Author Topic: Seraph Bikes Superlight 836g X68 - Alternative to SL8 Fakes?  (Read 100003 times)

neobiker

Re: Seraph Bikes Superlight 836g X68 - Alternative to SL8 Fakes?
« Reply #480 on: March 27, 2025, 12:26:57 PM »
You are far too kind and generous @glepore thank you!

I'm still reviewing TanTan's latest gravel frame so I don't wanna ruin my good graces with them until all the video content has been fulfilled. Also I suspect they wouldn't be keen on sending the X68 for reviews since they don't really wanna be promoting clones in public's eye. The X38 Scott Foil clone I paid for myself.

TanTan would most likely want me to commit financially to the X68. I'll see if I can negotiate haha. It's 2 month turnaround anyway.

I guess you should do more penetration test to make content :)

Serge_K

Re: Seraph Bikes Superlight 836g X68 - Alternative to SL8 Fakes?
« Reply #481 on: March 27, 2025, 03:38:26 PM »
I'll just toss out there that I think the margins are narrowing. EPS, the sharing of knowledge etc. have made things closer. The VAM clones by all reports are pretty much indistinguishable from the real thing. I suspect the X68 is closer to an SL bike than the x38 is to a Foil. Time will tell.

Its not impossible, even with the price difference.

+1 on that. The layup know-how is with the factories, not the brands, at this point, i'm pretty sure. Westerners don't like going to and spending time in China. Some brands will do in house prototypes, you'd have to trust that the factory would replicate the layup - i'd question that. Most brands don't do any layup, they ask the factory to get the frame to be that stiff in that area, to weigh that much, and voila. I'm convinced that if you're not on the factory floor, you don't know your product. Especially in China.

People locally talk, they learn, they switch companies, they start their own thing, they moonlight. Techniques are getting better, know-how is getting better, and know-how is spreading.

On price, i heard that the factory that makes frames for Factor charges Factor less than $500 per frame...

Now, can you buy a fake SL8 and get something indistinguishable? No idea. But we're not talking rocket ships. And with tyres getting bigger, all this air will mute a lot of differences. And even if back to back, you may be able to tell the difference, ride whichever frame 5x and you'll probably forget how the other one felt. For probably 90% of riders (the last 10% would be racers, sprinters and the likes).
Fast on the flat. And nowhere else.

Tom77

Re: Seraph Bikes Superlight 836g X68 - Alternative to SL8 Fakes?
« Reply #482 on: March 28, 2025, 06:07:51 AM »
And keeping in mind: OEM SL8 is around 700g, the X68 araing 840g, means 20% more material to cover up non-optimal layup pattern ... saving 4k on a frame

Sander2177

Re: Seraph Bikes Superlight 836g X68 - Alternative to SL8 Fakes?
« Reply #483 on: March 28, 2025, 06:25:03 AM »
And keeping in mind: OEM SL8 is around 700g, the X68 araing 840g, means 20% more material to cover up non-optimal layup pattern ... saving 4k on a frame

That's the same pretty much as the Pro Model. i think your looking at 850-900g for a 54cm
My genuine SL8 54CM IS 700g
That's acceptable and well light compared wit some of the OEM open mould generally around 1000g
SL8 Custom Green Over Naked Carbon 54CM 6.11kgs RhinosWorkShop Build
2nd Bike in planning not sure what yet!

LowPaceKingdom

Re: Seraph Bikes Superlight 836g X68 - Alternative to SL8 Fakes?
« Reply #484 on: March 28, 2025, 07:38:34 AM »

On price, i heard that the factory that makes frames for Factor charges Factor less than $500 per frame...


+1 Here too

Price ≠ Quality – Hard Facts on Building Blocks, Smartphones, Carbon Bikes & Cars
Many people assume: High price = high quality, low price = cheap junk. But that’s not necessarily true. Quality means meeting requirements – and these are set individually by each customer. Additionally, there are standards like ISO norms.

A clear example: Building Blocks. LEGO, the European Danish brand, charges high prices. But if you compare their products to Chinese competitors like Pantasy or Panlos or  Funwhole , you might be shocked.

Facts:
✔️ Chinese brands offer products at half the price – with better quality!
✔️ No scratches on the bricks
✔️ Less color variation
✔️ Printed parts instead of cheap stickers
✔️ Higher-quality prints (LEGO prints only once, causing colors to shine through)

LEGO cuts costs everywhere – and it shows. Price is not a guarantee for quality or "good" Product.

The same applies to smartphones.
What do you think an iPhone costs to produce? Just a few hundred euros – but it sells for five times that amount! Here, you’re not paying for quality but for branding, marketing, and profit margins.

And it’s no different with carbon bikes.
According to my research, a carbon frame costs around €300–600 to manufacture. Important: This refers to production costs, not the retail price or sales price! Yet, these bikes are sold for thousands in stores.

