and not the seat tube.

[mattgolt]

Oh wow these pictures don't seem good. Fingers crossed to everyone who has the cracks, that velobuild resolves this. I'm still spared by this problem, but given that my seatpost is quite far extended I'm afraid it could happen too.

However I also cannot understand why they appear. The gub screws only force the two metal bits apart, so the load should me evenly distributed in the area, and not only on the threads.

Regarding why they stop selling the 218.. I'm not surprised. Does anyone remember how quickly gcperformance took his video offline after he posted it? I'm sure pinarello is not very amused about this frame being around.

[Mic553]

The seatpost clamping is just like the original Pinarello. But I got serious doubts in this construction. The bolts spread 2 metal parts behind the seatpost, so they press it against the front of the seattube. Any force on the saddle will work against that. So some force is held by the rather thin back of the seattube at those bolts. In the end most force is held by the lower part of the seattube where the seatpost will sit rather tightly and tilt to take the force. But not all of it if the seatpost shall be fixed forward. I don't know, it could be an issue of manyfactoring tolarances?

Anyway: I got cracks too and Chris send me a replacement frame. It took 3 month though. The good news is: I didn't bother to build the new frame yet. I'm running cracks worse than that for 5000km now and it's still working and holding the seatpost fine...

I would recommend taking measures agains seatpost slipping though so one can use less force on the clamping. I used some textile tape (after degreasing the seatpost with isopropanol) at the bottom-front of the seatpost (where it doesn't reach full width yet) and some at the back right in the clamping area. Additionally I made generous use of carbon paste. It may be needed to tilt the seatpost a few degrees forward when inserting it, but once in position it will almost hold by itself. It didn't even slide a mm since I did that.

Other than that I still love that bike. It's running great.

[blackpyros]

Regarding why they stop selling the 218.. I'm not surprised.

You are a second one to say here they are stop selling this model. May I ask what do you base this claim on? In fact, you can still order the frame on their website to this day.

Anyway: I got cracks too and Chris send me a replacement frame.

May I ask where did you get the cracks?

I would recommend taking measures agains seatpost slipping though so one can use less force on the clamping.

Also please can you say what torque did you use after taking these measures? It would be helpful as I am currently in the process of building a bike on this frame.

[Mic553]

May I ask where did you get the cracks?
Also please can you say what torque did you use after taking these measures? It would be helpful as I am currently in the process of building a bike on this frame.

Mine where right between the bolts.

I probably used 4nm, but I'm not sure. I may have been lazy.

If you're still building, don't even try fixing the seatpost by grease and bolts. Use some helpers like I described, try to get away with less than 4nm and you should be fine. I will do it that way when I build the replacement frame.

[blackpyros]

I probably used 4nm, but I'm not sure. I may have been lazy.

Thanks for answer but... wow, that's kinda heavy torque. I was expecting the measures would allow you to go much lower. It's the maximum allowed torque for the real Dogma F. Someone here did use less (3,5 Nm) and still got the cracks...