My 256SL build

[Arraider]

i appreciate the help.

I am the most reasonable customer Peter will find and he should very well know that. How many here would get the wrong dropout. Talked to them. Got a reply that i had to pay freight cost for the dropout unless i ordered something else, i ordered a lot more stuff, and in the end they made me pay for the dropout, for the freight cost, for everything with a 3USD discount.

Who? seriously? who would accepted this? 

i accepted and end up paying a lot more and customs and another 70km trip to customs. I'm fair and reasonable but do not mistake kindness with stupidity. That i will never accept.

Now you gut to help me because i have no idea what LBS means? i googled it and came up with "local bike shop", is that it? i guess a mechanic form a local bike shop? the irony is that the 1st person to notice the problem has a mechanic from a local bike shop (www.binaclina.com you can even contact him at bina.clinica@gmail.com or facebook. I have no idea if he speaks english). But i will happily do whatever it takes. As soon as i know what a LBS means! You can indicate one near me i don't mind. Whatever it takes.

The fault is so absolutely obvious that i will be out of there in 2 seconds. You guys can not imagine how many persons look at this and we all saw the same thing no quality control but i do not want to go there.... so i got no problem with that.

 

[MTB2223]

LBS = Local Bike Store.

Please, ask the mechanic to write it down (on their paper with company logo if possible) to make it official, make a photo and send it to Bert/Peter. And wait for further instruction.
The time is all takes is one of the down side dealing with China and what I understand from you, your country (Portugal).

Please keep us informed. It's good to know if it finally solved correctly.

[davidd]

Hi Arraider,

Sorry about your predicament.

Can you find a bike shop nearby that has a post-mount disk brake facing tool?  Without actually interfering with the bike it should be able to indicate whether the face of the mounts are "wrong" or not.

It seems to me that if the mount "surfaces" were truly perpendicular to the rotor, even if the bolt thread were slightly out of alignment, the whole brake would pull itself into position as the bolts were tightened.  It may just be that the tabs need facing?

I think you really need a seriously good mechanic to have a look and IME, they are few and far between.

If it is accepted as a warranty issue suggest cutting out the offending part of the rear triangle - cheaper to post, may solve customs their end, reassures them that you're not "scamming" a frame .  This was acceptable in some non-china warranty issues I knew of.

Hope you get sorted.

[Arraider]

david, i have a few things to say:

1) i'm 100% sure it is a manufacturing problem and poor quality control

2) even so, i'm ready to be subjected to whatever test xmiplay wants me to do

3) i went to 4 forums on the internet to discuss this looking for solutions to solve it, i did not wanted to sent or receive no frame.

4) i went to 2 different LBS

5) specifically to the problem. The mount is not leved, when the bottom face of the caliper encounters the mount the calipers starts to tilt to the inside of the bike. This is clear at the naked eye. The place where the screw enters inside the mount is tilted bad. I already put a photo. When you mount the caliper the unleveled mount twists the caliper. But even if i sand the caliper the crooked screw pushes the caliper inside. Physics. Any solution with washers or adapters raises the caliper and increases the problem as the higher the caliper the closer the angle between screw and rotor and the worse the problem gets.

6) Of course this not something that does not have a solution. I could fill the hole with qbold, epoxi, liquid aluminnium, and make a new one. But this requires money, precision (make a new hole that's parallel it's difficult, so difficult xmiplay that does it every day screw it up). a good mechanic. Tools. I have none of this. NONE.

7) I had no idea what i was talking on 6) a week ago, i inquired, i asked, i lost hours on end to figure this out

8 ) If China have crazy customs mine are not any good. Last time i made five 70kms trips do customs to get the frame. China is a poor country, so is mine. For me what i payed is a lot, don't judge me for or standards. My country's wages are nothing like yours.

9) If i do not send the frame for China. When i receive the new frame i must pay taxes, customs, and wait more than a month, because it's a new import for them. I DO NOT WANT THIS.

10) i want to sent the frame to China. i repeat: i want to sent the frame to China. I do not want 2 frames.

11) now we can see who is in good faith here and who's not.

12) This is XMIPLAY's 2ND MISTAKE

13) I specifically asked for a 142 frame. He sent 135 dropouts. But did he sent the dropout to me that i had already paid. Read about it again (i have emails that prove all this):

I am the most reasonable customer Peter will find and he should very well know that. How many here would get the wrong dropout. Talked to them. Got a reply that i had to pay freight cost for the dropout unless i ordered something else, i ordered a lot more stuff, and in the end they made me pay for the dropout, for the freight cost, for everything with a 3USD discount.
THIS COSTED ME MORE THEN THE 82.25 EUROS THAT IT COSTS ME TO SENT THE FRAME TO CHINA, ALL BECAUSE XMIPLAY DID CRAP.

14) the bike is mounted, i have to loose the hidraulic brake (20 euros), the helicopter tape (10 euros), the assembly i payed at a shop, i do not have some tools (35 euros). I have to go to customs again (toll and diesel , i don't know but something like 50 Euros



do the math...

i both a frame, have no frame.

xmiplay made 2 mistakes, so far payed for none, i payed for one already (about 80 euros), xmiplay payed ZERO EUROS

xmiplay wants me to pay more 82.25 euros for the 2nd mistake


i don't know if this is a problem with my english or a nationality clash, but this is unfair, unreasonable, stupid, i should already have this settled. i have no problem with mistakes, i have with people who do not face them. I get even more upset when i read that to others when theres mistakes xmiplay gets them discounts and to me i get the middle finger.

