Chinertown
Chinese Carbon Road Bikes => Road Bike Frames, Wheels & Components => Topic started by: bsharp77 on March 12, 2026, 09:12:12 AM
-
Interesting new bike from Avenger.
Looks aero, light-ish (quoted 964g for 52cm frame), but the handlebar options are very interesting.
Supports a standard handlebar with a dedicated spacer kit, but also fits a really good looking Y type handlebar, with integrated aero extensions which is what really caught my attention - perfect for fast solo riding, and would make a heck of a fast ultra endurance bike.
(https://i.ibb.co/xq1YmXzb/Screenshot-2026-03-12-at-14-05-41.png)
Full details here:
https://avengerbikes.com/collections/carbon-road-bike/products/avenger-full-carbon-fiber-aero-road-frameset-r8rs
-
But that price point…
-
$1669 including the fancy bars and the aero extensions and adapters
$1399 including standard type road handlebar only
Not the worst pricing I reckon.
Im pinning all hopes on Peters new aero frame, but its always great to have choice, and this one looks great.
I wish more companies would introduce integrated aero bar options.
-
This is almost very nice. Geometry sucks, leading edge on the stem is very flat and the head tube nose radius is way too small, other than that it's almost reminiscent of some stuff I'm working on
-
But that price point…
Same price with XMCS, Quick Pro, Evolve etc. Fair price.
-
Same price with XMCS, Quick Pro, Evolve etc. Fair price.
Well, yes and no. Avenger functions as HongFu's D2C retail layer targeted at Western markets.
Historically, Avenger frames and their raw HongFu equivalents shared a $700 price point, while baseline open-mold frames hovered around $500.
The newer Avenger platforms (excluding those distributed via DengFu) all exceed $1000. Without documented engineering improvements, the markup primarily funds a Westernized brand identity and increased marketing overhead.
This pricing shift is frustrating, but it aligns with current Tier-2 D2C market norms
-
I'm starting to get aero bike fatigue. Of course this isn't the fault of any particular brand. But it is reminiscent of the one-bike-to-rule-them-all Tarmac SL7 trends of 2020-2023. Everyone is trying to gain marketshare. I get it.
My current numbness makes me wanna sell everything, buy the latest Giant Propel, and call it day.
-
I have the same issue with these brands. You are in the discounted end of the year range for Scott, time and other big name, and the resale value won’t be comparable. I personally have a hard time making the chiner frame numbers work at these prices. That’s just my opinion and I am not trying to convince anyone ;)
-
I'm starting to get aero bike fatigue. Of course this isn't the fault of any particular brand. But it is reminiscent of the one-bike-to-rule-them-all Tarmac SL7 trends of 2020-2023. Everyone is trying to gain marketshare. I get it.
My current numbness makes me wanna sell everything, buy the latest Giant Propel, and call it day.
I mean, this one has the aerobike cockpit and aero features, but overall the tubing looks more do it all to me. I do like what Velobuild did with their own design, this one looks like someone just threw an S5 handlebar + some extra aero features on the Quickpro AR One.
-
I'm starting to get aero bike fatigue. Of course this isn't the fault of any particular brand. But it is reminiscent of the one-bike-to-rule-them-all Tarmac SL7 trends of 2020-2023. Everyone is trying to gain marketshare. I get it.
My current numbness makes me wanna sell everything, buy the latest Giant Propel, and call it day.
Man, I am with you. I feel like we are in a place where so many brands are going for aesthetic because testing is too hard and they get reviewers and press to recycle a n=1 observation as a universal truth.
For example, this "leading edge isn't aero," or the "less than UCI max deep tubes means they left watts on the table in exchange for weight." Did they? Unless they test it themselves or quote the designer, those are just aesthetic at best, slightly informed, aesthetic-based comments. Even if you take the time to reconstruct the profile and run CFD, you are still limited by the assumptions you made, rather than by a model informed by actual measurements on a test rig with your bike and a dummy. It becomes a case of bad data in, bad data out. But hey, the bike "holds speed" or is "cross wind stable" for the reviewer, so that's nice.
According to their own presentation, Giant saved a whopping 1.2w on the frame for the new Propel. The rest of it was tires (6.2w), wheels (2.2w), and a narrower bar and resulting positional changes (~8.8w).
With so many of these Chinese-brand bikes, we see pretty upright, old-school (short-reach) geometries and integrated or highly proprietary bars. The Avenger follows that trend, basically becoming an endurance bike with the Y shaped bar.
How many position watts are you giving up vs. what you get back from the frame? Given that people DIYing their aero setups for roadbikes seem to be getting CDAs down from what was world-class a few years ago at 0.26x to 0.22x or even 0.20x, the frame's aero is pretty much irrelevant if you can't get the fit right as you are talking like 30 times or more greater impact from fit vs. one generation of aero bike to the next.
-
I would like to know what is the real stack and reach here when using the riser bars vs normal bars.
Also geometry for me should be more progressive. Steepers ST, longer reach, longer front center, lower BB.
I already have the bike with similar geo to this one, makes no sense to change it for something basically identical just with more aero shape (this doesn't change that much imo, it's marketing).
-
I'm starting to get aero bike fatigue. Of course this isn't the fault of any particular brand. But it is reminiscent of the one-bike-to-rule-them-all Tarmac SL7 trends of 2020-2023. Everyone is trying to gain marketshare. I get it.
My current numbness makes me wanna sell everything, buy the latest Giant Propel, and call it day.
Frame set for Propel 2026 SL can be found for 2000€ in Europe
Just studied the subject but there are 2 red flags for me :
1. Integrated seatpost : what is this shit ??
2. D shaped steerer tube that make almost impossible to use any standard integrated headset
What do you think about this downsides Patrick ?
-
Frame set for Propel 2026 SL can be found for 2000€ in Europe
Just studied the subject but there are 2 red flags for me :
1. Integrated seatpost : what is this shit ??
2. D shaped steerer tube that make almost impossible to use any standard integrated headset
What do you think about this downsides Patrick ?
Could you let me know where you’ve seen a Propel SL for €2000?
At that money it’s a fantastic buy.
-
Could you let me know where you’ve seen a Propel SL for €2000?
At that money it’s a fantastic buy.
https://www.bike24.com/p21017720.html
-
https://www.bike24.com/p21017720.html
Thanks for that.
No UK delivery….probably a good thing to stop me! :-)
For that money, it’s an unbelievable buy.
-
Thanks for that.
No UK delivery….probably a good thing to stop me! :-)
For that money, it’s an unbelievable buy.
Bad news @bsharp77, you can get one from this UK store for exactly the same price. All sizes currently in stock too ;D
https://www.swinnertoncycles.co.uk/products/giant-propel-advanced-pro-ff-frames-2026
-
Bad news @bsharp77, you can get one from this UK store for exactly the same price. All sizes currently in stock too ;D
https://www.swinnertoncycles.co.uk/products/giant-propel-advanced-pro-ff-frames-2026
That’s not the SL thankfully! :-)
It’s £2300ish which is just a bit too much for me.
-
That’s not the SL thankfully! :-)
It’s £2300ish which is just a bit too much for me.
I wonder how to fit standard round integrated cockpit
This might work
https://a.aliexpress.com/_EIXtYP6
-
That’s not the SL thankfully! :-)
It’s £2300ish which is just a bit too much for me.
Ah, beg your pardon :)
-
not gonna lie, I love this. I had an Avenger/Hongfu FM109/TM6 before and the build quality was impeccable. I really enjoyed that bike but didn't have room for a TT bike and a Road bike. This could solve both purposes. The geometry is almost identical to my 3T strada, which I adore. Not sure how fit would be- reach and stack are the same but head tube is way different and the short headtube/riser stem thing is hard to measure. I think it'll be pretty similar- the stem has a 71mm rise and the headtube is measured at 132mm.
From a practical standpoint, you get 34mm tire clearance, a pretty normal bike otherwise, and the aero extension add-ons. Plus you can convert to normal (apparently) if you want to run a normal stem or handlebars (looks like it might need a new fork, I guess). Weight seems comparable to other offerings, and I'm not sure an aero frame makes that much of a difference over a normal frame (1.2w?) that I'd worry about getting the very best aero or one that is simply competitive in the space. Price seems comparable too; a winspace Agile is $1330 with the bars, this one is 1400 with bars....though Hongfu charged me shipping as a separate item in the past.