Even cars follow this pattern.
Take the Xiaomi SU7 Max: In China, it costs around €38,000, but in Germany, the price jumps to €70,000! This massive markup isn’t about quality – it’s about import taxes, branding, and extra costs.
« Last Edit: March 28, 2025, 08:14:54 AM by LowPaceKingdom »

patliean1

Re: Seraph Bikes Superlight 836g X68 - Alternative to SL8 Fakes?
« Reply #485 on: March 28, 2025, 08:58:47 AM »
I will be keen on hearing more ride impressions from the folks in here. Seems like specifically the X68 should be very close to the actual SL8. Only time will tell...

glepore

Re: Seraph Bikes Superlight 836g X68 - Alternative to SL8 Fakes?
« Reply #486 on: March 28, 2025, 11:37:20 AM »
As far as I can tell from this thread, only you and Sander have genuine sl8's-the ride impressions from the rest of us are likely meaningless.

FWIW, I'm only 165 cm and 60 kg with an old guy's ftp to match, so my ride impressions will be skewed. Unless the bike is a complete noodle or rides like a 2x4 I'll likely think its ok. My other bikes are high end mixed materials or ti and can't really serve as data points. Closest thing to an actual sl series that I've owned was an older SS Evo.

Davidhe23

Re: Seraph Bikes Superlight 836g X68 - Alternative to SL8 Fakes?
« Reply #487 on: March 28, 2025, 12:04:24 PM »
Well, after the first 100km on the bike I can confirm that it is very rigid. Having used a Velobuild 268 about 5000km last year. This Tantan X68 shows from the outset the differences in driving.
I won't go into details of whether it's easier to maintain high speed at less watts, but I've been able to see that in strong sprints at 900 watts 268 It was more flexible than this bike

tiz92

Re: Seraph Bikes Superlight 836g X68 - Alternative to SL8 Fakes?
« Reply #488 on: March 28, 2025, 01:04:16 PM »
I can compare it at least to my SL7 on which I have 120.000 km :D

Btw so can someone confirm me that it is compatible with front 140 mm disc rotors?

Serge_K

Re: Seraph Bikes Superlight 836g X68 - Alternative to SL8 Fakes?
« Reply #489 on: March 28, 2025, 03:56:47 PM »
I can compare it at least to my SL7 on which I have 120.000 km :D

Btw so can someone confirm me that it is compatible with front 140 mm disc rotors?

Will be very curious to hear your thoughts on how the 2 frames compare, given you're pushing equipment in ways that 90+% of the users on this forum dont.
Fast on the flat. And nowhere else.

patliean1

Re: Seraph Bikes Superlight 836g X68 - Alternative to SL8 Fakes?
« Reply #490 on: March 28, 2025, 05:02:30 PM »
Yeah so a local racer here just contacted me telling he ordered an X68 in the same size I ride, size 56.

He said once the frame is in his hands and built, he's happy to let me demo it. The lord giveth...

This is his order:
https://www.instagram.com/p/DHlFrh1PBn_/

glepore

Re: Seraph Bikes Superlight 836g X68 - Alternative to SL8 Fakes?
« Reply #491 on: March 28, 2025, 07:26:29 PM »
Sweet color, don't drop it.
I just saved a hundred bucks! Want some tequila?

patliean1

Re: Seraph Bikes Superlight 836g X68 - Alternative to SL8 Fakes?
« Reply #492 on: March 28, 2025, 07:38:54 PM »
Sweet color, don't drop it.
I just saved a hundred bucks! Want some tequila?

Haha I stopped drinking 16 months ago. Ironically the last drink I had was tequila I think. It sucks tbh. No spirit-free cocktail can replace the taste of a good old fashion...

tiz92

Re: Seraph Bikes Superlight 836g X68 - Alternative to SL8 Fakes?
« Reply #493 on: March 29, 2025, 12:50:48 AM »
Will be very curious to hear your thoughts on how the 2 frames compare, given you're pushing equipment in ways that 90+% of the users on this forum dont.

Yes I ride a lot with yearsly also 400.000m elevation and rac(ed) a lot with a usually around 20h of training per week. Thus I know my Tarmac SL7 very very well. I was also a bit sceptical about the chinese frames. But recently I bought a Carbonda 505 SL as gravel/road bike and i am amazed of how well it rides also compared to my SL7. Thus for only 700 dollars I will give the Seraph a try. I will even stick the same components on it, same wheels, same groupset (found a ultegra 11 speed di2 for cheap from a local Conti riders old second bike), same saddle and most importantly i have also on my SL7 the Roval Rapide cockpit, so I can compare that. I will try to report here.

Still wondering if the 140mm front brake disc will work though.

makl

Re: Seraph Bikes Superlight 836g X68 - Alternative to SL8 Fakes?
« Reply #494 on: March 29, 2025, 03:00:23 AM »
Via e-Mail they confirmed to me, that the frame works with 140/140, and that another adapter is needed for 160. I ordered just 2 weeks ago, so it'll take some time till I can confirm first hand.