Lightcarbon: LCR018-D (endurance all-road)

[glitch]

Hey everyone,

I wrote a while back about having some issues with my frame, a crack on the top tube (likely from shipping) that I unfortunately only noticed during my first ride after finishing the build.

I'm happy to give a quick update: I contacted Light Carbon, and on June 11th, they confirmed they will provide a free replacement frame (excluding handlebar, fork, and seat post), complete with the custom paint job. They are also covering all shipping costs. Massive props to their customer service for handling it so well.

A bit off topic, but while waiting for the new frame to arrive, I’m looking for a new wheelset to pair with it. I want to keep the build looking clean, so I'll be opting for a matte UD finish with no decals.

I’ve been eyeing a 45mm front / 60mm rear staggered setup from Serenade: serenadebikes.net/23mm-internal-high-performance-aero-bike-wheels-build-with-carbon-fiber-spokes-p6704522.html.
To give you some context on how I will use them, I will mostly be running 30mm road tires for summer, but the wheels should also allow for 35-38mm gravel tires. I am looking for a setup that is reasonably light and snappy without sacrificing flat-road aero, especially since I mostly ride flat roads and only ride hills on vacations.

Do you think this configuration makes sense for an aero frame, or should I consider other alternatives in the sub 700€ price bracket? What wheels are you guys running on your builds, and are you happy with them?
Serenade seems to have a good price performance ratio, but I am open to other suggestions.

In regards to staggered setup, if you look what the established brands offer, it is the other way round with higher rim in the front as the front hits the air first. I have 45 Serenade wheels, 50 Ican and 60 Scribe - I enjoy the Serenade wheels the most. I often ride in windy conditions and they are the least impacted by crosswinds and are by far the lichtest which gives a snappy feeling and is loads of fun for short power bursts riding rolling hills.

[POTOOOOOOOO]

In regards to staggered setup, if you look what the established brands offer, it is the other way round with higher rim in the front as the front hits the air first. I have 45 Serenade wheels, 50 Ican and 60 Scribe - I enjoy the Serenade wheels the most. I often ride in windy conditions and they are the least impacted by crosswinds and are by far the lichtest which gives a snappy feeling and is loads of fun for short power bursts riding rolling hills.

Crosswind stability/ instability is largely driven by how the rim and tyre match. Not just the wheel in isolation.
Sometimes people get lucky but generally this is an important area that overlooked by people just chasing the “look”of deep wheels and ignoring the actual “aero” behind it.

[flix]

If you want something aero, and will use 30mm tyres then these are far too narrow.
If you want to use gravel tyres then they’ll probably not be aero on any rims so I’d concentrate your efforts towards the 30mm road setting.


There are absolutely tones of options for 25-26 internal wheels with wider external measurements which would be a much better fit and also offer some aero befit

Is it far too narrow?
I read of the 105% rule, which states that the external rim should be at least 105% of the tire width.
And the wheels I mentioned have an external width of 34mm, which is more than 105% of 30 mm.

Are there no downsides at all to have wider rims?

In regards to staggered setup, if you look what the established brands offer, it is the other way round with higher rim in the front as the front hits the air first. I have 45 Serenade wheels, 50 Ican and 60 Scribe - I enjoy the Serenade wheels the most. I often ride in windy conditions and they are the least impacted by crosswinds and are by far the lichtest which gives a snappy feeling and is loads of fun for short power bursts riding rolling hills.

Yes I've also heard that from an aerodynamic standpoint, deeper front wheels make more sense.
But I would have tought, that a shallower front wheel would reduce the impact from cross winds.
Which Serenade model do you have?

[POTOOOOOOOO]

Is it far too narrow?
I read of the 105% rule, which states that the external rim should be at least 105% of the tire width.
And the wheels I mentioned have an external width of 34mm, which is more than 105% of 30 mm.

Are there no downsides at all to have wider rims?

Yes I've also heard that from an aerodynamic standpoint, deeper front wheels make more sense.
But I would have tought, that a shallower front wheel would reduce the impact from cross winds.
Which Serenade model do you have?

105, yes, its a thing, but will you only ever stick with one brand of 30mm tyres ? They all measure differently. Will you eventually go to 32mm or bigger?

All of a sudden you’re outside of 105 and you could just future proof the choice now.