Not sure I'll scoop one up, but I'll keep my eye out.
-
not gonna lie, I love this. I had an Avenger/Hongfu FM109/TM6 before and the build quality was impeccable. I really enjoyed that bike but didn't have room for a TT bike and a Road bike. This could solve both purposes. The geometry is almost identical to my 3T strada, which I adore. Not sure how fit would be- reach and stack are the same but head tube is way different and the short headtube/riser stem thing is hard to measure. I think it'll be pretty similar- the stem has a 71mm rise and the headtube is measured at 132mm.
From a practical standpoint, you get 34mm tire clearance, a pretty normal bike otherwise, and the aero extension add-ons. Plus you can convert to normal (apparently) if you want to run a normal stem or handlebars (looks like it might need a new fork, I guess). Weight seems comparable to other offerings, and I'm not sure an aero frame makes that much of a difference over a normal frame (1.2w?) that I'd worry about getting the very best aero or one that is simply competitive in the space. Price seems comparable too; a winspace Agile is $1330 with the bars, this one is 1400 with bars....though Hongfu charged me shipping as a separate item in the past.
Not sure I'll scoop one up, but I'll keep my eye out.
The product page on their website shows a special headset converter / spacer that they seem to use to changed from the Y type cockpit to a standard setup.
-
Well, yes and no. Avenger functions as HongFu's D2C retail layer targeted at Western markets.
Historically, Avenger frames and their raw HongFu equivalents shared a $700 price point, while baseline open-mold frames hovered around $500.
The newer Avenger platforms (excluding those distributed via DengFu) all exceed $1000. Without documented engineering improvements, the markup primarily funds a Westernized brand identity and increased marketing overhead.
This pricing shift is frustrating, but it aligns with current Tier-2 D2C market norms
Well, it seems all chinese manufacturers increased prices dramatically....tt frames for 1500 USD, this frame for 1500 USD? does not make sense at all.....
-
Thanks for that.
No UK delivery….probably a good thing to stop me! :-)
For that money, it’s an unbelievable buy.
That’s the PREVIOUS GEN tho, it’s advertised as 2026 but it’s NOT…! If you compare with the new version, which has LOWER SEATSTAYS you notice the difference. And the new one is still 3700-3800€
So they’re just discounting the previous model :P
-
That’s the PREVIOUS GEN tho, it’s advertised as 2026 but it’s NOT…! If you compare with the new version, which has LOWER SEATSTAYS you notice the difference. And the new one is still 3700-3800€
So they’re just discounting the previous model :P
got it, but for the price even if it's the last year model, still a bargain
-
got it, but for the price even if it's the last year model, still a bargain
Sure thing since as we all know the new frameset is like 50g lighter and 2-3W faster at best hahaha
Don’t forget that the corresponding Aero handlebars have to be bought… for 400€ minimum so that adds up
-
The product page on their website shows a special headset converter / spacer that they seem to use to changed from the Y type cockpit to a standard setup.
Yeah, but the steerer is cut pretty flush with the Y bar. You'll need an extended steerer tube for a regular stem and that adapter. Might be easier/more straightforward to start with the adapter and upgrade later, if you want the cheaper setup
-
This is almost very nice. Geometry sucks, leading edge on the stem is very flat and the head tube nose radius is way too small, other than that it's almost reminiscent of some stuff I'm working on
Why do you say that the geo sucks? It is basically the exact same as the new Cervelo S5. Tbf I would have liked to see a bit more stack, but it's not too bad as it is now.
I am really interested in this frame, has anybody actually received it?
-
Seat angle too slack for what is supposed to be a race bike. S5 has a similar problem, but at least it has the excuse of having a divergent seat post
-
The frame was packaged and protected very well, and the entire bike is equipped with silver titanium bolts.
According to the frame geometry chart, the handlebar rise is between 70.8 and 82.5mm. However, since the head tube drops by about 30mm, you actually need to subtract 30mm from the stack value. The seatpost has a 5mm setback (sadly, there wasn't a 0mm inline option).
Once assembled, the bike looks great.
-
Looks good!
-
Great looking bike, too much money for me unfortunately
-
The frame was packaged and protected very well, and the entire bike is equipped with silver titanium bolts.
According to the frame geometry chart, the handlebar rise is between 70.8 and 82.5mm. However, since the head tube drops by about 30mm, you actually need to subtract 30mm from the stack value. The seatpost has a 5mm setback (sadly, there wasn't a 0mm inline option).
Once assembled, the bike looks great.
Amazing build, looks really nice.
With how many spacers was the frame shipped? I am planning to run 1 to 2 cm of spacers, but I don't know if it would look fugly or not...
Btw what saddle height are you running and what's the saddle-to-bar drop?
-
Amazing build, looks really nice.
With how many spacers was the frame shipped? I am planning to run 1 to 2 cm of spacers, but I don't know if it would look fugly or not...
Btw what saddle height are you running and what's the saddle-to-bar drop?
My frame is a size 56, with a saddle height (BB-to-saddle) of 76 cm and a 10 cm saddle-to-hood drop.
The bike shipped with one 0.5 cm spacer, and you could probably ask them for more if needed.
I actually saw a build on their official Facebook page that used two 0.5 cm spacers, and it looked not so bad. However, I prefer a completely slammed, flush look from the top tube to the handlebars, so I didn't use any spacers at all.😆
-
What was the wieght for a 56 frame with the aero bar cockpit? (if you know) :)
-
What was the wieght for a 56 frame with the aero bar cockpit? (if you know) :)
My size 56 weighs 7.4 kg, including the pedals and computer mount.
The aerobars weigh 110g, and the other hardware and pads are around 440g.
-
@crwlv888 what is the real tire clearance of the frameset? does it clear 35mm WAM tires? Or maybe even 37?
-
@crwlv888 what is the real tire clearance of the frameset? does it clear 35mm WAM tires? Or maybe even 37?
I'm currently using 30c tires (which measure 31mm in actual width).
Unfortunately, I only have this size on hand, so I won't be able to answer your question. :-\
-
Does anyone knows what is even claimed max tyre clearance for this frame. I was not able to it find anywhere on their website. This max tyre clearance game for frames is pretty frustrating for me. Please bike brands, it is not that hard to put on frame specs what WAM tyre can frame take with what space availible.
-
Does anyone knows what is even claimed max tyre clearance for this frame.
They say 34mm
-
If someone is interested, I still have an 50 USD off code - https://avengerbikes.com/discount/Mariusz-U, that is for R8-RS, for the Shuttle SL I have 100 USD. I'm still very happy user of Shuttle SL, that is after more than one year :)
-
The frame was packaged and protected very well, and the entire bike is equipped with silver titanium bolts.
According to the frame geometry chart, the handlebar rise is between 70.8 and 82.5mm. However, since the head tube drops by about 30mm, you actually need to subtract 30mm from the stack value. The seatpost has a 5mm setback (sadly, there wasn't a 0mm inline option).
Once assembled, the bike looks great.
Love the look of it!
Which groupset did you build it up with? Do you think it is possible to build it with mechanical shifters?
-
Do you think it is possible to build it with mechanical shifters?
Why would you do that :o
-
Why would you do that :o
Cheaper ofc ;D
-
That’s actually a fair point. I’ve asked myself several times whether it would make sense to take the old groupset off my Giant and install it on a new frame, mainly to save some money.
I recently watched this video: https://youtu.be/vfqbX9iOE6k?is=9QvvIdM_cxzmFtK9, where he praises the older mechanical Ultegra groupset for its durability, fast shifting, and overall value for money.
You can also find it on AliExpress for under $700 https://it.aliexpress.com/item/4001174661859.html (https://s.click.aliexpress.com/e/_EGel6BY). At that price, you’re getting a real workhorse, so I think going with a mechanical groupset still makes a lot of sense.
Just my personal opinion, of course.
-
That’s actually a fair point. I’ve asked myself several times whether it would make sense to take the old groupset off my Giant and install it on a new frame, mainly to save some money.
I recently watched this video: https://youtu.be/vfqbX9iOE6k?is=9QvvIdM_cxzmFtK9, where he praises the older mechanical Ultegra groupset for its durability, fast shifting, and overall value for money.
