Author Topic: Carbonda fm936 Thoughts  (Read 499375 times)

sissypants

Re: Carbonda fm936 Thoughts
« Reply #105 on: January 04, 2020, 07:25:36 AM »
Thanks Medico and numberzero for your insights!

Here's what I just heard from Adam at Carbonda:
-----
Thanks for  your email.
Re. the NS bike rear triangle,we can not offer it for you as it's NS bike's mold.
If you wanna create a similar rear triangle mold,the cost details as bellow:
4000USD for rear triangle
3000USD for the link
 
And batch order price details as bellow:
Super light version:720USD
normal weight version:580USD
-----

I'm definitely not opening a rear triangle at these prices, I know of several places that will do it for under USD2500 total. Neither am I going to buy a super light version, that's just too little weight savings for too much money. T800 carbon isn't that much more expensive than T700 carbon, and the layup complexity is the same (albeit different). For example, other vendors charge +$75 for their T800 vs. T700 models.

I would like to believe NS bikes story, and it defintely sounds the best in terms of their brands' status and capabilities, but I have several doubts:
- Carbonda has full-time engineers that oversee all mold tooling design
- Carbonda subcontracts engineers to corporations to design new frames
- Smaller brands commonly open new rear triangles and linkages to throw on open mold frames, as a elatively cheap way of getting proprietary models

If I could speculate, I would consider it much more likely that NS Bikes pledged X number of sales to Carbonda on terms they opened a mold with Y geometry numbers according to a general aesthetic layout. In the eyes of NS marketing folks, that contribution may consitute "design". Then, because Carbonda was the company actually paying for the mold, they agreed to keep the front triangle proprietary and Carbonda went off on their own to publish it as an in-house option. I'm not just pulling this hypothesis out of the blue, this is the way a lot of agents try to cajole you into opening a new mold with them--you promise X sales, I'll promise mold tooling, and you get some proprietary parts and I get license to some parts.


carbonazza

Re: Carbonda fm936 Thoughts
« Reply #106 on: January 04, 2020, 02:03:29 PM »
...I'm definitely not opening a rear triangle at these prices...

Interesting to know a bit more  on how all this works, thank you for sharing this.
What does "opening a mold" means ? Build it ?

sissypants

Re: Carbonda fm936 Thoughts
« Reply #107 on: January 04, 2020, 03:12:01 PM »
...I'm definitely not opening a rear triangle at these prices...
What does "opening a mold" means ? Build it ?

No, you pay Carbonda in-house engineers to draw up a new rear triangle in CAD, then in the case of Carbonda they would subcontract a CNC machine shop to mill a clamshell mold to the specs in the CAD file. The machined clamshell mold is now stored by Carbonda, but legally licensed to you, and any infringing activity by Carbonda could be pursued in court.

sissypants

Re: Carbonda fm936 Thoughts
« Reply #108 on: January 08, 2020, 09:10:31 AM »
A few folks have reached out to me to see if I could pass on a lower price on this frame. Just order directly from Carbonda please.

I settled on a price with Adam at Carbonda for one-off sales. It's just $30-$50 lower than what they are quoting other people, and just $20-$30 higher than their bulk price. It's surprising to me there is so little room for negotiation in their prices, which are fairly high to begin with. Hopefully that means this is quality stuff.

The frame is in stock and ready to ship, so it should be fairly quick.

Anyone pulling the trigger will want to do so soon, before the Chinese holiday season arrives (that includes shipping time, as shipping is delayed over holidays too).

spec47

Re: Carbonda fm936 Thoughts
« Reply #109 on: January 10, 2020, 10:36:23 AM »
Placed an order for a medium super light last night and they did confirm that it will be shipped out before the holidays, but we're covered in snow for months anyways. I'm going to swap over all of my parts from my Promance M7007-II. Fox 34 120mm, Light Bicycle 30mm ID wheels, OneUp 150mm dropper, 11-speed XTR shifter, XT mech, e13 9-46t, XTR crankset with Stages power meter, etc. Definitely a bit of a "down-country" build as our local "XC" races often descend EWS stages.

Has anybody found a 165x42.5 with a remote lock-out? Thought about trying that , but it looks like Fox doesn't make one in that size with a remote (retail at least). Reading the reviews, sounds like I'd leave it in the middle setting most of the time thereby negating the advantage of a Factory DPS (over the Performance) as it just adds open mode adjustment.