And no, there really isn’t a down side to going wider - but hey keep reading whatever your reading and come to your own conclusion

[glitch]

I think the whole 105 thing has been a bit debunked by now by several aero experts such as Swiss Side.
Unless you are competing at the highest level it hardly has a meaningful impact on your experience.
In regards to my comment on crosswind stability - my example is on my Cannondale SystemSix. Given the frame profile also has quite an impact on the stability in strong gusts. Same wheels on my steel frame obviously will behave more calmly, but the SystemSix is a lot more manageable with the lower Serenade wheels in strpng winds and could I only own one wheelset I'd go for a light allroind set rather than chase every bit of aero. Even if it perhaps ultimately is not fastser the quick pickup and snappy feeling is more "fun" than the higher profile.


I have the wavy rim wheels with carbon spokes - 25ID / 34 OD. Very nice wheels actually. Currently running 28mm tyres which stretch nicely to a bit above 30 mm.

[POTOOOOOOOO]

That’s why I said 105 is a thing. It’s been debunked but tyre rim integration has a huge effect on crosswind stability and air detachment.It just happens that’s also related to rim width and tyre width.

Tyres wider than rims effectively cancel out much of point of deep rims. If you’re going to have wide tyres without wide rims it’s kinda pointless really. You might as well stick with shallow wheels, but deep wheels can also be extremely docile in strong winds if they’re paired with the right tyre of the right width.

It’s air detachment at yaw angles that give the twitch when you’re overtaken by a truck or get strong side gust.

I have 65mm deep wheels that perform more calmly than some 45s depending on what tyres I use. It only takes a few mm of extra rubber to make a noticeable difference.

[FrostedDyslexia]

It only takes a few mm of extra rubber to make a noticeable difference.

so what's the ideal situation there? same real width, tyre slightly wider or rim slightly wider?

[POTOOOOOOOO]

so what's the ideal situation there? same real width, tyre slightly wider or rim slightly wider?

Rim slightly wider is best, same same is fine, wider tyre is crap.

Your weight and roughness of roads when you ride should dictate what tyres you want to run, then choose a rim to suit.

Most people just choose cheap wheels and sling on some tyres.

[mddobbs]

Regarding running too narrow tires on wider rims, the cross-sectional, more oval shape of the tire exposes more of the sidewall to the riding surface.  All bike sidewalls are much thinner than the center tread and have less rubber protecting the casing (see "Bicycle Rolling Resistance" website).   A well matched rim and tire that will easily roll over a medium sharp rock could get an irreparable sidewall cut on a sharp edged stone.  This was once an expensive lesson for me.

Rim slightly wider is best, same same is fine, wider tyre is crap.

Your weight and roughness of roads when you ride should dictate what tyres you want to run, then choose a rim to suit.

Most people just choose cheap wheels and sling on some tyres.

[POTOOOOOOOO]

Regarding running too narrow tires on wider rims, the cross-sectional, more oval shape of the tire exposes more of the sidewall to the riding surface.  All bike sidewalls are much thinner than the center tread and have less rubber protecting the casing (see "Bicycle Rolling Resistance" website).   A well matched rim and tire that will easily roll over a medium sharp rock could get an irreparable sidewall cut on a sharp edged stone.  This was once an expensive lesson for me.

Shame, that’s unlucky.

 The last sidewall cut I got was about 2017 and about  90+ thousand kilometres ago. It was a 25mm GP4K on a Mavic SLR with about an 18mm internal.

This isn’t really the thread to get into sidewall cuts and rim width, there are other threads already catering for that.
I’ve recently uploaded some pictures of differing rim/tyre combinations, some of which are super aggressive and none have encountered any sidewall wear. ( it was one of the things I was specifically testing for )

According to the race group I ride with, I’m fast though corners, so, like punctures, there is a lot of luck /Un luck involved in sidewall damage regardless of fitment.

But whatever, we’re all entitled to our own opinions, but I put a lot of time and energy into testing rather than reading about what others are doing, so i have real world experience.

[dnz49]

Just finished my first build and my first ride of 85 km.

Frame: Lightcarbon LCR018-D 56 cm
Groupset: Shimano 105 Di2 52/36 11-36T 165mm
Wheel set: Elitewheels Edge 3.0 52mm
Saddle: Ryet 3D Carbon
Seat Post with zero setback

8,1 kg (with with pedals, computer mount, bottle cage, handlebar tape)


Unfortunately, the saddle is still causing problems. The seatpost stays in place after I greased the sliding surfaces of the clamp and the bolt, but the saddle tilts under load.
I’ve already tightened the clamp quite firmly, but I was careful because of the carbon struts (recommended torque: max. 5 Nm). Even so, the saddle tipped over when I hit a pothole. I haven’t used carbon paste yet.
What would you recommend I do next?

• Tighten the bolts even more? (Unfortunately, a torque wrench won’t fit due to the design.)
• Try carbon paste?