You can also find it on AliExpress for under $700 https://it.aliexpress.com/item/4001174661859.html (https://s.click.aliexpress.com/e/_EGel6BY). At that price, you’re getting a real workhorse, so I think going with a mechanical groupset still makes a lot of sense.
Just my personal opinion, of course.
There is no way I would pay that much money for a mechanical groupset these days. You can easily find used 105 Di2 for $500 or get a brand new 105 Di2 from Ali for nearly that cost of mechanical Ultegra. And the performance between them is VERY noticable. In addition you have zero shift lines to route and then maintain. Nope. Never again mechanical.
-
Makes sense. I got the 105 Di2 on AliExpress for around €700, if I’m not mistaken. Right now it’s a little bit more expensive https://it.aliexpress.com/item/1005007369349694.html (https://s.click.aliexpress.com/e/_c3y1V5Zb)
Of course, during sales you can also find the mechanical one for less, and maybe €100~150 difference for a groupset can matter to some people. I agree with you, I would never go back either, but for some people it can make sense.
-
Love the look of it!
Which groupset did you build it up with? Do you think it is possible to build it with mechanical shifters?
I’m running a 12-speed Ultegra Di2 setup.
The hydraulic hose routing on this bike is pretty straightforward: the hoses exit through small holes on both sides of the stem and enter two small ports on the handlebar.
While routing them is incredibly easy, each port can only fit a single line.
Moreover, there are no routing holes on the frame for mechanical shifting.
Unfortunately, this means the frame is incompatible with mechanical shifting.
-
I found it on a french webshop as well which would give me free shipping and 2-year warranty according to EU law (I am from EU country). I am very tempted! :P
I am a bit surprised that only one person has posted a build with this bike. Has anyone else ordered one?
-
I found it on a french webshop as well which would give me free shipping and 2-year warranty according to EU law (I am from EU country). I am very tempted! :P
I am a bit surprised that only one person has posted a build with this bike. Has anyone else ordered one?
the stack is low AF (the stack they claim is wrong by the height of the bars, which is enormous. You end up with a very very low stack. They dont disclose the tyre clearance which is a huge red flag, apparently it's 34mm? says who, is it true, who knows. Historically these were 500$ frames, until one day they just jacked up the prices. It's like yoeleo. Yoeleo is youtuber catnip. They charge a premium for stuff that should cost 500$.
At the right price, this would have been interesting a year or 2 ago. Now i'm not considering anything that can't clear 35C (not 35mm, mind you).
So, wrong geometry, wrong price, and outdated.
-
the stack is low AF (the stack they claim is wrong by the height of the bars, which is enormous. You end up with a very very low stack. They dont disclose the tyre clearance which is a huge red flag, apparently it's 34mm? says who, is it true, who knows. Historically these were 500$ frames, until one day they just jacked up the prices. It's like yoeleo. Yoeleo is youtuber catnip. They charge a premium for stuff that should cost 500$.
At the right price, this would have been interesting a year or 2 ago. Now i'm not considering anything that can't clear 35C (not 35mm, mind you).
So, wrong geometry, wrong price, and outdated.
Tire clearance from their website (just search 34 and it will show): https://avengerbikes.com/blogs/news/aero-validation-avenger-r8rs-wind-tunnel-performance-report (https://avengerbikes.com/blogs/news/aero-validation-avenger-r8rs-wind-tunnel-performance-report)
So the stack given in their geometry chart is including the handlebar rise?
-
Tire clearance from their website (just search 34 and it will show): https://avengerbikes.com/blogs/news/aero-validation-avenger-r8rs-wind-tunnel-performance-report (https://avengerbikes.com/blogs/news/aero-validation-avenger-r8rs-wind-tunnel-performance-report)
So the stack given in their geometry chart is including the handlebar rise?
In geometry charts, stack is measured to the top of the stem.
However, the upper headset cup actually has about a 30mm drop (on a size 56 frame, though I'm not sure about other sizes).
So, the actual stack for a size 56 frame should be: the stack from the geometry chart - 30mm + handlebar rise.
By the way, I noticed the geometry is very similar to the Cervélo S5.（At least on a size 56, the stack from the geometry chart + 40mm handlebar rise）
-
I think the geometry suits me quite well still. My current road bike, Felt F15 size 58 from 2005, gives me a comfortable position but the frame is too big for me. The reach is slightly shorter (16mm) on the R8RS and the stack is the same as the R8RS (according to geometry chart) but if I include the rise of the bar I will still get a slightly higher position. I think the 120 stem on a size 56 should make for a nice position for me.
I appreciate both of your inputs regarding the geometry.
-
Tire clearance from their website (just search 34 and it will show): https://avengerbikes.com/blogs/news/aero-validation-avenger-r8rs-wind-tunnel-performance-report (https://avengerbikes.com/blogs/news/aero-validation-avenger-r8rs-wind-tunnel-performance-report)
So the stack given in their geometry chart is including the handlebar rise?
Ah, thank you, i looked at the product pages, didn't know about this page. It's a major blunder not to spell out tyre clearance on a product page (suspicious too). So that page says 34C (which is actually good) while someone on this thread said 34mm. The fact that it's not on the product page would mean i'd never order that without a formal response from someone working there, by email.
As to stack, +1 on crwlv888's response. The advertised stack, if their diagram is correct, is off by the height of the stem. Whether it's 30mm, idk. Either way, that's another blunder that would need clearing formally by email.
Messy stuff. Frame geometry and tyre clearance might be the 2 most important aspects of a bike if you want it to fit.
-
Honestly I don't understand that conspiracy theories. How you calculated that 30 mm ? They provided rather clear geometry chart, I added it to the post! However, I also pointed them some time ago, that they had some mistake. Previously for the size 58 they provided 410 mm reach while it's 401 mm. I'm using bike geocalc website for all calculations link - https://www.bikegeocalc.com/#12Avenger+R8RSa0b4c738.90475d270e578.68506f794.05501g1049.20277h340.99523i340j340k1341.855l857m1139.5895n708.53751o1184.13038p958.03145q1217.8362r1321.0362s958.03145t31.8u38v-17.2w0x0y250z40A1B102C0D398.31735E45.16906F165G0H0Z15Falath+EVO+2024a0b4c744.1522d271e574.60949f836.11527g1037.72683h379.23734i340j340k1333.35615l841m1132.9522n700.70902o1175.84345p931.29337q1217.88451r1338.75562s933.75643t31.8u35v10w0.00001x0y250z40A4B120C0D391E45.16905F165G0H0Z (https://www.bikegeocalc.com/#12Avenger+R8RSa0b4c738.90475d270e578.68506f794.05501g1049.20277h340.99523i340j340k1341.855l857m1139.5895n708.53751o1184.13038p958.03145q1217.8362r1321.0362s958.03145t31.8u38v-17.2w0x0y250z40A1B102C0D398.31735E45.16906F165G0H0Z15Falath+EVO+2024a0b4c744.1522d271e574.60949f836.11527g1037.72683h379.23734i340j340k1333.35615l841m1132.9522n700.70902o1175.84345p931.29337q1217.88451r1338.75562s933.75643t31.8u35v10w0.00001x0y250z40A4B120C0D391E45.16905F165G0H0Z)
Despite that, all measurements are rather solid and valid. I'm lucky and happy owner of Shuttle SL, also size 58. All dimensions are the same as they provided for that frameset. I'm very interested in buying that frame, I have to choose a color only. Come on, 34 mm tire clearance is too small ? Want more, just buy a gravel frameset, not the aero weapon, ready to build a TT bike. Some guy is still fighting with me on my instagram, on the post related to my Elves Falath EXP. He stated that 25 mm is enough and very comfortable :D Of course, there are still some maniacs and strange cyclist, that are using 25 mm for bikes, not on a rim brake frame, but 34 mm is quite a lot! I also have some doubts if I calculated that properly, or the data is not correct, but there is no way to check it. Moreover, they provided the calculation for 90 mm steam only. I need 120 mm, so that is also quite different.
-
I assumed the stack would be 565 + 71 = 636mm for a size 56 with a 100 mm stem.
However, once the bike was fully built, I noticed the handlebars felt lower than on my other bikes.
Looking back at the geometry chart, I realized that the stack line actually extends all the way to the top of the stem.