You guys wanna help write to xmiplay at peter@xmiplay.cn and ask i'm to do the right thing, pressure him. 

This is so insane at the point that xmiplay does not even understand that paypal will get them and probably loose more than to settle with me.

Xmiplay could offer me a amount in cash so i could repair it, xmiplay could the 1st time sent the dropout free of charges and now i would probably face this all thing in a different light

It's hard to get sympathetic to the argument that they have to pay chinese customs and all that crap, when the 1st mistake they had none of that and made me pay for the fricking dropout twice, freight cost i did not had to pay in the 1st place and more customs i did not had to pay in the 1st place... and i even bought more stuff because he asked.... insane

SEE MY POINT.

[davidd]

Arraraider,

I think you misunderstand me.  I am completely behind you and agree with everything you say.  IMO the only satisfactory solution is a new frame, all costs covered but how likely is that?

If that doesn't happen then how can you move forward and get on your bike with minimum further expense?

You talk of "sanding the posts" - this is what a facing tool is designed to do.  It shaves the surface of the post so it is parallel to the axle.  We are talking single mms so washers beneath the caliper are unnecessary.  Even if the bolt is "crooked" the caliper should still end up parallel to the faced post and centered on the post.  This does appear to be in the correct position and anyway there is already allowances built into the caliper holes to allow for slight deviations.

Have either of the bike shops even mentioned a facing tool to you?

Regarding my income; well unfortunately my great government also sent us down the road of an IMF bailout so it may not be as substantial as you think.  If it was, you probably wouldn't find me on this forum.

I really hope the company steps up to the plate for you.

david

[MTB2223]

IMO the only satisfactory solution is a new frame, all costs covered but how likely is that?

And this is exactly what Peter of Xmiplay offered in case of a warranty-issue. And it is a warranty-issue as what Arraider said.

So, don't what any longer, fix that small report of the LBS, send it to Peter and wait!

[carbonazza]

My rear caliper was too high on the disc. About 1.5mm off.
This caused an odd pad wear.
Some others have reported the same problem.

One day I felt brave(or stupid) enough to take a file and shave some mm from the posts.
I didn't go well initially, making the caliper tilt quite badly, like in your case.

But then after some trials and errors, and sweat, I got it back parallel to the disc.

All this to say that I think it is still possible to get your rear brake right.
And if you find an LBS with the DT-4.2 Parktool, it is even better.
The tilted screw can be managed with a conic washer on top, the face is what matters.

I understand how frustrating it can be if iplay doesn't honor their warranty, and make you pay more than you planned.
But if at some point there is no hope for an easy and free return or compensation.
You may consider this as a plan B.

[Sitar_Ned]

I just wanted to jump in and say that I've seen the communications from Peter about this matter, and it seems to me that they will honor your warranty to the full extent. I understand (I'm sure we all do) your frustrations, but it is understandable that they want more than your word that it wasn't your fault. Most businesses won't take your word for it in a situation like this.

Either way, this sucks for you and you'll be out some extra $$$ and some time wasted not being able to ride.. and I def feel for ya (I would've been super disappointed) but like I said, from Peter's words.. They're going to take care of you.

[Sitar_Ned]

Here.. In peter's own words so there is no confusion.. Peter is the darker blue and MTB2223 the lighter blue:



(MTB - hope you don't mind me posting this, I thought it would help reassure Arraider and anybody else reading to hear it straight from Peter - If you do, feel free to delete it)

[Arraider]

i said all i had to say at this point. Just wanna thank you guys that helped and those you took time to comment.

trying my best to get the LBS report, maybe today.

[Arraider]

Mythbusters i guess... 

Disclaimer: i am a lossy photographer  No photoshop tricks were used as i don't even know how to if i wanted to.

the screw mounted and not parallel to the rotor.


maybe the wheel is not centered? It's centered.


maybe the dropouts are crooked. I have two sets as Xmiplay knows. I tried them both

maybe it's the axle. This theory i cannot even understand. But it's Xmiplay also. But no it's fine.


i cannot see anything wrong with them and they are properly tightened and fastened... photos.

[Arraider]

now some tests

Disclaimer: i went and got some ruler set for this. Chinese to make it cheaper- 32 cents, really good quality 

[Arraider]

[Arraider]

maybe someone forced the srews at an angle. No they didn't.

tried to photograph the thread... crazy i know  ... no conclusion, just some bad photo


the screws, shimano, not twisted i guess. I used 4, this are 2 of them, used on this test because their are larger than the 160mm rotor ones.


so i made a video, screw bolted, no play.

[Arraider]

i never really got the conic washer thing as i never liked or used avid brakes...

bu i got them, and an adaptor for 180, and a 180 rotor, and normal washers...


don't mind if the washers are not at the right angle, just to show that the top washer tilted rubbed the rotor, the space is non existent. This with a completely even rotor, if the rotor got some angle later in the mountains things got even worst.

But besides that i don't know if the angle is to big or i'm just not really skilled at this art, but i could never got it parallel (mind you the mounts are also crooked, i could of course try both washers and sanding the mounts, but i really hesitate on sanding the frame then it does not work and when i complain to xmiplay they say i voided the warranty)

The solution (for me) as i don't even use 180 rotor but 160 and don't want adapters or larger rotors, was to both sand the mount and reconstruct the thread inside the mount. 1st part is easy, 2nd not so much because you have to create a parallel thread and that's not easy and the margin for error is not great and the space to work is cramped because of the closed space your working on. And if it goes wrong it's on me.

I have a plan B, i just don't think i should need it 




Now you guys tell me is there even a shadow of a doubt?