Leaning toward ordering this: https://www.ebay.com/itm/2018-Fox-Performance-DPS-165-x-42-5-Float-Mtb-Shock-Trunnion-3-Pos-Adjust-/143042612579

ReverendRockRazor

Re: Carbonda fm936 Thoughts
« Reply #110 on: January 10, 2020, 11:08:03 AM »
 I have a 165x45 fox performance for sale $85. It was my back up shock just selling because I need a couple bucks more for my Hero fork.

 I don't know how hard it would be to put a travel spacer in to change it to 42.5 stroke.

 https://rover.ebay.com/rover/0/0/0?mpre=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.ebay.com%2Fulk%2Fitm%2F153791732772

 Also will have a 95% new Hans Dampf 2 29x2.3 addix soft for $35 shipped.

spec47

Re: Carbonda fm936 Thoughts
« Reply #111 on: January 13, 2020, 06:10:51 PM »
Thanks ReverendRockRazor, but I decided just to order the DPS as it's new and the right size.

Can somebody post a link to the upper (non Trunnion side) hardware that I need to mount a Fox shock? Bit confused. Thanks!

ReverendRockRazor

Re: Carbonda fm936 Thoughts
« Reply #112 on: January 13, 2020, 06:29:35 PM »
 Np i sold it anyway. Good luck with your build.

Denis

Re: Carbonda fm936 Thoughts
« Reply #113 on: January 15, 2020, 05:05:00 AM »

Can somebody post a link to the upper (non Trunnion side) hardware that I need to mount a Fox shock? Bit confused. Thanks!
https://www.bike-components.de/de/Fox-Racing-Shox/Aluminium-Einbaubuchsenset-8-mm-5-teilig-p32318/

ride_n

Re: Carbonda fm936 Thoughts
« Reply #114 on: January 15, 2020, 07:03:08 PM »
this was a great read and more than likely my next bike.  is the shock mount kit 22.2mm...?  thx

Medico

Re: Carbonda fm936 Thoughts
« Reply #115 on: January 16, 2020, 11:00:28 AM »
this was a great read and more than likely my next bike.  is the shock mount kit 22.2mm...?  thx

Yes, it is shown earlier in this topic.
Good luck.

Ps rs deluxe is also an option.

Brombras

Re: Carbonda fm936 Thoughts
« Reply #116 on: January 21, 2020, 04:21:23 PM »
This looks like a nice frame, I'm also considering ordering one. I like the slack headtube angle and the design. I am about 190 cm tall and I've been wondering if the XL is too long. It seems to be one size up compared to most other frames. I do not want to sit too stretched out, and I do not have especially long arms for my length. Also a bit worried about the seat tube angle. I guess such a steep angle works better for steep uphill than more flat terrain? I've previously had some issues with knee pain if the seat is too far to the front, so I usually use setback seatposts. Unfortunately there is not that many dropper posts with much setback. If I would mount a 120mm fork and a 165x40 shock that would give me a slacker seat angle. I would like to use the bike for trail riding and some occasional xc- and marathon racing, and would like to have a remote lockout for the rear shock. I am also having difficulties finding one. I have found no 165x42.5 that includes a remote. But I have found one 165x40 that does:
https://www.ebay.com/itm/SR-SUNTOUR-UNAIR-RL-R-Rear-Shock-With-Remote-Control-Blow-off-System-165x40mm/143089253150?hash=item2150c8bb1e:g:keMAAOSwP9Jb9PFo
I have no idea if this is a good shock for this bike or not. Any opinions out there?

Jotegr

Re: Carbonda fm936 Thoughts
« Reply #117 on: January 21, 2020, 04:25:48 PM »
If you haven't ridden a bike with "modern" upright geometry I suggest you do. The steep seat tube angles make reach feel much shorter (effective reach?) so it doesn't offer a direct comparison to older geometry  bikes. If you have a store nearby pedal something around the parking at least if possible. If not, I wouldn't worry too much if you were already happy on a true cross country fit in an XL before.

The downsides of this modern geometry are:

carbonazza

Re: Carbonda fm936 Thoughts
« Reply #118 on: January 22, 2020, 06:45:43 AM »
The downsides of this modern geometry are:... :o

I'm definitely interested to know how your story ends  ;)

Medico

Re: Carbonda fm936 Thoughts
« Reply #119 on: January 22, 2020, 09:15:16 AM »
The downsides of this modern geometry are:... :o

I'm definitely interested to know how your story ends  ;)

I Can answer it:. None!

Seriously... Can't think of any...because of the seattube angle and the long reach, the effective seattube stays the same... Personally I ride more efficient with this frame compared with my old one (canyon nerve) on flat Dutch terrain.

But you have to try it your self.
« Last Edit: January 22, 2020, 12:35:48 PM by Medico »