On the other hand, the handlebar rise (Rising height A) is measured from the bottom of the stem.
When I actually measured the height from the bottom to the top of the handlebar, it was about 30mm (or more accurately, somewhere in the 20s, but whatever).
Therefore, the actual stack should be 565 + 71 - 30 = 606mm.
This perfectly explains why the handlebars felt lower than I expected.
The build quality of this bike is excellent, and the design doesn't look like a generic open-mold frame at all.
I really like it and highly recommend it.
That said, they definitely have room for improvement when it comes to the labeling on their geometry charts and the handlebar data.
(They initially told me that the rise was a uniform 71 mm across all handlebars regardless of stem length, but that clearly isn't the case.)
Honestly I don't understand that conspiracy theories. How you calculated that 30 mm ? They provided rather clear geometry chart, I added it to the post! However, I also pointed them some time ago, that they had some mistake. Previously for the size 58 they provided 410 mm reach while it's 401 mm. I'm using bike geocalc website for all calculations link - https://www.bikegeocalc.com/#12Avenger+R8RSa0b4c738.90475d270e578.68506f794.05501g1049.20277h340.99523i340j340k1341.855l857m1139.5895n708.53751o1184.13038p958.03145q1217.8362r1321.0362s958.03145t31.8u38v-17.2w0x0y250z40A1B102C0D398.31735E45.16906F165G0H0Z15Falath+EVO+2024a0b4c744.1522d271e574.60949f836.11527g1037.72683h379.23734i340j340k1333.35615l841m1132.9522n700.70902o1175.84345p931.29337q1217.88451r1338.75562s933.75643t31.8u35v10w0.00001x0y250z40A4B120C0D391E45.16905F165G0H0Z (https://www.bikegeocalc.com/#12Avenger+R8RSa0b4c738.90475d270e578.68506f794.05501g1049.20277h340.99523i340j340k1341.855l857m1139.5895n708.53751o1184.13038p958.03145q1217.8362r1321.0362s958.03145t31.8u38v-17.2w0x0y250z40A1B102C0D398.31735E45.16906F165G0H0Z15Falath+EVO+2024a0b4c744.1522d271e574.60949f836.11527g1037.72683h379.23734i340j340k1333.35615l841m1132.9522n700.70902o1175.84345p931.29337q1217.88451r1338.75562s933.75643t31.8u35v10w0.00001x0y250z40A4B120C0D391E45.16905F165G0H0Z)
Despite that, all measurements are rather solid and valid. I'm lucky and happy owner of Shuttle SL, also size 58. All dimensions are the same as they provided for that frameset. I'm very interested in buying that frame, I have to choose a color only. Come on, 34 mm tire clearance is too small ? Want more, just buy a gravel frameset, not the aero weapon, ready to build a TT bike. Some guy is still fighting with me on my instagram, on the post related to my Elves Falath EXP. He stated that 25 mm is enough and very comfortable :D Of course, there are still some maniacs and strange cyclist, that are using 25 mm for bikes, not on a rim brake frame, but 34 mm is quite a lot! I also have some doubts if I calculated that properly, or the data is not correct, but there is no way to check it. Moreover, they provided the calculation for 90 mm steam only. I need 120 mm, so that is also quite different.
-
I checked your data, you attached the screenshot. I see 49 mm, above the stack, so why not 565+49=614 mm of total stack on the handlebar? I would suggest to measure your handlebar height from the bottom, from the ground, on both bikes, maybe that will help? I still working on the length, so that also could help me. I have Falath EXP and it's too low for me, I would need some extra 1-2 cm. So I decided to sell it, and go for R8_RS.
-
I checked your data, you attached the screenshot. I see 49 mm, above the stack, so why not 565+49=614 mm of total stack on the handlebar? I would suggest to measure your handlebar height from the bottom, from the ground, on both bikes, maybe that will help? I still working on the length, so that also could help me. I have Falath EXP and it's too low for me, I would need some extra 1-2 cm. So I decided to sell it, and go for R8_RS.
I took some measurements, and the height from the ground to the handlebars is about 885mm, while the ground to the center of the bottom bracket is about 278mm.
That puts the stack at 885 - 278 = 607mm, which is pretty close to what I originally estimated.
Plus, you can add spacers to this bike.
If it feels a bit too low, throwing on a 5 to 10 mm spacer shouldn't ruin the aesthetics at all.
I did notice the '49' in the geometry chart, but the problem is that handlebar rise varies across the board. So, what stem length would actually give you an equivalent reach of 49?
Then again, none of this really matters all that much to me.
I don't race, and I don't need to chase the 'perfect' fit.
Plus, I rotate between nine different bikes, and every single one of them has a slightly different setup.
A higher position feels a bit more comfortable, while a lower one feels more aggressive — to me, that's just part of each bike's unique character.
Since I'm not a bike shop or a manufacturer, having the exact, meticulous data isn't a dealbreaker for my riding.
But I just feel that since they went through the trouble of designing a great bike — and it's not exactly in the budget price range either — the least they could do is get the basic geometry chart and data right.
Consumers shouldn't have to sit around doing the guesswork and math ourselves. :D
-
That is 100% true! But one question, what is the height to the handlebar for your let say "fitted" and comfortable bike ?
-
I took some measurements, and the height from the ground to the handlebars is about 885mm, while the ground to the center of the bottom bracket is about 278mm.
That puts the stack at 885 - 278 = 607mm, which is pretty close to what I originally estimated.
Plus, you can add spacers to this bike.
If it feels a bit too low, throwing on a 5 to 10 mm spacer shouldn't ruin the aesthetics at all.
I did notice the '49' in the geometry chart, but the problem is that handlebar rise varies across the board. So, what stem length would actually give you an equivalent reach of 49?
Then again, none of this really matters all that much to me.
I don't race, and I don't need to chase the 'perfect' fit.
Plus, I rotate between nine different bikes, and every single one of them has a slightly different setup.
A higher position feels a bit more comfortable, while a lower one feels more aggressive — to me, that's just part of each bike's unique character.
Since I'm not a bike shop or a manufacturer, having the exact, meticulous data isn't a dealbreaker for my riding.
But I just feel that since they went through the trouble of designing a great bike — and it's not exactly in the budget price range either — the least they could do is get the basic geometry chart and data right.
Consumers shouldn't have to sit around doing the guesswork and math ourselves. :D
Hi there—congratulations on the bike!
Regarding the stack measured at the top of the handlebar, I’d say that figure is also listed in the geometry chart (size 56 > 614mm >> 565mm + 49mm).
Since you’re in the mood for taking measurements, could I ask for a couple of numbers?
1) What is the distance from the underside of the saddle rails to the top of the top tube (see the red arrow in the photo)?
2) The saddle height in the photo you posted is 760mm... could I ask you to measure from the floor to the top of the saddle?
Thanks.
-
I recently bought a Cycplus T7, and it makes adjusting the settings incredibly easy.
I've realized that I have a pretty low tolerance when it comes to reach; even a tiny +-10mm variance makes a noticeable difference to me.
On the other hand, I can comfortably tolerate a stack anywhere between 600〜650mm, with 620〜630mm being my absolute sweet spot.
That said, comfort is highly dependent on body proportions, fitness levels, and riding distance, so these numbers probably don't mean much to anyone else.
Hi there—congratulations on the bike!
Regarding the stack measured at the top of the handlebar, I’d say that figure is also listed in the geometry chart (size 56 > 614mm >> 565mm + 49mm).
Since you’re in the mood for taking measurements, could I ask for a couple of numbers?
1) What is the distance from the underside of the saddle rails to the top of the top tube (see the red arrow in the photo)?
2) The saddle height in the photo you posted is 760mm... could I ask you to measure from the floor to the top of the saddle?
Thanks.
1. The length of the section highlighted by the red line is 190mm.
2. The distance from the center of the BB along the seat tube to the top of the saddle is 760mm. The vertical height from the ground to the top of the saddle is 1050mm.
Also, the saddle-to-handlebar drop looks a bit extreme in the photo, but that's likely just due to camera lens distortion.
It doesn't look nearly that drastic in reality.
-
I recently bought a Cycplus T7, and it makes adjusting the settings incredibly easy.