Do you have any tips?

[Westman]

Hello here ,

I subscribe to this forum because I'm struggling to choose the correct size of this frame and I'd like to get some advice.
I'm currently ride a triban RC 500:
- Stack: 603 mm
- Reach: 385 mm
- Effective top tube length: 564 mm
- Head tube length: 185 mm
- Stem length: 110 mm
- No spacers under the stem
Some of my personnal info:
- Height: 184 cm
- Inseam: approximately 85–86 cm
- Wingspan: 194 cm
- Current saddle height (BB center to saddle top): approximately 765 mm
- Saddle-to-handlebar height difference: approximately 95 mm
- My elbows are always slightly bent when riding on the hoods.
I have never done rides up to a 2 hours, but my goal with the LCR018-D is long-term comfort and longer endurance rides in the future.
My intended use:
- 80% road riding
- 20% light gravel
- Priority: comfort, reliability and keeping the bike for many years rather than maximum racing performance.

Lightcarbon told me I should go with a 54:
"Engineer Verdict & Complete Optimal Build Spec (Comfort-First) for you:
Best selection: LCR018-D Size 54  (56cm is not recommended)
Seatpost: 15mm offset
Cockpit: HBR17 integrated bar with 110mm stem length, 10mm total headset spacers (2×5mm)"

To be honnest, I'm not entirely sure about this recommendation. I used a LLM (don't blame me too hard ToT) to compare all these numbers and get some advice (I'm a total noob) and they are more mixed than Lightcarbon considering the size.
In your opinion, should I go with a 54 or a 56? I’m literally right in between those two sizes x)?
Since this is a long-term project, I’m afraid of making the wrong decision.

One more question about the paintjob. I recently read here that prices start at 250$ now, even if you just want a single color paint. Could you confirm this? Plus, I find their color chart (on technology>decal and painting) very limited.
Whe you look at those google photos:
- https://photos.google.com/share/AF1QipNbDeA19x05JwZpr2bHiyu0E5YvzamaKK0gF4bklCOxZBix-NIZwmdfVDWaPsTPAw?key=TW5fdWpvaV9BcFBXalladVVHUkV0RkM3cVFjNEJ3
- https://photos.google.com/share/AF1QipPBg-nYi2ZcQvF4-KlV2GH7TT53Agtv821dpfaxWmwKW1LULs7xaKbSnqBdlfqjKQ?key=di1HT0ZOOENJaWZSZlBuUkZhdTNtR3U5cDd2dWtB
You can see much more colors and textures on their frames. Do they have other references for colors and texture paint?

Thank you so much everyone ♥

[POTOOOOOOOO]

Any reason you’re not getting a bike fit instead of guessing?

[POTOOOOOOOO]

Unfortunately, the saddle is still causing problems. The seatpost stays in place after I greased the sliding surfaces of the clamp and the bolt, but the saddle tilts under load.
I’ve already tightened the clamp quite firmly, but I was careful because of the carbon struts (recommended torque: max. 5 Nm). Even so, the saddle tipped over when I hit a pothole. I haven’t used carbon paste yet.
What would you recommend I do next?

• Tighten the bolts even more? (Unfortunately, a torque wrench won’t fit due to the design.)
• Try carbon paste?

Do you have any tips?

Ryet use solid, not hollow carbon rails.

You’re free to use as much torque as you need as they can’t be crushed.

Try 8+

[Schneedolf]

Just finished my first build and my first ride of 85 km.

Frame: Lightcarbon LCR018-D 56 cm
Groupset: Shimano 105 Di2 52/36 11-36T 165mm
Wheel set: Elitewheels Edge 3.0 52mm
Saddle: Ryet 3D Carbon
Seat Post with zero setback

8,1 kg (with with pedals, computer mount, bottle cage, handlebar tape)


Unfortunately, the saddle is still causing problems. The seatpost stays in place after I greased the sliding surfaces of the clamp and the bolt, but the saddle tilts under load.
I’ve already tightened the clamp quite firmly, but I was careful because of the carbon struts (recommended torque: max. 5 Nm). Even so, the saddle tipped over when I hit a pothole. I haven’t used carbon paste yet.
What would you recommend I do next?

• Tighten the bolts even more? (Unfortunately, a torque wrench won’t fit due to the design.)
• Try carbon paste?

Do you have any tips?

I am not a medical professional...sorry...a professional bike mechanic, so take my next words with caution :

Just torque it more - i also had the same problem and torqued it, till it was no problem anymore. Or chose a different saddle without carbon rails.