I've realized that I have a pretty low tolerance when it comes to reach; even a tiny +-10mm variance makes a noticeable difference to me.
On the other hand, I can comfortably tolerate a stack anywhere between 600〜650mm, with 620〜630mm being my absolute sweet spot.
That said, comfort is highly dependent on body proportions, fitness levels, and riding distance, so these numbers probably don't mean much to anyone else.
1. The length of the section highlighted by the red line is 190mm.
2. The distance from the center of the BB along the seat tube to the top of the saddle is 760mm. The vertical height from the ground to the top of the saddle is 1050mm.
Also, the saddle-to-handlebar drop looks a bit extreme in the photo, but that's likely just due to camera lens distortion.
It doesn't look nearly that drastic in reality.
First of all, thanks for the reply.
However, there is something that doesn't quite add up... the 190mm measurement requested in point 1 seems consistent with the 760mm bottom bracket-to-saddle distance and the 525mm seat tube.
What doesn't make sense, though, is the 1050mm measurement from the floor... did you perhaps mean 1005mm?
If the handlebar height from the floor is 885mm, the saddle-to-handlebar drop would be 165mm, whereas you stated the saddle-to-shifter drop is 100mm... and judging by the photo you posted, it is impossible for the shifters to be 65mm higher than the handlebars.
-
I have saddle height around 818 mm (81.8 cm) on both my bikes (Shuttle and EXP), and I have around 105,0 cm from the ground. Therefore, for sure it should be around 1005 mm so 100,5 cm, or similar? SO what is your shifter height on the photo, from the ground ? Then we have all dimensions 8) I put a photo with the geometry of SL 58 size and RS. Both with 120 mm handlebar. You can see the differences in mm on shifters, for both bikes so 5 mm higher and 5 mm longer (Shuttle SL)
-
First of all, thanks for the reply.
However, there is something that doesn't quite add up... the 190mm measurement requested in point 1 seems consistent with the 760mm bottom bracket-to-saddle distance and the 525mm seat tube.
What doesn't make sense, though, is the 1050mm measurement from the floor... did you perhaps mean 1005mm?
If the handlebar height from the floor is 885mm, the saddle-to-handlebar drop would be 165mm, whereas you stated the saddle-to-shifter drop is 100mm... and judging by the photo you posted, it is impossible for the shifters to be 65mm higher than the handlebars.
Oops, mistyped. It's supposed to be 1005mm, 100.5cm.
-
Frame received a few weeks ago. Built with Dura Ace and Campagnolo Bora Ultra 60 wheelset for a total weight of 7,12 kg. The bike is insanely fast (coming from a 2009 Cube and a 2014 sub-6 kg Focus Izalco Max 0.0). Stack is indeed very low, I almost wanted to ask for more spacers but ended up with just the standard 6x5mm spacers. It's an aero bike after all and that would have been not really nice aesthetically. I actually feel very good on the bike now, quite comfortable. I had some issues with some screws and engaging the thread in the nuts (used a tap to clean the threads). Another issue is that I have to apply a lot of torque on the headset to remove any play (there is enough space between expander and top plate and bearings are not compressed at all). I'm guessing it's because there is a lot of friction between the fork and stem. Headset fine tuning was not easy, but maybe I'm just bad. Really happy with the frame regardless.
-
Frame received a few weeks ago. Built with Dura Ace and Campagnolo Bora Ultra 60 wheelset for a total weight of 7,12 kg. The bike is insanely fast (coming from a 2009 Cube and a 2014 sub-6 kg Focus Izalco Max 0.0). Stack is indeed very low, I almost wanted to ask for more spacers but ended up with just the standard 6x5mm spacers. It's an aero bike after all and that would have been not really nice aesthetically. I actually feel very good on the bike now, quite comfortable. I had some issues with some screws and engaging the thread in the nuts (used a tap to clean the threads). Another issue is that I have to apply a lot of torque on the headset to remove any play (there is enough space between expander and top plate and bearings are not compressed at all). I'm guessing it's because there is a lot of friction between the fork and stem. Headset fine tuning was not easy, but maybe I'm just bad. Really happy with the frame regardless.
The frame came with both a steel bolt kit and a titanium bolt kit.
I suspect the titanium bolts are from S-Parts, a brand commonly used by bike shops in China.
While they aren't cheap, they do seem to suffer from occasional QC/tolerance issues.
The steel bolts thread in perfectly, but some holes felt a bit tight with the included titanium ones.
In particular, the M6 × 15mm bolt for the seatpost wedge clamp wouldn't thread in at all when using the provided titanium bolt.
Switching back to the included steel bolt—or using a titanium one I bought separately—worked flawlessly.
-
Frame received a few weeks ago. Built with Dura Ace and Campagnolo Bora Ultra 60 wheelset for a total weight of 7,12 kg. The bike is insanely fast (coming from a 2009 Cube and a 2014 sub-6 kg Focus Izalco Max 0.0). Stack is indeed very low, I almost wanted to ask for more spacers but ended up with just the standard 6x5mm spacers. It's an aero bike after all and that would have been not really nice aesthetically. I actually feel very good on the bike now, quite comfortable. I had some issues with some screws and engaging the thread in the nuts (used a tap to clean the threads). Another issue is that I have to apply a lot of torque on the headset to remove any play (there is enough space between expander and top plate and bearings are not compressed at all). I'm guessing it's because there is a lot of friction between the fork and stem. Headset fine tuning was not easy, but maybe I'm just bad. Really happy with the frame regardless.
When you have time, could you post a side view of the bike?
Thanks
-
When you have time, could you post a side view of the bike?
Thanks
Here you are.
-
Here you are.
The look is certainly better without spacers, but it doesn't look bad this way either.
If I may offer a suggestion: I would remove one 5mm spacer so that the bottom of the stem aligns with the top tube. ;)
-
could you be so kind and take a photo of computer mount, ans how it's attached to the handlebar? I have seen some photos but without any hole. I wonder how the mount looks like.
-
could you be so kind and take a photo of computer mount, ans how it's attached to the handlebar? I have seen some photos but without any hole. I wonder how the mount looks like.
The computer mount is attached to the handlebar with two bolts, as usual.
-
I have just ordered one, that race edition version. I already have black one, I like colors 8) I choose 120/120 handlebar, I'm 187 cm with 91.5 cm inseam. Frameset is ready, but I need to wait for the handlebar, it's not available at the moment.
-
Does the handlebar consist out of two pieces so V-Stem and then the bar itself or does it just look like it? And if so can the stem be ordered seperately to save some money when trying out a different bike fit?
-
In my opinion no, that is just one element with a place where you can put the rest bar.
-
Does the handlebar consist out of two pieces so V-Stem and then the bar itself or does it just look like it? And if so can the stem be ordered seperately to save some money when trying out a different bike fit?
At page 2 in this thread there is pictures of the frame in the box. There you can see that the handlebar and y-part is two different pieces that mount together. I don't know if the stem can be ordered separately though.
-
I don't know if the stem can be ordered separately though.
yes you can buy the stem alone, it's 80$
-
Nice, I was not aware of it! So that is potentially a good from bike fitting perspective.
-
https://youtu.be/kIyukVx56DE
Would be curious to see a build video, routing hoses through that must be an adventure. Impossible to change the stem without de-cabling everything, btw, so you can't buy 2-3 stems and casually swap them for bike fit.
I also really doubt you can run mechanical shifting + hydro hoses in there.
I'm no engineer, but a stem is big, so it can be thin + strong. This system replaces the stem with 2 narrow tubes, so they need to be thicker.
I wonder about build quality, weight, ease of use, ride quality.
Kudos for innovating though.
-
I saw some post on facebook I believe, with the whole build, I don't remember the exact weight but it was around 6.8 kg. I will try to have as light as possible but without any sacrifices.
-
https://youtu.be/kIyukVx56DE
Would be curious to see a build video, routing hoses through that must be an adventure. Impossible to change the stem without de-cabling everything, btw, so you can't buy 2-3 stems and casually swap them for bike fit.
I also really doubt you can run mechanical shifting + hydro hoses in there.
I'm no engineer, but a stem is big, so it can be thin + strong. This system replaces the stem with 2 narrow tubes, so they need to be thicker.
I wonder about build quality, weight, ease of use, ride quality.
Kudos for innovating though.
I asked about mechanical shifting earlier in this thread and someone confirmed that mechanical would be impossible due to small routing holes in handlebar/stem.
-
Just received my black and gold frameset. Anyone know what is this little screw hole at the headset areafor? Thanks!
-
Fork stop I reckon
-
Just received my black and gold frameset. Anyone know what is this little screw hole at the headset areafor? Thanks!
You can have a look at the page 23 of the SL9 manual (same screw).
-
Hello, is somebody using the ICON handlebar (and not the Y one), on the chart we could see +49mm on the stack height with a 90mm Y stem, I’m searching for this stack value with the ICON handlebar (cf. the photo).
The ICON is light bit lighter and I love his shape. If the rise it quite similar I’m on the fence to choose it…
Any advice?
-
My frameset should arrive tomorrow, I will prepare some unboxing and a lot of photos. Attached you can find the photos I got from Hattie. I'm really looking forward to have it assembled really quickly, and to test and compare with my Shuttle SL.
-
The frame looks interesting and aesthetically pleasing too, but as far as I'm concerned, there's one detail that would really put me off... the brand name Avenger.
Question: has anyone who rides an Avenger frame ever been teased by their riding buddies because of the name (Avenger > superhero)? ;D
-
But why ? Maybe it's not the best name, but why would anyone teased someone faster on better frameset ;) :D ;D Come on, not joking, we are not in the high school anymore. Why would anyone do that ? I'm not teasing other for having canyon or trek, which are crappy made, having issues with BB, with painting, cracking, breaking etc.
I have just got it! On live it looks.....stunning! Quick weighting, I will upload some unboxing. Frame 1158 g, fork 453 g, seatpost all 181 g, handlebar 405 g. I quickly calculated the same elements for Shuttle SL and the difference is 583 g. All for size 58. The idea is to have it around 7.2 kg.
-
Would the new hyper bar from winspace with this frame?
-
Answering your question, I believe yes, but probably you would need to work on spacers. The shape of it is rather unusual. I promised some more photos and data, here you go - some weighting of the frameset. In my opinion it's not bad - https://youtu.be/ULC6ZW79f9w?is=SnlJQ3HM6drWxIO5
Most important information from my side is that definitely the geometry is quite different and someone above noticed that correctly! I don't know if that is really 30 mm, or even more, but it's not correct. I calculated all in the bikegeocalc.com and with only one or even no spacers the stack with the 120 mm stem should be the same as on my Shuttle SL. I assembled the frame with some wheels and seatpost only, to verify it before full assembling of the bike. That was really smart decision and I done some measurements from the floor! With one spacers I was around 4 cm lower than shuttle, only some quick measurements. So I decided to put all spacers and even add one round, they gave me only 3 cm of spacers. After that I hit my assumed and perfect handlebar height, the same as on my shuttle. Then I calculated the height of the saddle and the desired drop/grip drop will be reached. Unfortunately, I got only 6 spacers, so I'm waiting for 2 more from Avenger. Except that, the frameset is really stunning! Painting, how it's made, the set, all is perfect!
-
I'll be interested to have your feedback on headseat adjustment with 8 plastic spacers.
The frame looks interesting and aesthetically pleasing too, but as far as I'm concerned, there's one detail that would really put me off... the brand name Avenger.
Question: has anyone who rides an Avenger frame ever been teased by their riding buddies because of the name (Avenger > superhero)? ;D
Yep. ;D I always say first that I find the brandname shit so they don't tell it. Avenger makes it sound like something toyish/not serious/fragile.
I actually hesitated to buy it because of the name. That's dumb if you have all the characterics/numbers/figures of the frame and it fits all the conditions you want but that's how buyer's psychology works. They really have to improve on marketing. I wouldn't buy a frame with an (according to me) ugly paint or ugly tube form though, even if it's the fastest bike on earth.
-
So here is the finish build. For people wondering, the absolute vertical stack from base of stem to top of handlebar of 120mm Y stem is around 5.5cm
(Compared to 2 cm vertical stack for -9 angle 125mm stem).
Also, the head tube notch is 2.5 cm and i think it is same for all frame size since it is same than the stem clamp area height.
Finally, here is a photo.
Final build 7.3 kg without pedals and bottle cage. Size 56.
Yoeleo 50/60 nxt wheels, wheeltop carbon crankset, wheeltop eds tx.
-
Only thing that refrains me from choosing this frame is that 73 STA on size 540. Other than that, this frame looks amazing
-
Just received my black and gold frameset. Anyone know what is this little screw hole at the headset areafor? Thanks!
How did you get that paintjob ? It looks great!!
-
Thanks! I emailed them what i wanted. Cost a extra 150 Usd.
Piano black gloss and brushed gold decals.
-
Frame received a few weeks ago. Built with Dura Ace and Campagnolo Bora Ultra 60 wheelset for a total weight of 7,12 kg. The bike is insanely fast (coming from a 2009 Cube and a 2014 sub-6 kg Focus Izalco Max 0.0). Stack is indeed very low, I almost wanted to ask for more spacers but ended up with just the standard 6x5mm spacers. It's an aero bike after all and that would have been not really nice aesthetically. I actually feel very good on the bike now, quite comfortable. I had some issues with some screws and engaging the thread in the nuts (used a tap to clean the threads). Another issue is that I have to apply a lot of torque on the headset to remove any play (there is enough space between expander and top plate and bearings are not compressed at all). I'm guessing it's because there is a lot of friction between the fork and stem. Headset fine tuning was not easy, but maybe I'm just bad. Really happy with the frame regardless.
What did you do to solve issue? You overtighten the top cap or the stem bolts? I have same issue. Thanks
-
Okay, so my build is finished. Just quick update from my perspective. I build the bike myself, like the others and previous Avenger Shuttle SL. I'm having Tagoola Pulse 50UL and 1x12 SRAM AXS with Force shifters and the rest is RED. As I will probably use XMCS crank, I bought the tripeak 3 in 1 BB. In general, i had no issues with cables, or with BB or screws, or honestly with any element of the frameset. Assembling was pretty easy and fast, I did all based on the R8-RS user manual. Only one elements is missing in the user manual, the screws and elements that holds the upper bearing or I haven't seen it. The routing with the Y bar was a pleasure and there is only one way of going thru. Those two pieces are very easy to connect. Top cap is pretty funny and with unusual shape. I'm wondering if 4 Nm and enough for handlebar and fixing screws. I will check and verify that on the ride today. I didn't encountered any issue with the headset play. I used 4 Nm for the top cap as adviced. No information what should be the tightening power for the handlebar and stem. Seatpost and clamp the same, no issue, Nm as in the manual. I didn't cut the seatpost. For the axles a used 10 Nm at the moment. I used 4 cm of spacers so 8 of them, not looks very bad, of course without any of them is the best. However, as I mentioned previously, after calculation I have the same level as on my shuttle. For me the comfort is the most important, I will survive how it looks.
I will prepare some reel and post on my instagram of course.
For now the weight is less than 7 kg in size 58, with pedals, bottle cages, garmin and varia mount.
-
Okay, so my build is finished. Just quick update from my perspective. I build the bike myself, like the others and previous Avenger Shuttle SL. I'm having Tagoola Pulse 50UL and 1x12 SRAM AXS with Force shifters and the rest is RED. As I will probably use XMCS crank, I bought the tripeak 3 in 1 BB. In general, i had no issues with cables, or with BB or screws, or honestly with any element of the frameset. Assembling was pretty easy and fast, I did all based on the R8-RS user manual. Only one elements is missing in the user manual, the screws and elements that holds the upper bearing or I haven't seen it. The routing with the Y bar was a pleasure and there is only one way of going thru. Those two pieces are very easy to connect. Top cap is pretty funny and with unusual shape. I'm wondering if 4 Nm and enough for handlebar and fixing screws. I will check and verify that on the ride today. I didn't encountered any issue with the headset play. I used 4 Nm for the top cap as adviced. No information what should be the tightening power for the handlebar and stem. Seatpost and clamp the same, no issue, Nm as in the manual. I didn't cut the seatpost. For the axles a used 10 Nm at the moment. I used 4 cm of spacers so 8 of them, not looks very bad, of course without any of them is the best. However, as I mentioned previously, after calculation I have the same level as on my shuttle. For me the comfort is the most important, I will survive how it looks.
I will prepare some reel and post on my instagram of course.
For now the weight is less than 7 kg in size 58, with pedals, bottle cages, garmin and varia mount.
Hi Marius, did you try the bike? Loose headset happens after a big ride with torque/sprints, did you try that?
-
Yes, I'm after two rides, I did around 90 km for now. I have a race on Sunday so I have tapering, no big watts however I hit around 950 w for a quick and short sprint. I haven't noticed anything unusual. All is stable, tight and no play. Yesterday I did some small adjustments on my saddle and I checked the handlebar and headset, all is good, I checked the torque, I have 4 Nm on those elements, as it is in the manual - I attached it to the post.
-
Very interesting frame, very temptted to get it (I found the french shop, thanks for the tip!).
Unusual but *important* (for me) as I don't like to look for specific bearings (see Giant OD2), which headset bearings are used? Thanks if anyone can get me this info.
-
What did you do to solve issue? You overtighten the top cap or the stem bolts? I have same issue. Thanks
I have answered in the other thread.
-
Very interesting frame, very temptted to get it (I found the french shop, thanks for the tip!).
Unusual but *important* (for me) as I don't like to look for specific bearings (see Giant OD2), which headset bearings are used? Thanks if anyone can get me this info.
I was inquiring about the headset type and got this reply: 51.8*45*36*L8.
EDIT: however In the user manual there is a different figure:
Headset Upper Bearing MR128R 1.5*45*×45* 070R A2
Headset Lower Bearing MR128R 1.5*45*×45* 070R A2
Anyway, I just made an order, with one extra Y stem for 100 usd.
-
I used the standard one, which the Avenger provided in the frameset. I have shuttle sl and even after 15000 km and several rides in the rain and even in snow, no issues or corrosion. Both are still working very smooth. I put a lot of grease in there, in the headset.
About the play, I didn't see any other thread, maybe you could post it also here ? Just for the future.
-
What did you do to solve issue? You overtighten the top cap or the stem bolts? I have same issue. Thanks
https://chinertown.com/index.php/topic,7448.0.html
I didn't know about the torque spec, I didn't receive the manual. When I asked them, they gave me much higher values 8 Nm for the stem (it is written on it but I couldn't figure out whether it was 3 or 8 Nm) and 12 Nm for the expander. Torque spec of the top cap is not really relevant because the torque needed to remove the play is different for every bike. The best torque is as low as possible with no play. The value of 4 Nm they gave is maybe an average value, but certainly not the max torque the screw can withstand.
So at the beginning, I screwed the top cap (probably lower than 4 Nm) enough to have no play in static with the front brake test. After a ride, I had play. I progressively screwed the top cap higher and higher until 8 Nm (max torque I found for this type of screw), it was better but the play came again after a few rides. I tested then 12 Nm (I'm pretty sure the screw can withstand 20 Nm before rupture), again much better. But still not perfect. The play is less and it has taken more time to comeback but I still have a slight play. My guess is that the plastic spacers (I use 6) are creeping with load, they reduce slightly in thickness and thus preload of the headset dissapears. Now I'm thinking of repeating the procedure I mentioned in my second post. Maybe the creeping will reduce over time if the plastic becomes harder. I'll look if the play takes more time to come back. If I don't resolve the issue I'm thinking to modify the spacers : remove material in the middle to put hard carbon spacers and use the original plastic spacers as a "cap" for aero and aesthetics.
In addition to that, I might try carbon paste on the fork/stem to make sure it's not sliding.
I also had 2 thin metal spacers for the headset that are not shown in the manuel. I have put one under the lower plastic spacer and one above the upper one.
-
I'm after 5 rides, and that includes one race. I have no issues with the headset, I did all based on the manual, so as follows, expander 10 Nm, screws and cap bolt 4 Nm. Usually it's around 5 Nm, sometimes it's 6 Nm. I have never seen more than 6 Nm for the carbon handlebar. I checked the values on my two torque wrenches. I attached the screen and my photo of the bike. I used 4 cm of spacers so 8 spacers. Are you sure that you assembled the spacers correctly, and the handlebar is properly connected/inserted. There are some holes and pins. The metal spacer/washer should go on the cable port grommet, it's not in the manual. Lastly, maybe the fork was not cut properly ? There is no space of too much space? Could you provide some photo of the bike and the space between the fork/spacers ?
-
Another little detail question: what's the distance between the 2 holes/screw under the handlebar to install the Garmin/Wahoo mount? 15mm? Are the two holes angled, as it looks from one photo? So, is the provided support similar to this one--> https://it.aliexpress.com/item/1005006088002264.html
Thanks if you can answer
-
I cannot open it, so I don't know. The mount is rather one of a kind, the angle is strange, the holes are angled. I tried to use one I have for the shuttle, and it's different. The mount fits, but the garmin is really angled. Could you please provide a screen. Moreover, someone above put a photo of how it looks.
-
So here is the finish build. For people wondering, the absolute vertical stack from base of stem to top of handlebar of 120mm Y stem is around 5.5cm
(Compared to 2 cm vertical stack for -9 angle 125mm stem).
Also, the head tube notch is 2.5 cm and i think it is same for all frame size since it is same than the stem clamp area height.
Finally, here is a photo.
Final build 7.3 kg without pedals and bottle cage. Size 56.
Yoeleo 50/60 nxt wheels, wheeltop carbon crankset, wheeltop eds tx.
So basically, if the head tube notch is 2.5 cm, the gain in handlebar height compared to a traditional stem on a frame without a head tube notch is 10mm....is that right?
-
On my bike, I calculated all numbers from the ground, it's ~60 mm of extra stack in the 120 mm Y bar. From the ground to the top of the cap is 895 mm, to the top of the handlebar is ~955 mm. The saddle is ~105.2 mm, shifters ~975-980, the same height as Shuttle SL, with 40 mm of spacers and 120 mm handlebar (Avian Canary II). Stack on the charts is for sure badly calculated and presented by Avenger. They marked it as a bottom of a frame, in reality it's rather the top or the top-middle part, where you have spacers, as someone already marked on previous posts.
-
I cannot open it, so I don't know. The mount is rather one of a kind, the angle is strange, the holes are angled. I tried to use one I have for the shuttle, and it's different. The mount fits, but the garmin is really angled. Could you please provide a screen. Moreover, someone above put a photo of how it looks.
This is how this specific model looks. By the way I ordered the frame (6 week waiting time) and in the mean time a T47/68 BB, 2 spare headset bearings and an extra "Garmin" mount, which is either flat for regular inegrated handlebars (which I have on other bikes) or with a small wedge/adapter for Cervelo S5 handlebar < 2025 (angled holes which look very similar to this Avenger).
My "project" is to install full Ultegra on this frame (stripping from another frame which will install Force AXS 1x), new ICAN 40 II and/or Serenade 4550 wave wheels. Being a size S/52 my target would be to finish it around 7/7.2Kg all included :).
-
So basically, if the head tube notch is 2.5 cm, the gain in handlebar height compared to a traditional stem on a frame without a head tube notch is 10mm....is that right?
I am not sure exactly what you mean. I think first, it is easier to just substract 2.5 cm to the geometry chart advertised stack. Stem/handlebar vertical stack is an independant matter regardless of the frame geometry.
So to keep things simple, I separate the frame geometry from the cockpit setup.
A standard stem has a 40 mm clamp height, but with a 125 mm / -9° setup, the downward angle drops the effective rise (measured from the top of the handlebar where your hands rest) so it acts more like a 20 mm stack above the spacers.
The Avenger Y-bar has a lower 25 mm clamp height, but its positive rise pushes the total height up to 55 mm (top of handlebar, where your hands rest).
My Winspace T1550 gen 2(size large) had a 560 mm stack +40 mm spacers + 125 mm stem at -9 (20 mm vertical rise) =620 mm at top of handlebar. Same fit would be Avenger size 56 ( 565 mm stack according to the chart, but in reality it is 540 mm due to the notch) + 25 mm spacers + 120 mm stem(55 mm vertical rise)=620 mm at top of handlebar. Both gives me the same effective stack at top of handlebars. I ignore headtube angle because difference are marginal and it simplifies explanation.
-
Okay, so that is not the final review, but let say the first impressions from 500 km. On the first race after 4 rides I was fifth, and third in my cat. M3, on Gran Fondo Warsaw. In general the bike is really fast, stiff, accelerate amazingly. I have 50 mm wheels Tagoola Pulse 50 UL on it. In my opinion around 1-2 km/h average faster than shuttle. Maybe due to the position, and 380 handlebar, maybe the conditions are different. I'm planning to compare those two, but after my vacation. Now I have 52t on the front, 10-33t on the back, on flats it's like a rocket! The total weight is on the edge of 7 kgs. On 5th of September I will have a mountain race Tatra Road Race, so the plan is to test the new machine. It's rather very demanding so I would be happy if I hit the top 100. Then I will have some full overview of the bike. For now it's 10/10, except the issue with the geometry, for me it's not correct.
-
I am really looking into this frameset but I am stuck on the geomtry.
at 188cm tall I ride a 54s Colnago with 110mm stem and 380mm bar using 2cm of spacers under the bar.
Seat is set at 81cm from bb and the top of the bar at shifters is 93cm from the floor
Here is comparing the two......
at 58cm this one is 10mm longer reach and 10mm taller stack
at 56cm this one is same reach but is 13mm lower stack
I am leaning towards the 56cm frame because of the riser bar..... thoughts?
-
I am really looking into this frameset but I am stuck on the geomtry.
at 188cm tall I ride a 54s Colnago with 110mm stem and 380mm bar using 2cm of spacers under the bar.
Seat is set at 81cm from bb and the top of the bar at shifters is 93cm from the floor
Here is comparing the two......
at 58cm this one is 10mm longer reach and 10mm taller stack
at 56cm this one is same reach but is 13mm lower stack
I am leaning towards the 56cm frame because of the riser bar..... thoughts?
I am 187 cm and ended up ordering size 56. I spent a few days running calculations through Gemini and Claude based on my current bike. I should be able to replicate almost the exact same fit on the size 56 with the 90 mm riser bar/stem.
However, I also ordered the 100 mm stem to start with a slightly longer reach—my current bike has endurance geometry, so I can comfortably handle a bit more stretch. Since I'm 41, having that second 90 mm stem gives me a solid fallback option for the future if I ever need a more relaxed setup.
-
I am 187 cm and ended up ordering size 56. I spent a few days running calculations through Gemini and Claude based on my current bike. I should be able to replicate almost the exact same fit on the size 56 with the 90 mm riser bar/stem.
However, I also ordered the 100 mm stem to start with a slightly longer reach—my current bike has endurance geometry, so I can comfortably handle a bit more stretch. Since I'm 41, having that second 90 mm stem gives me a solid fallback option for the future if I ever need a more relaxed setup.
Whats the other bike? I want to plug in the numbers into calculator to see how that will compare to what I am currently riding. Having said that, I spoke with guys at Avenger and they recommend 58cm frame for because of the stack numbers. I asked to let me know what would be height be from the floor to the top of the bar (shifter hoods) without any spacers. That will for sure help me select the size.
-
Just for input, the black and gold bike on a previous comment in this thread is mine. I am 185 cm, long legs. 80.5 saddle height. I have frame 56 , 2.5 cm spacers, 120 mm stem. In my opinion 90 mm would be very low and very short for my height
-
Whats the other bike? I want to plug in the numbers into calculator to see how that will compare to what I am currently riding. Having said that, I spoke with guys at Avenger and they recommend 58cm frame for because of the stack numbers. I asked to let me know what would be height be from the floor to the top of the bar (shifter hoods) without any spacers. That will for sure help me select the size.
It's Triban Rc520 size L with the most aggressive setup possible :)))
-
Okay, so my build is finished. Just quick update from my perspective. I build the bike myself, like the others and previous Avenger Shuttle SL. I'm having Tagoola Pulse 50UL and 1x12 SRAM AXS with Force shifters and the rest is RED. As I will probably use XMCS crank, I bought the tripeak 3 in 1 BB. In general, i had no issues with cables, or with BB or screws, or honestly with any element of the frameset. Assembling was pretty easy and fast, I did all based on the R8-RS user manual. Only one elements is missing in the user manual, the screws and elements that holds the upper bearing or I haven't seen it. The routing with the Y bar was a pleasure and there is only one way of going thru. Those two pieces are very easy to connect. Top cap is pretty funny and with unusual shape. I'm wondering if 4 Nm and enough for handlebar and fixing screws. I will check and verify that on the ride today. I didn't encountered any issue with the headset play. I used 4 Nm for the top cap as adviced. No information what should be the tightening power for the handlebar and stem. Seatpost and clamp the same, no issue, Nm as in the manual. I didn't cut the seatpost. For the axles a used 10 Nm at the moment. I used 4 cm of spacers so 8 of them, not looks very bad, of course without any of them is the best. However, as I mentioned previously, after calculation I have the same level as on my shuttle. For me the comfort is the most important, I will survive how it looks.
I will prepare some reel and post on my instagram of course.
For now the weight is less than 7 kg in size 58, with pedals, bottle cages, garmin and varia mount.
I am at such a loss putting the fork and bars together. i have no instructions and can't seem to find the manual online. any chance you (or anyone) can tell me where it is. ps-pretty sure they forgot the bolts to clamp the bars to the stem...but that is just one of my problems.
-
just saw your post with the cockpit drawing(where did you get it??)..im a dummy. though, i am def. missing some bolts:
-
I'm after 5 rides, and that includes one race. I have no issues with the headset, I did all based on the manual, so as follows, expander 10 Nm, screws and cap bolt 4 Nm. Usually it's around 5 Nm, sometimes it's 6 Nm. I have never seen more than 6 Nm for the carbon handlebar. I checked the values on my two torque wrenches. I attached the screen and my photo of the bike. I used 4 cm of spacers so 8 spacers. Are you sure that you assembled the spacers correctly, and the handlebar is properly connected/inserted. There are some holes and pins. The metal spacer/washer should go on the cable port grommet, it's not in the manual. Lastly, maybe the fork was not cut properly ? There is no space of too much space? Could you provide some photo of the bike and the space between the fork/spacers ?
Pretty sure the space is enough. I have 5 mm as shown in the first picture meaning 1 mm of space left when removing thickness of the expander (1 mm) and top plate (3 mm). I can put a small item <1 mm inbetween when it's mounted. Another sign there is enough space, I bent the top plate due to overtorquing, so the limit is not the screw, not the expander but the top plate is warping. What I do not understand is that I do not get the bearings to bind when torquing to the max. The pressure against the inner race of the bearing should make it bind at some point but it doesn't meaning that I have no preload. This is drving me nuts. To be sure it's not the fork length, I added a 3 mm carbon spacer (equal to cutting the fork 3 mm) and it is the same. As shown in the last 2 pictures I have 4 mm of space left (8 mm-1mm expander-3mm top plate). Then I also tried to change the metal spacers position, first I had one in position 1 and one in position 2. I put both in position 2, thinking maybe the lower spacer was rubbing against the frame (even though the direction was completely free and without noise) but it didn't change anything.
-
Just for others, the short manual how to assemble the handlebar. The manual is also attached to my previous post, but I added it here one more time. Regarding the geometry, the most important is that is not correct! You should reduce 3 cm from the stack, it's lower! I can show you the numbers later. That is why I have 8 spacers so 4 cm instead of 2 spacers as I assumed! Some quick update before some final review. Bike is really great, I was on the race in the mountains, Tatra Road Race, ~82 km, 2300 up, no issues. Conditions so the weather was really terrible, so wind and rain, and I felt very confident on it.
-
Question now that my frame is travelling and it should arrive in a matter of weeks (I guess): how is the brake hoses routed? I see the headset space is ony in the front then i guess the channel is in the frontal part of the Y stem, but then how's the passage from the stem to the handlebar? Was it difficult to route the hoses? Thanks!
-
It was one of the quickest cable routing in the history, honestly. It's quite easy, as the stem and the bar are two elements. You can firstly go through the first element, and then through the handlebar. The channel from the rear brake is also a standard one, the frameset are very well made, no sharp edges, all is great so I can say that without a watch it took me around 90 minutes to assembly the whole bike. I was rather not in a rush ;) Have a look on the manual I had attached, it's really helpful.